F800gs - Almost perfect except for poor suspension.

i know the boingers on my 650 didn't break in till about the 2500 mi mark thats probably 2/3 road the rest dirt road and trail ----have you given your bike enough time to break-in the suspension?

There are several shops that would love to take a go at fixing your 800 forks. Honestly I don't even think that stock setups on any off road bike will be right from the factory.

Maybe send it in and try that. The 800 should have some value. After all there are plenty of clients who really want that BMW experience. I know that I think very highly of the brand even though I don't own any right now.

I say try to fix the problem and give the bike a try.

I agree that the F800 suspension is not appropriately valved for what I envisioned as its purpose. It even felt harsh on bumpy paved roads, so I am not sure what the bikes purpose is.
So I asked BMWNA via email. Their response translated was: : "thanks for your imput, we make good products, you bought it, you own it" .
These forks apparently are the same as those on 2008 Huskey 610's and there are people out there that do revalve them. Here is one, that will give a BMW a try and even add adjusters if wanted: bmxerhs@yahoo.com
In the mean time, I have been playing with springs, oil viscosity, air gap and came up with a combination that is much better than stock. Not plush by dirt bike standards, but better.
5 weight oil, I used Honda only because it was available. 70mm air gap.
I also used a Hyperpro spring, but do not think it is necessary. And because I am doing a lot of dirt, a TKC front tire. The tire does have a taller sidewall which probably contributes to the improvement, though I ran it ai street pressure. As an added bonus the plastic Klac noise went away.
Put some road and offroad miles on it and haven't found any negatives, so keeping my fingers crossed.

What do you think makes the Klack noise?
I thought it was the floating brake rotors.

I don't know the source of the noise, but I don't think it is the brake rotors. There is a lot of plastic around the front end of the bike, plus a plastic spacer and spring guide inside the fork. I only noticed it on hard impacts on the suspension and they seemed to go away with the melllowing out of those impacts.

I can't call myself a good rider, and with spending time here, I get more confused with what is exactly a good set up for a dual purpose bike, so please, help me out here. Trying to make sense of all the info.

Max444 said the GS8 have poor suspension, now compared to what? Is it poor for the average dual sport bike, or is it just plain poor rubbish, qualify it a bit more please?

I thought a good dual sport bike, especially the bigger models, like the GS8/950/990/1200GSA and so on, had to make a good compromise between road and dirt, some you win, some you loose but that's part of the game. So having the bike perform like a 250EXC it aint gonna do.

Bear in mind some people might like a bit a tweeking for their personal taste, but when BMW or KTM or who ever design the bike they must try to build a bike that will suit thousands of customers, so I can understand the difficulty.

Then, people use words to describe dirt roads as off-road,back roads, rocky parts, single tracks. When using these words I have no idea what it actually looks like where they ride, maybe post a picture where you ride, where the bikes suspension can't handle. I need to figure out who's just bitching and who actually know what they talking about. Some guys rocky up hill is another man's highway.

I also read plenty of threads in OC and my impression is 95% of people with the 950/990's don't have the slightest clue what suspension set up is, and can't change it anyway. So maybe that's why BMW went that route.

Donno, please correct me where wrong.

I will take a stab at this from my point of view. I have posted pics on another thread on the same subject http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=391785.
My intended use for the 800 was to be able to travel dirt roads irrespective of their condition. Where I live, there are thousands of miles of dirt rds along the Western front of the Sierra, that were previously used for logging, mining, forest maintenance and water projects. Many are in a state of arrested decay for a variety of reasons. There are also many paved 1 and 2 lane roads, some date from the gold mining, era that are more patch than road.
For this type of travel, the suspension should be supple enough to soak up the rocks, potholes, berms, and washouts, yet firm enough not to bottom out, and still offer enough control that the tire maintains contact with the rd.
For strafing smooth curvy rds, typically the bike is set up tauter, with heavier springs and valving with shorter travel needed.
Most bike of this sorts (most bikes in this price range period) have adjustments that allow the owner, within limits, to soften or harden the suspension to suit their needs, carrying weight and riding style.
The 800 has no front end adjustment and the valving is set up at the hard end of the scale. The valving is overly firm, totally unsuited for offroad use and marginaly suitable for a typical California rd with its tar strips and potholes. The hard suspension also exerbates a very sensitive throttle which causes unintended imputs often at unsuitable moments.
The Marzocchi forks used on the 800 are built with quality components, have large tubes and would have been perfectly suited for a bike that appears aimed at enduro type riding, if it had been valved correctly and should have had adjustments so the owner could adjust it to his or her needs.
The bike has a lot to like, and the suspension shortcomings can be fixed with $. My personal opinion, is that BMW marketed the image of an adventure bike, but thought that most of their customers would never take it off pavement and valved it accordingly. They also managed to save a few bucks in the process.

