Harley Turn Signal Switch Conversion

I'd also say to give it some time. Once you get used to it, it becomes second nature.

To go back to the old Japenses system of 1 switch on the left side and not have self cancelling turnsignals would be a pia for me to deal with after so many years on HD's, so I get where your coming from in getting comfortable with a different system.

It probably does, but sometimes you don't get the chance to get used to it - you might change bikes often, you might have more than one bike, or you might work with bikes for living (it's probably no accident testers tend to hate that system more than regular users)... I don't even care which system is better, perhaps they both have something to recommend - I just care about standards. I believe control locations and their functions should be standard and uniform: on bikes, cars and in human/computer interfaces for that matter. It just makes everybody's life simpler in the long run.

The two button system has been around for at least thirty years.

The self-canceling feature showed up in the early 1990s.

My 1994 Sportster had the feature.

... ummmm ... let me think about this ... No.

How about we don't go 'round and dumb everything down to the lowest common denominator. How's 'bout people learn some skills and adapt to various things. I'm fucking tired of having to cater to stupid people so how 'bout we keep the variety and the dumb ones that can't learn go buy something else ... it's not like we are forcing them to buy something that they can't get their head around.

At the rate you're going you'll ban bikes because they are too different from cars. For fucks sake , what's next ... ban women because they are not all the same in bed.







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Nonsense. Standardising controls has nothing to do with dumbing down, unless you think that learning to do the same thing over and over is somehow smart. And I have absolutely no idea how you jumped from standard controls to banning bikes! There is a big gap between things being as they need to be in order to function, and making things different just for the sake of being different.

At the rate you're going you'll have some cars place the accelerator pedal under the right foot, and some under the left - hey, you could always learn some skills and adapt, right?

Hmmm... Once upon a time the "standard" was suicide clutches and hand shift too... Guess we shoulda just stuck with those "standardized controls" so as not to confuse people.

Advancements rarely come without the willingness to accept new things and adapt. Are you saying that we should stick with an inferior system, when something new and better comes along, just because it's "standard"? If that were the case, then we'd all be content to still be living in the stone age. Oh, wait a minute! :eek1 Stone tools were new once too, weren't they?

It has everything to do with it. You yourself have already admitted that you find variation a challenge. It impinges upon yours and others safety ( how you came to the conclusion that you can speak for others is beyond me ) should the need arise that one has to actually think for themselves ... lets make everything the same so people can have an automatic reaction limited to one and one only as it is easier ... fuck stupid people , stop trying to make everything homogeneous.

Did I mention fuck stupid people ?

You are the one that is recommending standardization because you cannot visualise that others do not have a problem with variety of control functions ... wanna ride one of the bikes here ? one is right side shift and the other has the one that was standardized in ' 75 for stupid people to keep them safe and most now only recognise.

... wanna go away and think about what you just wrote and the context in which it was presented

I'm not in the least surprised that you missed the slippery slope that you yourself advocate.

... or heaven forbid , I could just as easily choose not to buy that vehicle if I feel that it doesn't suit me. I know it may at first appear to be a radical idea this concept of thinking for yourself but given time I feel confident you'll get the swing of it. Personally I could give two fucks if the accelerator pedal was in the boot/trunk ... it's my choice to buy it just as it is the manufacturers choice to build it. Market forces will dictate if they continue to sell that variation. What I don't need is some cunt telling me I can only have vanilla because the other people are too stupid.




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Think of it this way:

HD sells half the motorcycles that are sold in the USA each year. Hundreds of thousands of motorcycles each year.

They all have the "HD system" of turn signal control.

It's not like the system is oddball or rare. It's on half the bikes on US highways!

The system works. It works well. And it's worked for decades.

So, you like Vanilla... Got it. Do you ride a V-strom by chance?

'Slippery slope': A diversionary tactic used to deflect debate from actual case to imaginary one which supports one's point. Unable to refute statement 'A', one introduces proposition 'A therefore B' and continues to argue about 'B' instead. The logical fallacy lies of course in the fact that 'therefore' part is completely unproven, except by reference to the concept of 'slippery slope' which is not a proof but simply an oratory device.
The name might also refer to the fact the technique is both slippery and sloppy - easily recognised by those able to think logically, but often slips by others, who perhaps used up most of their brain power on learning the location of various switches :)

You're hired.

