The VFR 1200 Dogpile Merged Derisionfest Thread

I'd put it this way - if you like the looks of the Victory Vision, then you'll probably like the VFR.

- Mark

Its ugly. Too expensive, too complex. Most of all- souless.

I can recall reading almost the exact same quote with regards to the '94 and '98 when they were first released....especially the "soulless" part. Anyone who has owned one of those VFRs and put serious distance on them knows that this is not the case.

This isn't entirely true, Triumph didn't axe the Sprint, the stopped making the ST, the GT is essentially an ST with a longer swingarm, a revised subframe, bigger bags and a low mount exhaust.

I'm fairly sure the ST and GT share the same frame, but other than that its still a Sprint, the ST went the way of the Sprint RS...it was updated out.

I cannot comment on GS as I simply do not like them...but to give you a bit of prospective on European side...
I do not know what sales figures say, but I rarely see easily available vfr1200 on road. In fact I only saw 2 so far.
I test rode it. Earlier I test rode 1400 Kwak (who says there is nothing from Kawasaki???). Before that my colleague bought K1300 and I tried that. FJRs tried once, did not like it (but that's my problems with Yamaha ergos I guess).
One of most important characteristics of popular bike over here is how it behaves in twisties, in dense traffic with starts-stops and of course mpg (95 now scoring 1.6 Euro per liter here!!!).
Handling of VFR - one of worst points in my opinion. I found it squishy, bad feedback and not lively enough. May be it's to do with weight. Do not know.
Second would be motor. It felt bad at low rpms for such serious displacement. Which have effect on riding in twisty stuff (thou it was not that twisty - just couple of roads between Flemish and French parts of Belgium).
And tank is too small. Add to it local factors - price and fact that Honda went half-a...ed about it and did not create localized SKU for Belgium, so we have same like french - limited to 100 bhp stock. Fortunately dealer already put powercommander on his test bike, so I did not had to ride castrated version.

There is plenty of choice in this segment - on both 2nd hand and new market. This is tough spot to get and Honda I think messed it up a bit.
Of course local market specifics also important. Such as - 120-130 kmph limits, speed cameras, etc.
In Europe guys mostly go for bikes that can be lot of fun at lower speeds and in twisty stuff. So - other sport tourers are not great sellers too...

By all accounts, the GT is ending production soon, along with the Rocket 3.

I think Honda has missed a few marks with their whole lineup including this 1200... seems like they keep trying to be just different rather than alternative and improved... including trying to create niches that really don't exist.

I think they should have stuck with the 750-800 VFR proportions and visuals... some want a smaller, solo sport tour bike with performance and couldn't care less about how they work two-up.
Add roomier, more comfy ergos, better wind protection up top and improved diversion of the engine heat and you'd have it.
That new NT is a frumpy, soul less thing with no guts.

ST's are like skinny Goldwings but more top heavy.... FJR or C14 are far more attractive options in that class, IMO.

Well, you may be right. But its still ugly and expensive.

bluesman,thank you for your european perspective...
For I disagree with you on one account when you say that is why sports-tourers don't sell nowadays.
The reason they don't sell in big numbers is that the O.E.M.'s don't make any sports-tourers anymore...!
Except for the K1300S...
The last real sports-tourers and they sold reasonably well over the years were the VFR800 and R1100S...
Wish Honda and BMW would have brought modern successors !
Connies or FJR's are realively fast and powerful in a straigt line but in the twisties they suck...
Too heavy,too upright,too far away from the frontwheel to qualify for the name "sport".
But I guess the new VFR doesn't hold the joker either with it's obvious flaws...

This sums it up: http://www.vfrdiscussion.com/forum/index.php/topic/69020-sales-success-of-7th-gen/page__st__4

You must live under a rock with a Roundel on it. The Hayabusa and ZX14 have been out for several years now. Slap on some bags and voila, instant sport tourer. Go ride them and get back to us before harping on, and on, and on about the K1300S.

Much as i love the VFR12 - i know this'll hammer it into the ground like a tent peg..

