Tet

Craftycoder, I'm going to try and address your question. I need to go back to some things that BlueLghtning touched on first.

BlueLightning said something to the effect that an initial goal of Tet was to connect to Jellico TN, the start of the TAT. That is kinda sorta true. It was the initial goal of the Twvt to connect to Jellico, and also the works of Rob23(TNJT). That would provide a coast to coast DS avenue if you include the TAT. That has been done, published. Tet was born from those acts. To another point that you mentioned, alternate routes, I whole heartedly agree. The Twvt has quite few of those and it has worked well.

Craftycoder, to the direction of Tet, I have never pushed a direction. What I have done is helped some individuals realize from concept an idea made real. Again the name Rob23, someone that I hold in the highest of regards, had published the concept of the Trans App Trail. NorthernTraveler picked that concept up and ran with a fervor, with the graces of Rob. It seemed natural to him, for many previously defined reasons, to use that concept as a “backbone”. I jumped on the train, as well as a few others. We have spent the past 18 months pouring over maps(hard copy and digital), wearing out tires and sprockets, sharing e-mails, sharing PMs, sharing forum posts, and generally living eating and breathing this stuff.

We have a backbone that will be published. Does it go where you want it to go? Obviously not. Can it go where you want it to go? Absolutely, but to incorporate any alternates or changes into this release would require more time than I think we have. Nothing would excite me more than for you to prove me wrong on that point, I mean that in all sincerity.

I again stress that this will be a HUGE file. That is not a complaint that this is too much work to be done, although I do welcome and will certainly accept some of the help that has been offered. The job at hand, right now, this very minute, is how to package a file this size. That very subject will have a tremendous impact on the evolution of this project.

It's not about where I want it to go. I don't have an opinion, BUT if the stated goal is to get to the Keys it makes sense to start heading that way by the time the road gets to Georgia. At least it does to me.

Is this where you draw that conclusion from?

Gosh, I don't know where I got the impression. I have it in my head that the Keys were the goal. I've seen mention of it a few times in this thread. I'd rather the goal was Apalachicola personally. I don't have any great interest in rolling all of Flatistan twice but I would like to run TET and past up to Halifax. Whatever the goal is, I would like to see that it is done as best as we can figure. As I'm a Georgite I feel a greater responsibility for my neck of the woods. If the Keys were the goal, I would vote to aim for a different route south from the Carolinas, if the Keys are not the goal then skipping most of Georgia isn't a big deal at all.

There isn't a rule that says TET needs to hit any extremes of the continent or anything. It's not like Jellico or Port Orford are extraordinary after all. The first rule in solving problems is identifying exactly what problem you are trying to solve. Hence my trying to clarify the goals of this project the other day. Specifically, the geographical confines of this project.

Cool, I wasn't sure what the original intent was. I think its a nice work in progress and I still see lots of potential for it.

Yeah, that might be a tough part there? Are the files getting that big already?

There has never been geographical confines on the goals.

I really like that one. I'm gonna say it again.

There has never been geographical confines on the goals.

The Twvt has reached a presumed practical limit for the average gps. It is chump change compared to this, especially if you use your imagination on the future. I will have you a draft file possibly this weekend.

Are you talking about loading the file as a whole on a GPS? I didn't think of it that way, but yeah I could see that being an issue. However, on the other side if I get a file that is technically too big to fit in my GPS (ie too many routes, tracks, waypoints, whatever), I can just copy out what I need and break it into a smaller file? That might not be as user friendly for the less technical GPS users, but its also not that hard to do.

Hmm, it is stuff to think about though.

And I'm thinkin' about that guy/gal, riding a 1200 pig or a Super Sherpa.

That is easy to get around by making it a GPS map rather than a GPX file. I've got TAT created as a Garmin Map and it has active logs from Mississippi to Port Orford plus over 2000 waypoints. That doesn't have to be a problem at all.

That certainly will make it more difficult to proceed. I don't think it's true though. Someone posting tracks of a wicked cool ride in Hawaii to this forum would be thanked and asked to move along. There are geographical confines. You may not like to limit the project, which is fine, but in order to get people working productively we need to know what to do.

NorthernTraveler certainly believes there to be confines. He didn't mean the south coast of Tasmania did he? I'm pretty sure that you are only one here who thinks this project isn't about some geographical area. If we can narrow the focus down far enough, we'll be able to get to the much more fun work of turning this project into something that any inmate can run as a summer vacation without having had to toil over making a route. That's what I would like to see, rather than these arguments over semantics that don't further my goal. I want to read ride reports from inmates who had the time of their life riding TET.

I must admit to being naive on this one, does everybody use Garmin now?

We have made plans for that, "A Hole in the Fence" and the "TetBike".

