Hot weather ATGATT solutions.

Hi all, I always ride ATGATT (full face helmet, joe rocket textile suit with armored knee, shoulder, elbow,back, motorcycle boots and gloves)


Even zipped down to mesh (joe rocket alter ego suit) I am DYING in traffic. even out on the open road travelling 60-70 the heat is barely tolerable in full ATGATT,
side mounted radiators are great for avoiding stone chips and a nightmare for frying your legs (5th gen VFR)


I would like to find some alternative, particularly for my lower half which will enable me to maintain ATGATT or at least MOTGATT, without turning my legs into bacon (be it from road rash or sheer heat).

I went to the shop today and ordered the Icon Field Armor Stryker Shorts
http://iconmotosports.net/2011/04/field-armor-stryker-shorts/,

partially as part of an alternate solution and partially because I feel the hip armor in my suit is inadequate anyway. The shorts have an aramid side panel in addition to the CE approved hip armor, so they tick the abrasion and impact boxes.

My main concern is knee armor, ideally coupled with riding jeans but possibly also regular jeans, thus MOTGATT.

Does anyone use the Icon Knee/shin stuff?
How about Motocross gear?
How is the fit when coupled with full length riding boots?

Sorry for the long winded intro and thanks in advance for any input,


Cheers,

Sam

I have a mesh suit for hot weather, and some heavier gear for when it's cooler. The thing is, when it's really hot out, and the radiator fan is pumping a lot of heat out of the engine, the hot air blast on my right leg is far less comfortable in the mesh than it is through leather.

When it gets past 35C (95F) (even less if in high humidity) and you're in stop and go traffic, there is simply no solution... In low speeds mesh pants are indeed worst as the heat from the fans penetrates more easily...

Every year I set off determined to stay ATGATT for the whole summer but in the end some very hot days with lots of stops (I usually have to visit many customers) I end up going with just the helmet and gloves.

This summer I am gonna test some kevlar jeans from Polo, and these boots... Mesh jacket on top and, of course, gloves and FF helmet... A friend had a nasty accident (cager run a stop sign) and avoided the worst because of his gear so that gave me extra incentive to sweat it through and shut up...

So far the boots and jeans work fine (a little warm at the knees but not too much) but I know that the real test will be during August...

Yeah, I was going to say that mesh pants are not always the best solution for bikes that give off a fair amount of heat. My old FJR was more comfortable in hot weather with non-mesh pants due to the heat from the radiator.

My current bike is a BMW RT and it doesn't send off a lot of heat. Mesh pants would work fine but my mesh pants were cut off me last year by paramedics. I was riding on a 95 degree day and had a serious accident. That mesh gear saved me from a LOT of pain and misery. The back armor saved me from a snapped spine when the bike landed on me.

I currently use a mesh jacket but non-mesh pants. The Aerostich Darien pants haven't been as horrible as I feared they would be in extreme heat. I may splurge for Motoport pants at some point but right now, I think I'm fine without them.

Well i'm going to pick up some EVS motocross knee armor and run them under some double front carhartts and see if things improve much.

Half the issue with the overpant in terms of heat is it is OVER another layer...

I certainly hear your concerns.

I run a mesh jacket and pant. They come with liners for rain/wind/cold as needed.

Varies pairs of gloves as needed; mesh summer/lower protection ones defiantly get worn.

Yes I get hot..


What I find interesting is that often in the summer when I occasionally wear shorts + the bike pants, I feel the engine heat more than jeans + pants. The rest of the legs are cooler from airflow, but net effect of heat it worse.

To summarize -- layering obviously keeps summer heat in, but can also keep bad heat out.

As a result, I just wear what I wear based on daily plans and deal with the heal accordingly. Stopping is terrible, but when mobile things aren't bad. You know this; I just haven't found a good way around it with out removing armor.