Fullmonte,ever rode a Busa or ZX14 on backroads?
No sports at all !
And in a straigt line a S1000RR will eat them alive and is just as "comfortable"...
Today those Busa and ZX14 Bahnburners are pointless.
Not as fast and fun as the superbikes in the twisties,almost as uncomfortable and slower than a S-RR on the Autobahn/Dradstrip...
The K1300S at least has shaftdrive,rack/factory bags and little quicker handling than those ZX14 and Busa buses.
Which it's shorter gearing quicker roll-on,too !
If it had to be japanese I would get the VFR over Busa or ZX14.Shaft,ABS and factory bags because even the soft at the bottom VFR12 is more than fast enough for the street.
Especially since we have no Autobahn here in the US it doesn't matter if it "only" goes 155 when you already go to jail at 100+...

in this 2011 shootout they choose the fz1 and ninja over the 1300s, suzy 1250 and vfr.... makes sense to me to choose one of those unless you need shaft drive........ all have plenty of motor for mere mortals... and they're soooo much cheaper to buy than the bmw... and maintain....

http://www.motorcycle-usa.com/9/11120/Motorcycle-Article/2011-Road-Sport-Shootout.aspx

Did I mention that you don't feel any engine heat?

Zero.

lvs..that is why I don't give a hoot about the journos who are mostly paid off...
The K1300S is way sportier than the VFR with much quicker engine and faster steering like I found out for myself on a testride.
My buddies Z1000 Ninja is not particularly sporty in the twisties either...Wants to stand up and needs a lot of handlebar pressure if you want to go attack the twisties.But that might be down to the stock Bridgestone tires who are definately not as good as a set of M5 or Rosso2 I run on my bikes...
Anyways I won't buy any and hold off for some more suitable for my taste to excite me enough to open my wallet like I have before for my choice of drug...

Damn just when I'm in the mood to look at the Rocket 3 Roadster.

Sports tourers up to 1000cc don t sell . Vfr1200 is not attracting ex cbr1100xx riders , they are just keeping their rides. The k1300s is a better bike, I sold the vfr1200 for a k1300r- much more fun and better range

Well, I do not know if they do not sell for one or another reason...but I am telling you what I see.

On road from my house to supermarket we have 5 (!!!!!) speed cameras. Check speedcam map of France. Check Netherlands...

Here is result. Anything over 200 kg and over 1000 cc becomes pointless. We all try to have fun on roads, where speed limited by rider ability mostly. I seen sport tourers of the past and rode with them in Alps and Dolomites and I must tell you - they were exhausted while few of us riding R100R, big thumpers on supermoto wheels, naked bikes and even dual sports were having huge fan.
This summer we rode in Austria with group of guys and even K1300 was handfull. While (believe it or not!) Vstrom 650 was at it's element.

Worst thing (humiliating) I remember was french guy pn 600 something supermoto overtaking couple of UK riders (part of our group) on Superblackbirds - and this is after week of Alps, they thought they were pushing it....

Combine speed control, bore of European highways, fuel price and fun factor - you have the picture.
Last summer I did not see much of sporttourers on Stelvio, Actually they were very much minority. I did not see one on Sardinia trip this time (well, one of us rode FJR and yes, it was handful). But I saw shedloads of supermoto-hypermoto etc., full blown sportbikes and quite a few dualsports. Specially on stelvio - GSes outkitted for at least Paris-Dakar, without scratch or dirt ridden by nice guys in new clean expensive gear
No offence, but one of friends in our group (riding old Tenere 660) started to laugh
Riders usually are nice people thou. Friendly and open.

Can't resist. Sorry.

R1100R never won any popularity contest here. Busa, VFRs, Superblackbirds, big Kwaks etc. were popular about what seems to be just few years ago. But now it all changed. I do not know why. Really. No proof.
This part of Europe - idea of sporttourer is abovementioned big Kwak, VFR, Blackbird, K1300.
French police (national guard) ride FJRs and they do ride like gods. In any traffic. Tight stuff. Here some Belgian police ride Pan Europeans - and they handle them superbly. I think generally 99% of riders (me too) can do much less than bikes. Busa always was a bit of holy cow here, thou yes - not recognised as quick handler.

I would be very interested to know where the original poster got his info as Triumph seems to be making regular updates to the Rocket 111. As a Roadster owner I recomend you move your schedule up just in case though.

Regarding the VFR 1200, I have to admit to seeing none on the road, and only new and one used even on a dealer's floor. The road tests seem to say a lot of what's being said here - expensive, ergo's of a sport bike, weight of a tourer, etc. IMHO the looks are polarizing. The quality is great, but it comes across as excellent execution of a faulty idea.