Originally Posted by PT Rider
No, but try this...very carefully. When riding pretty slowly, just steer to turn. Steer left to turn left. You'll feel very tentative and have to move your upper body to the inside to counterbalance the centrifugal force. Try this too fast, and you'll end up in the weeds. Really poor way to ride, and it's all some riders know...or think they know.
Well, no matter how it is described I think we are on the same page. Many riders get through turns based more on hope and belief than by skill and understanding.
There is no way to initiate a turn on a motorcycle without moving the contact patches out from under the CG to the opposite side from the direction of the desired lean/turn. When the CG is to one side of the fulcrum the bike will lean to that side. As will any object that is balanced over a point.
Fast, slow, doesn't matter. I argued against this in a counter-steering thread, once, then observed more carefully and found I was mistaken. Physics only works the one way. The rules don't change based upon velocity.
A cycle will not turn until the bike is leaned.
A cycle will only lean by initially steering opposite in order to move the fulcrum (contact patch) away from the direction of the turn. (true even for darksiders using the wrong oil and low on blinker fluid)
If you stand beside a bike on the right and steer it slightly to the right and try to push the bike, it initially will try to lean to left as the front wheel moves to the right of the CG. Use some rope to fix the bars in place and eliminate the human factor. Video the experiment from directly behind. See what happens.
If what you are describing seems different this experiment should clear up any misperception.