Now that I have been entirely unhelpful, carry on....

this is what i wear in the summer...it isn't too bad as far as heat goes. i wouldn't want to go for a jog in it, but even at slow speeds, it is not unbearable and at highway speeds it is actually pretty comfortable even at 95* and high humidity.

i consider it (at least close to) ATGATT, but some might not.

on my feet, i wear smartwool socks (don't let the "wool" part fool you...smartwool socks are great in hot weather) and fox comp 5 shorties (half height MX boot).

between my feet and waist, i sometimes wear a base layer of underarmor heat gear (meaning "designed to keep you cool" gear) tights. sometimes, no base layer. no base layer is a bit cooler, though the UA does a great job of wicking and does not add too much heat. however, i like the base layer as it prevents the straps on my knee/shin guards from irritating my skin.

then, i wear alpinestars reflex knee/shin guards and alpinestars bionic freeride shorts (with CE rated armor...similar to what the OP described). over that i wear duluth trading company firehose cargo pants. they aren't leather, but seem like the would provide decent abrasion resistance (i have not had to test them, though), and they breath better than even regular jeans...and certainly better than leather. (also, the bionic free ride shorts have hard armor over the hip/quad area where much road rash seems to happen...and the tailbone)

(duluth firehose clothing is made out of the same material they wrap firehoses in to keep them from getting destroyed when being dragged around on pavement and run over by cars. it seems pretty similar to carhartt stuff, but is more supple/comfortable and breathes better, imho. it's not leather, but definitely way tougher than regular jeans.)

on my top half, i wear a long sleeve underarmour heat gear shirt with an alpinestars bionic II "jacket" (really a zip up compression suit with CE rated armor). if it is really hot out and i am not going to be riding at high speeds for long, i just wear a loose fitting synthetic t-shirt over the bionic II "jacket".

if it isn't terribly hot, i wear a firehose jacket over the bionic II for extra abrasion resistance.

the bionic II with just a shirt over it does leave a few small areas open to possible road rash, but the shoulders, elbow, forearms, back, and chest (i.e., most likely road contact points) all have good, hard armor on them that is tightly held in place. further, this set up is very cool (temp wise, not fashion wise ). even sitting still at red lights, i don't get *too* hot. and moving at any speed above 15mph or so is no problem at all.

what made the biggest difference for me, though, i think was starting to wear my MX helmet and goggles instead of a full-face street helmet on the street in the summer. yeah, my full face helmet (which i what i wear on the road in cooler weather) does provide better protection, but the MX helmet with googles is still pretty good protection and *waaaaaaaaayyyyy* cooler for me. and your head is key in regulating your body temp, so a cooler helmet will make a big difference.

ymmv, of course. but, for me, this set up is way cooler than leather. i like the compression suit over an armored textile jacket because i think it will keep the armor in place better. also, all this gear doubles as decent off road gear, so i have one set of gear that works pretty well both on and off road. er, well, i have crash tested it (more than once) off-road, and it definitely has done the job there. fortunately, i have not crash tested it on the road (and hope i don't), so i can't really say how it works in a road crash. i think it would give pretty good protection, though, and i know it is not nearly as hot as leather.

(and, no, i don't work for alpinestars...it's just that, when i was looking for this stuff, they were the only ones i could find that that had shorts with hard armor instead of just foam and the only compression suit i could find with CE-rated armor.)

(also note that i ride a DRZ and it does not generate much heat on my legs like some of you guys are describing with other bikes...though i think the firehose pants might actually deal with that OK, but i dunno.)

Living in Honolulu, we have nothing BUT warm-weather riding that sometimes gets a bit TOO warm for comfort, my kit:

Vanson fully perforated leather jacket, Mesh Joe Rocket Alter Ego pants, Arai XD3 helmet for visor-shade, SIDI Vertigo-Air boots and perforated gloves. Used a Silver Eagle Cooling vest on a desert-crossing a couple years back - expensive but it worked GREAT, but isn't nearly as effective in the tropics ( too humid ) or for short-hop riding.

OP--Joe Rocket non-mesh jackets (even those with the removable mesh panels) are notoriously hot.

You need to get a FULL mesh jacket but I would keep wearing regular pants -- as already noted mesh pants are actually hotter than non-mesh.

Wear as little as possible under your gear -- sometimes on really hot days I've worn just boxers under my riding pants and just a small undershirt under the jacket.

Before you leave, you can soak a rag in water and put it down the back of your jacket.

Other than that, when it's over 95, you won't find me riding. If it's too hot to ride with gear, it's too hot to ride.

keep your head cool and you won't worry about your arms and legs so much.

Check out the LD site - www.ldcomfort.com

Read the section about riding in triple digit temps. It is the way to go, even if you don't use the LD clothing.

What section is that? They have a very '90s website.

The section on "Use", and in the FAQs, the section 'best way to use a long sleeve top in hot weather', which is quoted following.