I alternate, sometimes in the same day, between a Road Glide and Tiger 800. You get used to it quickly, just initiate the right turn before you start braking, which you should be doing anyway. It won't self cancel until after the turn. I'm waiting for everyone else to catch up with HD's signalling. Also wish all bikes had emergency flashers like HD does too.

That the premise escapes you is not all that surprising ... much like you pinning your hopes on the above diatribe in the hopes that it will divert attention from the other points I mentioned that would on the surface appear to be beyond your capability to reply/respond to

One of the reasons I know that you don't hold any cards and it is beyond you is in the above quote ... it makes it " simpler " for YOU , not everyone , just you.


For someone to have a fleet of vehicles such as a trucking company there is merit in standardizing the vehicles in use ... spec' them with the same gearbox for example. To limit the choice of gearboxes to just one for everyone is beyond words that you would feel comfortable reading.

Standardize all the computers that a company uses in an office setting ... yeah sure , as it may well simplify logistics.


... ask how many people here are running windows ... or explorer for a browser as opposed to say firefox or chrome ... do you advocate we standardize it to just one OS and browser ?





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You continue to blame me for words that you yourself insist on putting into my mouth. I repeat: I advocate standardising the controls, nothing else. Not the types of vehicles, not the types of gearboxes and not the types of browsers. All of that is your own invention and please stop attributing it to me.

However since you brought up software... I run Linux on my computers - enough said. Still, within the desktop environment, I do value consistency of interface, for example I expect the widgets controlling windows to be in the same corner regardless of which application is using said window. Or another example: I expect to find 'Quit' item to be under 'File' menu rather than some other location. Because when it comes to actions that rely on muscle memory, consistency is good. This, far from 'dumbing down' my environment as you suggested, allows me* to concentrate on more interesting and important aspects of the software than hunting through the options looking for the trivial functionality.
This analogy carries on exactly to the case of indicators on the bike.

I have nothing more to say on the subject, thanks for playing :)

* ... and by 'me', I do mean 'everybody', because number of studies done on interfaces confirm that is how human brain works. That too translates directly to riding, I refer you for example to Keith Code and his '10 dollars of attention' theory from his 'Twist of the wrist' - basically, he's saying you have a finite amount of attention which you then allocate to various tasks - but the more you allocate to one, the less you've got left for the others.

... so you admit that you do not have the skill set to adapt to various bikes ... that's cool , but how's 'bout you leave the rest of us that WANT variety the chance to choose for ourselves. They're handlebar controls for fucks sake , the shit isn't that hard.

Oh , and stay away from my sidecar ... it's got a foot brake pedal for the chair on the left of the bike , a brake pedal for the bikes back brake on the right side as well as the front brakes in their now customary position located on the right handlebar ... you'll likely have an aneurysm.

... bullshit ... you're still trying to work out an answer ... you'll be back




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I've never confused my Harley for my dirt bike. And I've never confused either of them for my snowmobile. Yet they all have right hand throttles. Can't say I've ever found myself lacking in variety because of this standardization.

Of all the planes I've flown, they all pull up when I pull the yoke back. I do not enjoy playing video games that reverse this, causing me to make mistakes I have to correct.

When I'm driving blind because of mud that got splashed on my windshield, and I'm struggling trying to find or remember where this particular manufacturer chose to hide the wiper switch, I sometimes find myself wishing for a little standardization, so I can enjoy the driving experience, instead of wasting my time and effort on things that prevent me from enjoying the drive or ride. Is it pull this knob, or maybe twist this other knob? Maybe it's flip this lever up, or down, or back, or twist it, no twist it the other way. Or in the case of a certain Fiat, Pull this knob, twist this other knob, and throw this third lever.

You may not know it, but there's an entire section of this forum created for folks to endlessly argue with each other. It's called CSM, in the Joe Momma section. Check it out, I think you will like it.

This winter seems to be making inmates extra cranky. Couldn't help myself.

So just to keep this on topic, I think Harley's turn signal controls are the best in the industry.

Yep.

I think we should definitely standardize on THAT layout!

I mean, if it's the best that will ever be devised it would prevent anyone from wasting their time trying to improve upon them. Plus it would just make it so much easier for everyone....