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-   -   Immobilizer woes (http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=843656)

Martynho 11-25-2012 03:03 AM

Immobilizer woes
 
I have had some real issues with the immobilizer on my 2010 ADV990R. We have had little joy out of the KTM dealer to determine whether it is the antenna, ecm or the key barrell sender that is faulty or even how to configure any one of those units to each other if we replaced one.

I dont want to replace all 3 (plus having to changes all the keys, gas caps etc. I have also lost faith in the immobilizer system, fortunately it shat itself here in Santiago and not in BF Bolivia.

I remember reading a post somewhere where they mentined an 08 ecm as they didnt have immibilizers. So we swapped out the ecm today for one straight off an 08 990S, with no antenna fitted and it started straight up with no reconfiguration of the key. :clap

Can we load a 2010 R map onto an 08 ecm and just be done with it, and in the process remove any immobilizer?

Appreciate any guidance

Cheers - Martyn

dmn0507 11-25-2012 07:58 AM

I don't know if a 2010 map will work in a 2008 ecu, most probably not, but you can take a 2008 map and copy the tables from a 2010 map with TuneEcu.

Bronco3738 11-25-2012 05:34 PM

Maybe ask in the TuneECU thread, there is a lot of knowledge there. If you find the answer please post it here. I do know the ignition and fueling tables are different. People have copied and pasted the values they wanted off different generation maps with great results. Good to know the ECM will work on different generation bikes, never liked the immobilizer.

Jaimoto 11-26-2012 02:45 AM

Martyn,

Sorry to hear your still riding the Duke. You want to learn, again in the TuneECU thread, if it's possible to get rid of the immobilizer through the tuneboy software so you can keep your ECU. that would be sweet.

two trackin fool 11-28-2012 01:54 AM

Wow It is just crazy the problems with this immobilizer ! My bike was locked out the day I brought it home from the dealer . I rolled it out of the trailer and nothing !!!

Only to find out the dealer had left all three key's tied together with on on the ignition !? Easy fix once I contacted the rite people ~ in this forum ~ .

The dealer was NO help on a Sunday BUT one would think they would know to seperate the keys all they told me was DO NOT use the orange key !!!

Well that didn't help things at all .:lol3

Any way I am Subscribed !!!!!!!!!

Martynho 11-28-2012 03:20 AM

Eliminated the immobiliser!
 
We sourced a new ECU for a discount goodwill price from the KTM dealer, and they agreed after some discussion to put the 2008 software and map onto it so that it would not look for the immobiliser. They weren`t keen at first, the KTM software asks for the bikes VIN number so we provided them with another 2008 bikes VIN so they could do it ticking all the factory`s boxes. I did ask if we could load up a 2010 map but the way they do it I was told it would also load the 2010 personality module and it would then look for the immobiliser

And it works! :clap

We have eliminated the immobiliser! It has no sender unit fitted and we did not have to do any reprogramming of the keys. Hey I can even ride it with the cool orange key now I guess :rofl

I rode it home last night and it felt ok, I did notice it backfiring lightly on the overrun occasionally

So. We now have a 2010R running on a 2008 module and fuel map. Maybe it will just run fine? Going to run it for a while see how it goes. What do you folks think, any issues ahoy?

Meanwhile my friendly neighbourhood mechanic is going to source the tunesECU cable and we are going to start playing to see how we can load up just the 2010 fuel map without buggering up the (non) immobiliser settings

I notice Violator has posted a similar thread and I am in the same place as him. I have been up and down parts of the got tunes thread and it was waay over my head, and my mechanic is not too familiar with it either.

We have some learning ahead....

Martynho 11-28-2012 03:25 AM

Same part number!
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Bronco3738 (Post 20116405)
Maybe ask in the TuneECU thread, there is a lot of knowledge there. If you find the answer please post it here. I do know the ignition and fueling tables are different. People have copied and pasted the values they wanted off different generation maps with great results. Good to know the ECM will work on different generation bikes, never liked the immobilizer.

Interestingly, the "2008" ECM part number we got was the the same as the one we pulled off my 2010

Jaimoto 11-28-2012 04:45 AM

Finally she's running, that's great news for you, your bike and specially for Claudio, no more stress for him !!
We need to compare our bikes, mine is a 07 and runs like crap, a bit better since I added O2 eliminators, G2 throttle,...but these are just band aids, I'd love playing with the TuneEcu on mine so you better order TWO cables. A buddy from ViŮa has the cable and knows the basic stuff so we can start from there.
I'll give you call as soon as I return to Stgo.

charlie264 11-28-2012 07:21 AM

Be interesting to see a circuit diagram of both ECUís, Iím sure some electronics whiz kid could make a dongle to eliminate the immobiliser or might just be a case of shorting a couple of wires with a few resistors. If the 08 and 11 ECUís are that same then itís just going to be a different map adaptation !!! Maybe.

