Brake Proportioning Valve users?

[Pago Cruiser]

Anybody have any comments about these? Want to put one on my KLR Hack, and it seems there are about 3 dozen types on the Summit Racing site. All I wanna do is turn down the intensity of the hack brake, as the disk is larger than the KLR rear, and the brake continually drags me to the right (hack side). I'm assuming a 1-in 1-out model, with a knob to dial in the braking force you want?

[MojaveSidecar]

Hi Pago

I know in the Designing ...KLR thread...

CPES provided the following link...
http://www.summitracing.com/search/P...%20valve&dds=1

However, in my recent dealings with Dauntless... it was decided I would go with the sidecar brake tapped into the rear KLR brake system... and the way they recommended to do it was to send me a double banjo bolt for the rear master cylinder... where sidecar and rear brake are siamesed off the same output...

I got to thinking..... but this is proforma.... since my rig is still under construction, so I have no practical feedback, but anyhow,.. that....
by drilling out one set of the holes larger versus the other... that I could get very close to the ideal setting where both the rear and sidecar brakes lock up at the same time,,,

no more margaritas for me to night

[cpres]

That is a great link that I thought would be of some use, I would buy a single in and out. The kicker is you will need to cut a line or a hose to get it installed so you need to figure out which of the valves has fitting sized in a manner that it will be easy to get hooked up. I know that on the Ural rig I ride the balance between the rear brake and the hack brake can easily be tweeked with the adjustments at the drums and it makes a huge change for the better if you get it tweeked just so.

[claude]

see stockcar products.com ...get the one with the knob on it. Still not a huge fan of sidecar brakes in most applications though.

[MojaveSidecar]

Originally Posted by claude

see stockcar products.com ...get the one with the knob on it. Still not a huge fan of sidecar brakes in most applications though.

As a noob, I be interested in you feedback about the pro/cons of sidecar brakes..

[claude]

Originally Posted by Randy from Burbank

As a noob, I be interested in you feedback about the pro/cons of sidecar brakes..

Some of us who have been around this 'sport' for a long time learned without sidecar brakes and still have some feelings about having or not having them that will cause some disagreement with others. I do not want to say sidecar brakes are a bad thing on many rigs but they can have their quirks.
On rigs with lighter sidecars and smaller tires sidecar brakes can be quite varied in their effectiveness, consistancy and so on. A rig such as this will brake pretty darn good without a sidecar brake once the rider gets used to it. With a sidecar brake braking can be drastically affected by weight in the sidecar and whatever loading is pplaced on the sidecar as well as surface conditions. With small narrow tires a sidecar brake can lock the tire when empty but may have traction when a passenger is on board.
Heavier rigs are more consistant than light ones.
With that being said let me say that I am speaking of the perceived 'need' for sidecar brakes in a panic situation. THAT is when we want consitancy and THAT is when a sidecar brake can exhibit the least consistant effectiveness.
We all need to practice to get to know what our rigs will do when hard braking is called upon. If any inconsistancy is present that we cannot control within our skill envelope we may very well have a problem that is not within our control no matter what our skill levels may be. To get to know our equiptment we need to have equiptment that will react in some form of consistant fashion.
I could easily sell new people to this sport on sidecar brakes without much effort at all. In some case we do present a good case for them but in many cases we feel it may be best for a person to get to know their rig without a sidecar brake and then make a decision whether to add one or not later on.

How the brake is hooked into the overall scheme of things can also make a difference.

Some plumb the brake into the front brake of the bike. Without going into a lot of rambling here let it be said that in most all case I don't care for that.

Many plumb the brake into the rear brake of the bike. This is far more common and is more acceptable for most applications.

Which ever method a given rig has on it still should be tested by the owner so he or she can get a handle on what that specifc rig will or maybe will not do under hard braking under different road conditions.

Some bikes have intergrated brake systems on the bike. These rigs will react differently than those with 'normal' braking systems.

Case in point: Bike with non integrated brakes and sidecar brake plumbed into rear brake of bike. Many will pull to the sidecar side if only the rear brake is hit. If only the front brake is hit the rig will pull left. If both brakes are hit it will stop straight. But if this type rig has a light sidecar and skinny tire and no passenger hitting the rear brake may not pull it to the right as the sidecar tire may lock up .... or maybe not. YES, all of this can be adjusted for by the rider but it can take practice.

Some use a self contained braking system whereas the sidecar has it's own master cylinder and pedal. This system can be a good one if setup correctly. We like to run a seperate pedal for the sidecar over and under the brake pedal for the bike. This sidecar pedal has an adjustment on it so you can adjust how much brake bias goes to the sidecar brake when the bike's pedal is depressed and when. Pretty simple really. If one wants to use just the sidecar brake they can do so by moving their foot over onto just the sidecar's pedal.

A rig with no sidecar brake will typically always pull away from the sidecar under braking as the sidecar wants to keep it's momentum up. Thsi can be predictable and corrected for by the rider.

Heavier rigs or rigs with larger tires do very well with sidecar brakes under most conditions. In the wet things can be a little iffy but that is true with about any setup as it is so much related to what traction is available. Wide tires can be an issue in and of themselves in the wet dependant upon conditions.

If you are an agressive rider in the twisties take note that once a sidecar tire is unloaded or maybe hovering above the road surface in a turn toiward the sidecar it may no longer be spinning due to some brake drag or your foot resting on th ebrake pedal. If too much pressue is on the pedal it can be a little bit of a shock when the sidecar wheel comes back down to earth upon exit of the turn.

The technique of working the front brake and throttle together in turns toward the sidecar is a good one but can go out the window if the sidecar brake is plumbed into the front brake or if the rig is affected by a bike's integrated brake system.

Yes, there is a place for sidecar brakes. I am not solidly against them at all but it is a fact that no matter which braking system a particular rig has practicing hard braking is essential to get to know that rig. So many brake discussions seem to get into statements being made as 'absolutes' when in reality we can be comparing apples to oranges at times. One statment which is seen from time to time is " well it is better to have the brakes and not nee dthem than to need them and no thave them" . This sounds godo on the surface and looks goos in print but the real deal is taht whether you have them or not it is essential to practice with YOUR rig so you will know what the brakes will do for you or against you when that ol' reaper sticks his ugly head into your path.

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