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canuckle head 03-20-2013 09:23 PM

klack klack klack
 
I just picked up a 2004 950 adventure in trade. Got my new prize home and started to give it the love and attention it so badley deserves. When I picked it up it made some engine racket when cold but went away once the engine got to operating temp, buddy said no big deal had alwas done this. Not donted by a challange here I are. I found your site and began to learn about my prize. One dude talked about the oil bypass spring and it was possible here in was my answer. I drained the engine oil (way past it's shelf life) removed the offending spring, stretch,tug, pull, reinsert and assemble. Fill with 10w/50, coolant and to my suprise klack-klack-klack !!!! Again asoon as the engine reaches 100c to 110c it becomes quiet ish. So talk to my local KTM dealer... WELL COULD BE THE P47 OSSILATOR TUBE OR THE GIMSON VALVE RETURN SPRING. BETTER BRING IT IN. Hange up the phone, make note to self to find new dealer next week. I've read about cam chain tensioners and cam chains and ballance shaft interferance but it's the change in noise at temp that gets me. So next is to check oil pressure, but I think it's o.k as the light goes out after start up. One thing I did notice is that if the engine rpm is left below 1250 klack-klack-klack is back. Looking for any insight befor I tear it down to expose her shinney bits.

rossguzzi 03-20-2013 10:00 PM

Perhaps oil pump worn, slightly blocked oil gally somewhere?

Two Moto Kiwis 03-20-2013 10:06 PM

Water Pump
 
Check the oil filter for a wavey patten, could be a knackered waterpump with coolant in the oil.

When the oil warms up it flows through the wrinkly filter better than cold and your symptoms sound very much like this.

Pull off the clutch cover on the RHS and see if it looks like a Latte inside, easy to check this.

Zuber 03-20-2013 10:10 PM

Well, first off it should idle at 1400 rpm. That should help a little.

The cam chain tensioners do go bad and make a terrible noise, usually at low rpm, cold engine startup and then when the engine gets very hot. They are about $80 each and are easy to change. If raising the rpm helps but doesn't get rid of the noise, then new cam chain tensioners will probably fix it. It fixed my early 05 model. Later CCT's were made better.

There is also a torque adder loose bit on the clutch, but it usually doesn't make much noise. Noise is while under way.

There is also a clutch on the starter motor that makes a horrible noise, but only on starting. The early 04 models did not have this.

Lots of discussion about this.

gunnr 03-20-2013 10:38 PM

My 06 was doing the same thing. Cam tensioners were klacking due to low oil pressure until it warmed up. Although my light was not coming on. I replaced the piston and spring in the pump. That fixed it. I wished I would have replaced it when I replaced the waterpump.

Apple Jam 03-21-2013 03:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gunnr (Post 20998018)
My 06 was doing the same thing. Cam tensioners were klacking due to low oil pressure until it warmed up. Although my light was not coming on. I replaced the piston and spring in the pump. That fixed it. I wished I would have replaced it when I replaced the waterpump.

07, same story.
Just did the CCTs, not too hard. Oil pump rebuild is next.
Along with valves and fresh plugs.

It's my first time this deep into the beast.
So far, it's all straight forward.....

gunnr 03-21-2013 05:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Apple Jam (Post 20998530)
07, same story.
Just did the CCTs, not too hard. Oil pump rebuild is next.
Along with valves and fresh plugs.

It's my first time this deep into the beast.
So far, it's all straight forward.....

Yeah it's pretty straight forward once you get to the motor.....:thumb

canuckle head 03-21-2013 08:38 PM

The next step
 
Thanks for the info. Like I said the next step will be check the oil pressure both hot and cold. It only has 31000k but might have been riden hard and put away wet ? I did change filter when it was appart for the bypass spring but did not pay attention to the pleats (coolant in the oil).Still stumped about the noise going away with engine temp, you would think that as the oils becomes thinner things like the hydraulic assisted cct would leak worse and the noise would stick around to continue to irritate. Will keep you posted.

pdxmotorhead 03-22-2013 04:08 PM

My experience is that dry sump systems start low gain pressure then level off.. DOnt know for sure why,, but I fiddle with sprint cars and they all start out at 70lbs,, go up to about 100 then level back to about 85.

Of course the engine builder causes most of it, by setting the relief on the pump and it depends on how thick of oil is in there to start with...

Dave

GZERO 03-22-2013 05:49 PM

i can bet your timming chains are the culprit, but i would start the easy way, buy the oil pump housing (it comes with the new style pressure valve) and the two timming chain tensioners, change those, if is still making noise then go ahead and change the timming chains with their guides (not that expensive) and it will be fine, make sure you do all these things which are what plagues the 950:

- Water pump (just rebuild it and start counting from scratch, they don't last long)
- Fuel pump points ( i would convert to mister bean digital board)
- Check the shift drum (by the clutch) because the pins tend to move a lil)
- Clutch push rod (upgrade)
- Torque with locktite the clutch springs (they tend to loosen)
- Torque with the correct locktite the ignition rotor bolts.
- Head bolts nuts and washer as well with correct torque
- Clean clutch oil jet
- Make sure you purge the cooling system really really well.

and i think that's all (brain tired)

good luck

Stephen 03-22-2013 07:58 PM

I wasn't gonna say anything..
 
I wasn't gonna say this, but after compulsively reading this, I just gotta.

My 04 has, since new, rattled like crazy on startup, then settled to its properly cacophonous symphony of mechanical bliss before it's even warm enough to drive. It still does. All the pre-06 ones that I've been around do. It doesn't bother me. In fact, I like the clackalacka better than the constant whirring of the later bikes. Not that it ever bothered me riding my friend's 06 around Idaho. I reckon it's just different ways for engines to be.

IIRC, the startup racket started bothering Pyndon, and he described updating to 06 cam-train and uprating the oil pressure thing in his epic maintenance thread.

If it really bothers you, there's your fix, but I'm not convinced the noise means anything is wrong. If mine blows up I guess you get to laugh.

Oz Nutter 03-24-2013 06:39 AM

Never worried me, and I owned an Africa Twin before this.
Yes the 04 rattles, done 70000kms still rattles, no worries, ride on

GZERO 03-24-2013 08:05 AM

just so you guys know, i have change many timming chains that rattle a lot, and after doing so the bikes had more power.
Why is this you ask?
easy, when a chain stretches the timming goes off by a few degrees at the most, but those few degrees makes you loose a little power.

Bugman98 03-24-2013 06:58 PM

I have an 04 950 that did this. It would make a lot of noise, and after about a year of being told the noise was "normal " the oil light started coming on when the engine temp was hot. i figured that was not normla! I replaced the entire oil pump (spring, piston, housing,etc) for about $60 and it solved all my problems. The engine still clakety claks but its not nearly as loud.

canuckle head 03-24-2013 09:00 PM

double stack
 
So I tested the oil pressure and it's 28 psi @ idle and 48 @ 5000 (hot). After poking around a bit I removed the rear cct and noticed two copper washers stacked under the retaining nut. I checked the cct and found oil bypassing the plunger so will order a set on tuesday. I assembled the engine with only one copper washer under the nut and flashed it up. The klack klack klack is gone, so that much differance in depth must make just enough change for the tired cct to stay in contact. I'll work my way through the rest of my list and go ride it after all my parts are in. Thanks for the helpfull hints!


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