I'm sure I'm missing something in the discussion but I'll ask:
Is there some reason why an owner cannot remove the springs and replace with lighter springs, and change the fork oil to something very light?
this WILL make a huge diff.... whether or not its a GOOD fix, I dunno, but .... are the forks permanently sealed or something?

Itsatdm... any thoughts on 2.5wt fork oil instead of the 5wt? You said what you did made it better.... how much better? On a 1-10 scale of harshness I'd say the stock forks are a solid 8. Your set up? I took my bike down a powerline trail today and I've decided something's gotta be done...

"The bike has a lot to like, and the suspension shortcomings can be fixed with $. My personal opinion, is that BMW marketed the image of an adventure bike, but thought that most of their customers would never take it off pavement and valved it accordingly. They also managed to save a few bucks in the process."

+1 Even with the more dirt oriented 21" front hoop BMW knows that many owners won't take it any more off-road than any other bike. Aren't they also saving money by having the motor built in the Far East??<!-- / message -->

Not unless you think Austria is part of the Far East.

David

On your scale i would rate it a 5. If I had access to an oil that light, I would have used it. I was worried about the effects on rebound and just general control of the fork, but did not find any detrimental effects using the lighter oil.

Cool.... thanks for the info. I'll be putting some 2.5wt fork oil on order. I'll report back once I get it completed.

edit: You say went with a 70mm air gap... stock is 90mm, right?

If I had access to an oil that light, I would have used it. I was worried about the effects on rebound and just general control of the fork, but did not find any detrimental effects using the lighter oil.[/QUOTE]

ATF is about SAE 2.5, and is loaded with anti-foam agents...makes decent fork oil

Stock air gap for the 800 is 60mm

Your joking, right?

The R1200GS is taken offroad all the time around here, even with its 19" front rim, higher weight, and wider stance. Not to mention all the F650 singles, F650 twins, Xcountys, Xchallenges, R11xxGSs, old airhead GSs, and everything else. I seriously doubt BMW thought the F800GS would never be taken off pavement.

Take a look at the Touratech "End of the Rains" DVD if you don't think the F800GS is intended for "off pavement".

The reality probably is, though, that the riding represented here on this forum does not accurately reflect what the majority of owners will do with their machines. (Much like SUV's, and every "big trailie" ever made).

If you compromise too far toward the offroad end of the spectrum, you get behavior that the majority of street biased riders (which in reality are probably the majority of riders) would find undesirable.




The harshness of my suspension has mellowed quite a bit in the first 500 miles. Still not by any means plush, but also not as damn jarring over most stuff like it was. It still doesn't like sharp-edged stuff, though.

Perhaps interestingly, I found it much nicer on a backroads trip the other morning when the temp was around freezing. It did get harsher (back to "normal") as the temp warmed up later in the day. Had me contemplating actually trying a thicker fork oil.



TDM -- how much of the fork travel are you seeing used? I just put a zip tie on tonight so I can keep track over some varied terrain.



BTW, on mine, the "clack" if anything external, is definitely the rotor/buttons. I'd postulate that if you're not hearing it anymore, you're getting enough compliance on initial fork deflection to keep them from slapping.

Your insights are valued here, Nemesis. But because you don't deign to give us a clue where the f**k "around here" is in your profile, we can't calibrate our expectations. Care to clue us in?

David

http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=394192&page=13

I'm pretty sure my friends who took part in the event above missed the memo on keeping the 8GS on pavement. Other than a broken chain and one rider who was hard on clutches, I hear the bikes held up fantastic. And while we're on the subject, please join me in congratulating the US team on their win in Tunisia!

Bill Dragoo
Norman, Oklahoma