Martynho 11-28-2012 12:31 PM

Canbus
 
Another inmate here much wiser than I on these matters said the connection between the ECU and the antenna is a CANBUS one so a resistor wont do it.

Fitted the ECU and installed the 07 990S personality module plus of course the 07S fuel map

Have run it for 100 kms today and apart from the typical 07 throttle response, which I can live with it ran fine. It ran like a dog for the first few miles with an erratic idle, but after stripping, checking all connections both electical and physical, as well as lubing up the throttle cable and loosening up the play it has gone ok for the last 80 kms. Keeping my fingers crossed

Quote:

Originally Posted by charlie264 (Post 20133698)
Be interesting to see a circuit diagram of both ECUís, Iím sure some electronics whiz kid could make a dongle to eliminate the immobiliser or might just be a case of shorting a couple of wires with a few resistors. If the 08 and 11 ECUís are that same then itís just going to be a different map adaptation !!! Maybe.


rider911 11-29-2012 03:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Martynho (Post 20135856)

Fitted the ECU and installed the 07 990S personality module plus of course the 07S fuel map

Didnt you mean 08 ? 07 computers are different arent they?

I am looking to buy a 2011 model but am worried about the immobilizer also. I emailed Tune ecu about turning it off inside the ecu but got a very negative reply. If I'm going to steal a 990 the last thing thats going to stop me is an immobilizer!

I did find a guy who programs keys for bikes and understands the systems. He seems confident that it can be fooled or bypassed but wanted me to send him a picture of the immobilizer to see what color wires came out of it. He knew the brand of the system. Given that I havent bought the bike yet, can someone take a close-up pic of the immobilizer unit please. I believe its under the glovebox.

Given that the ecu for 08 -12 are the same it should be possible to reload the original late model computer with the 08 info without buying new ecu.

With enough heads I'm sure we'll eventually get a satisfactory fix for this piece of stupidity. Its a shame Tune ecu wont look at this.

Spark01 11-29-2012 04:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Martynho (Post 20132724)

So. We now have a 2010R running on a 2008 module and fuel map. Maybe it will just run fine? Going to run it for a while see how it goes. What do you folks think, any issues ahoy?

Meanwhile my friendly neighbourhood mechanic is going to source the tunesECU cable and we are going to start playing to see how we can load up just the 2010 fuel map without buggering up the (non) immobiliser settings

....

You not also change the fuel map but also the ignition value's.
The cams of a 2008 & 2010 model are not the same.

MAXVERT 11-29-2012 02:33 PM

How's your bike set up ?
Stock exhaust or aftermarket ?
Stock intake or modified ?

Have you adjusted the TPS and balanced the TB's ?

I would be cautious about running the '08 tune in the
later motors. As above the cams are different.

I'd try copying the newer tables into the '08 map.

While I'm not an expert with TuneECU, I've gotten my
'07 running very nicely with it's help.

I'll be in Santiago next week and my 990 with TuneECU cable
shows up the 10th. If you don't have one by then, I'd be happy to
get together and do some tuning.

Or just a day ride if you have the bike running like you want.

Twist it, Max

Martynho 11-29-2012 09:44 PM

Hi Max,

Stock intake, Akras with the baffles fitted.

I dont know how to adjust the TPS and balance the TB's. Will look into that. Any pointers to a thread or info on that?

It is running ok other than an unstable idle, anywhere between normal at times to suddenly varying wildly between 1800 and 4000.

Looks like you and your cable will be here before we can source a cable down here, and besides would be great to do it first time with someone who has tuned before. I would gladly take you up on your kind offer. Well worth a couple pisco sours and a Peruano meal ! :freaky

I have started playing around with tuneECU in the meantime to get my head around it

Will PM you with my details give me a shout when you get into town mate

Thanks - Martyn

Quote:

Originally Posted by MAXVERT (Post 20144075)
How's your bike set up ?
Stock exhaust or aftermarket ?
Stock intake or modified ?

Have you adjusted the TPS and balanced the TB's ?

I would be cautious about running the '08 tune in the
later motors. As above the cams are different.

I'd try copying the newer tables into the '08 map.

While I'm not an expert with TuneECU, I've gotten my
'07 running very nicely with it's help.

I'll be in Santiago next week and my 990 with TuneECU cable
shows up the 10th. If you don't have one by then, I'd be happy to
get together and do some tuning.

Or just a day ride if you have the bike running like you want.

Twist it, Max


MAXVERT 12-01-2012 08:55 AM

Cool,
CJ is overnighting cables to me ( one for you and one for GOTI )
and hopefully I'll have them when I arrive in Chile Dec. 5

Twist it, Max


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