The more open the road is, I prefer the Guzzi. The more there are bends and curves, I prefer the Duc.
Beautifully expressed, and thank you. Not that it really helps ... (Well, it helps my understanding a great deal; my decision, not so much.)
Steve is so right, and points to the reason why I sold my Stelvio and returned to a Multistrada. I spend most all of my weekends riding the canyon roads of the Angeles Crest where the Multi absolutely shines, and does just fine on the open road. Still, I desperately want to have a Stelvio back in the garage for the more lazy Sunday cruise, I miss the Guzzi style and motor that much, but I realize that it's just a want and won't truly fill a need. Oh well, I've done crazier........
Obviously Guzzi has far more character than a Ducati. Of course it's a lot more of that "old uncle Fred, who says "pull my finger" then farts at the dinner table", but still, they're way cool too. They even kind of lumber along when accelerating, like uncle Fred running after lighting an M-80. There is no mistaking that engine set up and I'm not sure anything quite has the same kind of "Thump! - Thump!" to it when running. Even the starter set up is a bit wonky sounding, almost as unique as a mid-60s Chrysler 383 cranking over. Sure the Ducati has the horsepower and svelt Italian race lines, but the Goose is just too cool to describe.
^ that's a good description. Having owned a number of Ducatis, I'd say a few of the drawbacks are the hit-and-miss systems that you will inevitably need to fix. Voltage regulators in 90s Ducs, Clutch masters if you like more modulation, etc. The one that just jumped out at me this week after spending the last two weeks on BMWs is the HEAVY centering that a Ducati steering feels. It does take a zip code to turn it around, but the double edged sword is that it's heavy steering when riding at low speeds, but also rock solid stable when whinging through fast corners.
I have one of each, even though they are the Odd Thomas' of both groups I enjoy them both for what they are, fun bikes. Though I admit I fit the Duc much better 30 years ago when my wife bought it for me. My Duc My Goose
Ahh hemmm, I have two krauts and two Italians. I love my GSA and I've had plenty of BMW's but the Italians give me wood.
Yes. Three Beemers and Two Ducs (all large displacement air cooled twins, so there's a pattern). The BMWs are far less fussy and get the job done. I return refreshed and relaxed after a ride on a BMW. The Ducatis are finicky, a bit (ahem) needy and you have to overlook some shortcomings. Like a shot of espresso, it's more intense but one I can only enjoy for a short time. Plus, Ducs like to be wrangled by the scruff of their necks. Love em all though.
I know the Norge hasn't entered into the conversation as it seem centered around the Stelvio, but if you're looking for a sport-touring kind of thing, then the Norge needs a close look. For me it was a choice between the R1200RT and the Norge. Actually, once I took a ride on the Norge the BMW looked and sounded pretty boring. No, the Norge won't keep up with the Multi in the twisties, but it will give the Monster a run for it's money. No, it won't do off road duty, but it easily does 200 miles before the low fuel light comes on and is comfortable for all day riding duties. Yes, the dealer network sucks, but if you are at all a DIYer, it's one of the easiest bikes to work on (valve adjustments take 30 minutes from deciding I need to do it until it's done). Granted, I have an early Norge, not the new 4-valve per head version, which I'm told is even better than the 2-valve version, but I'm very satisfied. I have done about $1K in suspension mods which made her handle like a completely different bike. Oh yes, dump the Metzlers as quick as possible for something like RoadSmarts. Guzzis get to you soul. They speak to you on a totally different level from any other bike I've ever owned. If it sings to you, you'll be hooked forever. jdg
Yes, I have also thought about a Norge. The new 8V looks really special and I have from time to time had my eye taken by examples of the previous model on the road. (Pic: autocrunch.it ) Might struggle to stay with an S4Rs in the winding stuff but I appreciate your enthusiasm. I am a bit worried about the allegedly high footpegs - like the big adventure bikes for the leg-room. But there is something particularly neat about that Norge package and it does attract. I've spent a bit of time in the Norge thread here. You sound very impressed. Interesting that you preferred it to an RT, which sometimes I think should be my choice for a "sensible" tourer.