I use LD undergarments, and UnderArmor 'Heat' undergarments. I have found the LD advice to be worthwhile with their stuff, but have no financial interest in the vendor.

"Controlling your exposure to the elements is most important when riding a motorcycle and especially so on a longer trip. The LDComfort long sleeve top can provide you with everything you need for helping you ride in 100 degrees and 50 degrees. Simply put on the LDComfort top and your other layers (a NON-mesh jacket is best) and enjoy the trip. Temps down to 50 degrees are not a problem depending on the wind proofing of your outer garment. Many riders wear a heated jacket over their LDComfort top. Riders can ride in freezing weather with little to no trouble when properly outfitted.
Temps reaching 100 degrees are also not a problem when handled correctly. The high heat is where many riders make mistakes and place themselves in danger. The LDComfort long sleeve top can be used as a cooling garment to help you ride in temps up to 120 degrees - 49 Celcius (Tested). Pour water down the sleeves and into the neck of the LDComfort top. Zip up your outer jacket and ride with a little bit of air entering at your sleeves. That air will be immediately cooled and funneled into the main part of your jacket so you can ride in a bubble of cool air. Keep that cool air around you by making sure not to open all your vents.
Here is a big secret. DO NOT WEAR MESH when the temps get past 100 degrees. There is no control of the airflow and soon you will exhaust all the cool air. Think of this: You are riding in your car with the air conditioner running. You are comfortable. Now roll down all your windows and let out the cool air.
Happy now? Same thing when you ride your motorcycle."

basically they are advocating evaporation, which is pretty much the only way to cool yourself once the air temperature is higher than your skin temperature (roughly 93 degrees, not 98).


See this following article from the Ironbutt Magazine: http://www.ironbutt.com/ibmagazine/IronButt_1002_62-66_Hot.pdf

Depending on your jacket, you'll probably need a vent or two open to get the evaporative effect, regardless of what the LDComfort people say.

They do recommend having venting. Loosening the sleeve cuffs (although that only works if you are using shorty gloves), and opening the jacket front zipper about 25%.

I loosen the sleeve cuffs (carry several styles of gloves) and open the front zipper a little, and the back vent zippers about 1/3. Works for me, traveling through Texas in the summer, for temps up to about 105. Higher than that, I move my travel to the nighttime hours. YMMV.

I agree with a previous poster that mesh pants don't work well in stop and go traffic. I wear non-vented, waterproof pants when traveling, and control my body temperature via the upper core. Evaporative cooling works for me, and the thicker material of wool or LD Comfort garments means longer times between replenishing the water.

In addition, I have ridden on some bikes (which shall remain nameless, but were sure-fire 'ham cookers') that gave off so much heat at 80 degrees and 60 mph on the highway that I felt like I needed a full-length oven mitt on my right leg.

I got some Fieldsheer kevlar lined jeans and I was worried that they would be too hot, but they were fine in Palm Springs traffic at 90'F.

Just make sure you get them a little large and baggy.

Further internet research led me to this conclusion:

http://www.canyonchasers.net/reviews/clothing/carhartt.php

This evening I purchased a pair of black double front Carhartts.

I cannibalized an old Joe Rocket jacket that I had hanging in the closet for the elbow armor, ( I have knobbly knees).

With some massaging (read, exacto-knifing). the openings at the bottom of the double front were enlarged to fit the elbow armor. After stuffing the armor up inside and making sure it wasnt twisted or folded, I stitched the opening closed to its former width so the armor couldn't fall out.

I consider these to be a happy medium between ATGATT and NOTGATT and will use them mostly for commuting and town work as I feel the Joe Rocket pants are still superior in terms of abrasion resistance.

I will report back on their usefulness soon.

Hey, ph0rk, thanks for posting that link. That made for some interesting reading, and now it makes sense to me why I usually felt like I was cooler underway with a crudely vented patrol jacket than with my mesh jacket.

I just wear all of the gear and not think about the heat.

After a few wrecks I won't even think about getting on the bike without full gear. Last week it was in the low 90's and I rolled up to a non-rider friend. He typically asked me how I can stand to be in all that gear? Simple reply, it's better than the alternative. And if you haven't experienced the alternative I can post up a few photos for you all.

Something like this might help...
http://www.aerostich.com/aerostich-evap-o-dana.html

Never tried it myself but been considering it.

I regular bandanna soaked in water would probably work as well. I like this one because it holds ice.