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Old 04-29-2010, 02:42 AM   #40
Beastly Adventurer
Joined: Nov 2006
Location: On a RTW ride - currently SE Asia on the way to OZ
Oddometer: 5,427
Originally Posted by The Griz
How's about don't bitch about the functionality of a web forum. The tools are there for a reason: to make corrections and add things as needed. Maybe you and Booni should just wait a bit before replying instead of being all white on rice with the reply and complaining about someone using the tools provided.

No need for a dyno. I read the meter while riding under actual conditions. I adjusted fuel air mixture with needle size and jet sizes until I was sitting at 14:1 on the meter. 14:1 felt and worked the best for economy and power. IMHO, a fuel/air mixture gauge is far more accurate than a dyno. Dyno's and charts aren't realistic. I want to set up the fuel/air mixture while riding under loads and conditions that I will likely encounter during use. Not in a lab on a treadmill.

I never claimed I'm extremely "versed" on the topic. I simply have experience with it. You're the one who calling people "clueless". I'm just stating the facts and my experience.

Exactly what I said earlier. Repeat.

Agreed. Optimal and safe sometimes fall at the same ratio though.

Anyway, enough of this. Truce my friend.
Your offer for truce is nice, but that's not how discussions work. I am not attacking you personally (well, maybe poking fun a little bit ) but mostly addressing the incorrect information that you are posting. If anything I am saying is wrong I would be glad to have it pointed out to me so I can learn something, too. But if you keep posting bullshit, I'll keep calling you on it.

As for the editing function on ADV - this can be both a blessing and a curse, which is why you will see many forums that don't have it or at least put a time limit on it. It can be very useful if you realize too late that you made an honest mistake, like posting a wrong part number or torque value, and don't want to mislead people. Or maybe just to correct a spelling mistake. But even if "the tools are provided" you should have the integrity to stand by what you said and not go back 5 times and change things as the discussion goes on. Simply make a new post for new information, or if you really must, make an editing comment on the bottom of your old post to clarify what you meant. This is the only way people will be able to keep track of who said what. Then again, can Booni and I really expect you to actually THINK BEFORE YOU POST? According to you, apparently not. How long would you like us to wait before we read your posts and reply to them?

For being an engineer (I read that in another post of yours) you sure talk funny. Did you ever hear the saying that data should be observable, measurable, and repeatable? You call a dyno and charts "not realistic", yet your butt dyno seems to be so finely tuned that it is able to produce this type of data. Amazing. Or, it simply confirms once more that you are clueless about engine tuning. Did it ever occur to you that every dyno has an air/fuel meter that is used as a basis for any adjustments made? Maximum power doesn't just happen by coincident, it is simply a matter of physics. Saying that "14:1 felt and worked the best for economy and power" is just very narrow minded. You should be adjusting your mixture dependent on load and the other parameters I mentioned before: timing, compression, N/A or forced induction, octane etc), which in turn will give you the results you are looking for.

And while your idea of "setting up the air/fuel mixture while riding under loads and conditions that you will likely encounter during use. Not in a lab on a treadmill." is cute, it somehow makes me doubt that you ever used the G2 gauge. I specifically asked you - twice - how you measured AFR, and you said that you "read the meter while riding under actual conditions". Nowhere did you mention the word data logging. Surely you must realize that using a readout gauge - especially a digital one that will cycle between values very fast - is pretty much useless while you are riding the bike. How the hell would you completely focus on it to get any kind of useful info across the whole RPM range, while "riding under actual conditions"? For what it's worth, even on a dyno the use of a gauge is limited. While the lab conditions - you know, like, not having to look where you bike is going at increasingly fast speeds - will allow you to monitor AFR at various throttle positions at least to a certain degree, you will still miss spikes in either direction. This is why you always need data logging, and why these "not realistic" graphs are essential....
Currently going RTW on a KTM 690 Rally, trip blog:

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