I'll suggest that you go over to the Wildgoose Chase forum ( www.wildguzzi.com ; select "Discussion" button in left-hand column, then click the big green "HERE:" button in middle of next page. Register for that Forum (easy process), then Log In and have a look around. That's a very large, friendly bunch of Moto Guzzi riders, and new participants are welcomed. Most of the folks on "Wildgoose" (WG, as it's known) do own multiple bikes; a high percentage own bikes from several different manufacturers. Wildgoose Chase is an excellent place to ask your same questions: you'll get a lot of information, and along with some good-natured joking, you'll also get honest opinions from riders who have mostly spent lots of years on both Guzzis and Ducatis. And if you decide on Guzzi, WG is the place to get answers to your Guzzi-specific questions. Several of the very active participants on that Forum live in Australia. Most are on the Eastern side, but hey -- just a short ride across the desert ... catch a slight right as you pass Ayers Rock, then . . . There also several other tech-specific forums -- best known is www.guzzitech.com -- to help steer you through your own Guzzi-wrenching and tech decisions. Wildgoose Chase (WG) is still the best place to ask Guzzi questions when you want a lot of detailed responses from a wide range of riders. And since you asked; I've never owned a Duc, though I've ridden a few across the years. There's just something about a Guzzi, though ... they're pretty much bombproof, comfortable, so unique they are 'waaay past cool (as Peter Egan wrote, "Nearly all of Moto Guzzi models are 100% 'real' motorcycles.") A V-1100 two-valve-per-cylinder Guzzi twin is one of the few medium-to-large motorcycles on the road today that is over-engineered yet simple (air cooling that works, pushrod-n-rocker-arm valve train), under-tuned (read: long-wearing), will be worth a rebuild after its typical engine life of 100,000 miles -- and you can adjust the valves with your onboard tools, sitting on the curb at a convenience store. (Ducati owners: that is NOT a recommended Duc procedure, y'know ... except maybe at Desmo's Deli, eh? ) --mb
Yeah, I'm more than pretty happy with my Norge - that bike puts a smile on my face every time I start her up. You're probably correct in your evaluation of the RT as the sensible tourer - sort of like a Honda Accord is a sensible automobile. The RT will definitely do the job (providing the rear end does not implode on you) and get you from point A to point B without a lot of drama. But, it's almost too refined. It's very quiet and very smooth. I don't know, the Goldwing of sport touring motorcycles, maybe?? Any Guzzi is less refined - hey, it's Italian for doGs sake, what do you expect? I know some people have issues with the heat on the Norge, but it's never been an issue with me, even in the 100*+ summers, I don't find the engine heat a problem. There are a couple of things you do have to get used to with a Guzzi. First and foremost, you can't be an introvert and ride a Guzzi. Every time you park it, get gas or otherwise quit moving forward, someone will come up and ask about it, or remember their first Guzzi and want to swap stories. My personal favorite was the little old lady who looked at my Norge fondly and told me her husband used to own a Guzzi and they used to travel all over on it. I offered to take her for a ride anytime she wanted. Secondly, you won't see yourself coming and going all the time as you will with a lot of bikes. This has both good and bad to it. On the one hand, it's nice having something different that everyone recognizes as being different. On the other, it's not like you can walk down the row of bikes and ask four owners what they like or don't like about a different seat, or tuning mods, etc. You'll probably have the only one for 10 miles in any direction. Oh yes, you'll need to purchase a pair of red suspenders. Enjoy, jdg
"Obviously." Apparently "character" weighs a lot. A Griso is the only Guzzi I would buy, and best I can tell it's just a Monster with the engine turned the wrong way and a shaft drive. No thanks!
The CARC shaft drive on the Guzzi is very well done - you hardly feel the torque once you get rolling. At a stop, you do feel it when you whack the throttle, but that all but disappears when the bike is moving. I can bang through the gears in a turn and not notice it - the bike is not upset by the shaft drive at all. The funny thing about Guzzis is that if you just look at the numbers they appear to come up short. Once you get on one for an extended test ride, the numbers suddenly don't mean as much as the riding experience is really something else. Take one for a ride and tell us what you think. jdg
