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-   -   Shorai (http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=842758)

Tomane 11-20-2012 07:13 PM

Shorai
 
Just bought shorai for 990 2009 adv. 2 weeks ago along with $80 charger. Will not crank bike. Charger does not give any error codes. Any suggestions besides buying new OEM battery?

herrhelmet 11-20-2012 07:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tomane (Post 20087636)
Just bought shorai for 990 2009 adv. 2 weeks ago along with $80 charger. Will not crank bike. Charger does not give any error codes. Any suggestions besides buying new OEM battery?

Variables include incompatible battery output (make sure it is the correct one. Extreme low temperature and very high viscosity oil both making it hard to crank. My guess is just the battery is undersize.

cjracer 11-20-2012 07:29 PM

If it's that new. Call your dealer or Shorai about a Warranty Claim. Info is on there site.

New they should be 13.5V + out of the box.

First try is the weakest.

Crank for 8 seconds,

Wait for 30 seconds,

Try it again.

This works 95% of the time when it''s 40F and colder to fire of an 950 sitting outside at camp overnight.

Tomane 11-20-2012 08:03 PM

It is the correct one. Very disappointed.

Honkey Cat 11-20-2012 09:21 PM

Battery
 
Has shoria also, it was junk. I bought a braille lithium one which rocks. Car went dead and it started my civic no prob.

K2m 11-21-2012 04:10 AM

CJ Racer is giving you very good advice

In really cold weather, I turn the lights on for a couple of minuets. Turn them off then start easy. These battery's are different from anything else. I will never use anything else now. Do you have a multimeter?

dezracer 11-21-2012 09:52 AM

I have Shorai and it has been flawless. I tried a Braille regular battery and it died in 9 months. Go figure....

ebrabaek 11-21-2012 02:30 PM

The Lithium Ion Battery's need to be waked up in cold conditions, prior to start. As mentioned above.. Light on, or any other draw for 15-20 seconds...... Still no go.... Defective battery.

K2m 11-21-2012 08:44 PM

There is a spring, same as an oil seal spring, around the starter sprang clutch. When that fails it feels like a gutless battery. The clue is the noise, a loud clank. Just saying :1drink

dirtdiver 11-21-2012 09:34 PM

I just had a warrantee claim with Shorai.

The good: they will work with you.

The bad: they are disorganized and haphazard.

They do understand batteries in their customer service group.

DD

genghis9021 11-22-2012 04:50 AM

Shorai, Braille
 
The Braille batteries have been de-constructed in a number of threads here, including this one - it's made by Eastern Penn (think I have that right) but Braille charges a HUGE premium for a battery you can buy elsewhere.

The Shorai's "SEEM" to fail early, if they fail. Mine failed in Uzbekistan with just 6 weeks on the clock. A royal PIA in a country where 2-wheel transport is almost completely absent due to Glorious Maximum Leader President-for-Life Karimov's insistence (he's apparently been told that THAT is the way a suicide bomber will deliver his end . . .)

Once I got back to the US (after nursing the bike with a Chinese-clone of a 25-year old Russian battery and then a 5AH Yausa to Ulaan Bator) . . . they eventually got my warranty battery to me after many emails and phone calls. (FWIW, I wanted but couldn't get delivered an Anti-Gravity battery with much better numbers and better tech (cylindrical cells vs the prismatic in the Shorai, among other things)). The Anti-Gravity is now in the bike and . . . no problems and starts easier and with less needed "warm up" than the Shorai, ever.

The story I was told about my failure was allegedly due to a problem with Japanese parts due to the tsunami. I remain a supreme skeptic of the story and would not take one of their batteries on a solo ride thru remote parts (the only kind of rides I do). My education is in Electrical Engineering though I focussed on signal processing, not circuit design.

All of the advice regarding their cold starting issues is good, true and reflects ALL Lithium Iron batteries.

Good luck.

Head2Wind 11-22-2012 10:46 PM

Genghis,

It made me sick when you told me that the Shorai had failed on your trip. I have to say that of all the LiFePo batteries that are available on the market, the Shorai have had some issues, however I can say the same for others as well, unfortunately yours failed when it should not have. I have not experienced the Anti Gravity batteries yet, I believe that they are using A123 cells, but am not sure on that. I have just picked up a new cylindrical multi cell battery by Alien Motion (AM12) for my 950 EFI project, so far price and build quality are good. Time will tell if it will put up with the abuse of the 950. The Shorai in the 690 saved my bacon this summer where I was forced to repeatedly run the starting motor while troubleshooting a intermittent miss fire/stall while in the middle of no where trail. I believe that had the LA battery been in the bike still, I would have been attempting to push start the 690 on a very tight/technical trail... almost impossible.

Regarding the Braille batteries, you are correct that these batteries are OEMed by East Penn Batteries. I believe that East Penn produces quality batteries, however there are and have been failure problems with the battery when in the 950/990. IMO Braille is a very over priced marketing company, plain/simple.

It is technically possible to place a management module into the case of the Shorai for example, as there is extra volume within most of their cases to accommodate extra bits and pieces.

I have experienced either directly or indirectly about 5 failures of Shorai batteries, of these 5 batteries, 3 failed as a result of deep discharge. In all cases, Shorai worked with the customer to replace the batteries.

I believe that any LiFePo battery will have problems if the regulator gets wild with the voltage, which considering the VR on the 950/990, it can happen. The Shinden MOSFET VR is a excellent alternative that will ensure that the system vDC never exceeds recommended levels of a LiFePo battery.


Personally, I am hoping for a LiFePo starting battery with a BMS with protection and active balancing of internal cells. If I use batteryspace.com as a guide to cost, then a BMS with current limiting/protection, it will add about another $150 to the battery.... Additionally, of available tech from batteryspace.com as a guide, the BMS unit has a 100 AMP output limit. The starting motor in the 950/990 pulls about 300 amps peak. This is not to say that the technology could not be designed and applied to this application. Some time ago I probably could have designed and created this system, but my skills are very rusty in this area so I'm waiting for some other group to make it happen :deal

genghis9021 11-23-2012 04:22 AM

AntiGravity - cylindrical cells
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Head2Wind (Post 20101575)
Genghis,

It made me sick when you told me that the Shorai had failed on your trip. I have to say that of all the LiFePo batteries that are available on the market, the Shorai have had some issues, however I can say the same for others as well, unfortunately yours failed when it should not have. I have not experienced the Anti Gravity batteries yet, I believe that they are using A123 cells, but am not sure on that. I have just picked up a new cylindrical multi cell battery by Alien Motion (AM12) for my 950 EFI project, so far price and build quality are good.

Ken, you know I've got no beef with you. You're on my recommended list on my blog and your jet kit makes my 950 purr AND give excellent economy (40-45 MPG, even on days when I didn't exit third gear !).

A123, which just filed Chapter 11 made a point of using prismatic cells. That was their "edge" as they originally saw it. AntiGravity does not use prismatic cells.

LKN4DRT 11-24-2012 02:11 PM

I have an Anitgravity in my 950 now for a few months and really like it. It sits for weeks and turns over faster than the Yuasa ever did. The terminals are really nice on it compared to Shorai. I have a 690, 530 and 450 all with Shorais. No failures so far but when I thought one was not holding a charge they replaced it without any questions. The discharge was an electrical problem from water in the Trail Tech headlight switch. With 9 batteries in the garage I am always moving the charger to keep ahead of dead batteries.

Deepc 11-25-2012 12:04 AM

I have one in my 05.5 950 and it cranks like a champ hot or cold. No problems since I installed it a year ago. My only complaint is the price.


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