Sad, but true. He has a bad habit of stopping at oceans edge. But, the new TetBike should cure that. He gets a Limited Edition at a discount when they go into production.

No, but for those that do absolutely no sacrifices need to be made. They can have as many track points and waypoints without any cause for concern regardless of the unit (if it uses MapSource). How can that be anything but a benefit?

You know what? You win Chip, I've got better things to do than to suffer your vipe. Best of luck with this. I hope it turns into something useful. I'm out of here.

Just as a somewhat outside observer, being the 'second cousin, twice removed' kinda participant(only by riding and having fun) in some of this... I just have to express my extreme appreciation and respect to the folks that have poured their passion into this concept. The fellowship and sense of 'family and neighbor' that permeates the ADV community of inmates is an awesome thing.

Just a shout out to say thanks for your passion for our passion...

intothenew- I need a new GPS... Do I have to buy a Garmin???oser

NorthernTraveler- Thanks for putting up with my 'poor attitude' baggage when we met and rode together on that leg of the TAT!

MoBill- Still haven't met you, but still glad you are state-side and riding!


craftycoder- bye.

Hey!

I HAVE ridden on water.... on my snowmobile!

I would LOVE to go all the way to the keys.... BUT, it's a long way down Florida, and looking at the maps there are some major cities in the way. I've also been to the keys and don't remember anything but pavement there.

Would it be possible? Maybe. But lots of miles of sandy roads at best, and lots of dodging around for said cities.

If I have time one of these years to lay something out down that way, I'll try to.

In the mean time I'm glad to have something that WORKS!

It starts someplace kinda neat, it goes over a variety of interesting terrain and surfaces, and it connects to something else to carry on. So it's all good!

Here is the current dilemma, a nice one I might add.



How to package that into a cross platform file is MY current goal. That represents all of the current submissions that have active track logs. And I quote myself:

And I stress the word "active", these are not hand drawn. Better than 90% of this exists in the separate files listed in the second post. I am simply trying to consolidate as much as possible. And, hopefully we can come to terms on protocols for future development.

We may not be able to get all of this into one file. If not, publish Tet as the backbone route running North/South? Route sheets? I keed, I keed. It's a huge and wonderful file. This of course does not include any of the waypoints that have been gathered nor the routes that will be required for many to use it.

I'm pouring coffee and sodas today, non of the hard stuff. Well, maybe I will have just a beer.

I don't see why it won't fit into a simple .gpx file since such a file will hold waypoints and multiple tracks. It may be a large one but it will work cross platform. If necessary you could post in gdb format, too, for the bandwidth challenged. Or, if necessary break it up into smaller gpx files by state.

If you need or want any help with the packaging or hosting PM me --- I have the time, the online storage space and the bandwidth.

In any event, I would make no attempt to filter the tracks down to fit every GPS device. Let the folks who download the file(s) do that --- they should know what works best on their device.

And what is this talk about a gpx MAP file? What is that? Are you talking about what the Delorme folks refer to as a "draw layer"?

You don't have to have a Garmin. You can convert via GPSBabel...I'm happy to do the conversion for any of you.

ADV GPS Demographics

10% get it. They really get it. They can slice and dice any file. I love those guys.

40% are proficient. They can whittle a common file to suit their needs. I love those guys.

25% are sleep walking. They can load a common file, but have little or no edit experience. I love those guys.

25% have no clue. The process of opening the file is intimidating. I love those guys.

That is an evaluation based on the people I have dealt with to date. One GPX file of less than 15 tracks, a redundant 15 routes, less than 500 way points, the tracks filtered to less than 500, and the routes containing less than 250 points seems to make things rather seamless. Just about everybody can drink that. That's just the right amount of beans in the coffee, not too strong, not too weak.

When you step away from that brew, many have issues, and that is not just the "sleep walkers" and "clueless". "Got it" and "proficient" may have a unit that requires them to carry a net book, if it requires multiple files for them to do the miles.

If I understand both correctly, the "Garmin Map" and "Delorme Draw Layer" are of similar concept. Either would be an elegant fix if they were cross platform.

If that existed, a cross platform map file, I could set down and watch football.

This tirade that I have been on is meant to be controversial, and get some people to think. I'm thinking of everybody on that demographic list, this all may be in vain. But know this, I love you all.

I'll send you a copy AugustFalcon.

Coffee? Juice?

Just wanted to let everyone know why I have not added anything to this post in a while. I had been very busy with work & then This Happened

I still am working on refining my routes. It will still 2 weeks or so before I can ride again. But by then, our Christmas Tree Farm will be keeping me busy for a couple of months

The active track log on many units has incredibly more potential. 10k points on some. On most? Very few?

How many units could you possibly "inject" with one or more active logs.

How many units can you Troute fish with?