ADVrider

Go Back   ADVrider > Bikes > Orange Crush
User Name
Password
Register Inmates Photos Site Rules Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 01-18-2011, 12:07 PM   #16
Suncruiser OP
and Adventurer
 
Suncruiser's Avatar
 
Joined: Nov 2009
Location: Nelson....... New Zealand
Oddometer: 233
Update

Ktm accept the issue to be under warranty and are putting together a new ignition/immobilizer with a new set of keys. been told they outsource the key cutting so it might take a little longer. lucky there's still a few months left in this summer.
__________________
Good to be out there riding.
Peru to San Francisco 2011/2012 http://allthoseroads.wordpress.com/
Oz 2010 http://helmutgottschalk.wordpress.com/
2010 Adventure 990 R
Suncruiser is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-18-2011, 12:45 PM   #17
Schlug
JockeyfullofBourbon
 
Schlug's Avatar
 
Joined: Jan 2006
Location: put something on and stay in that position.
Oddometer: 7,171
Quote:
One ride on a DR,KLR,XR will promply put an end to your interest in simple bikes
I believe there are many inmates who would beg to differ with you.

When bikes become too clever for they're own good problems like these arise.

Anyway, at least the OP got his problem sorted. Too bad he spent his holiday with a trailer. Sounds like his dealer did the best he could but KTM might offer a little more support in the future?
__________________
"So what makes this protest different is that you're set to die, Bobby?"
--May well come to that.
"You start a hunger strike to protest for what you believe in. You don't start already determined to die or am I missing somethin' here?"
-- It's in their hands. Our message is clear. They're seeing our determination.
Schlug is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-18-2011, 01:04 PM   #18
Killer Whale KTM
Life is the adventure!
 
Killer Whale KTM's Avatar
 
Joined: Oct 2003
Location: The Mountains of Jasper GA
Oddometer: 712
I wonder how all of these new so called dual sports like the Yamaha,Ducati,Triumph etc. with all the traction control, key fob's and electronic gizmo's will do in the market and on the trail ?!
IMHO they are going in the wrong direction. For instance, I loved fuel injection after switching from carb's.............until it started "acting up" !
Technology is great when it works......or........even if you can fix it, but when it breaks..........
Killer Whale KTM
__________________
Friend:"That ain't no dirt bike,it's a damn whale!" Me: " It may be a whale, but if it is, it's a KILLER WHALE !! "
Killer Whale KTM is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-18-2011, 01:33 PM   #19
lemieuxmc
Banned
 
lemieuxmc's Avatar
 
Joined: Mar 2009
Location: East La Jolla... it's just Clairemont!!
Oddometer: 3,360
"faulty immobilizer antenna"

"malfunctioning brake servo motor modulator"

"defective alpha wave transmogrifier"

And some people think my Norton Commando is hard to keep running in top form.
lemieuxmc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-18-2011, 01:53 PM   #20
catalina38
Contrarian
 
Joined: Oct 2006
Location: Stingray bay CA.
Oddometer: 1,525
Quote:
Originally Posted by BobbySands View Post
I believe there are many inmates who would beg to differ with you.

When bikes become too clever for they're own good problems like these arise.

Anyway, at least the OP got his problem sorted. Too bad he spent his holiday with a trailer. Sounds like his dealer did the best he could but KTM might offer a little more support in the future?
I bet that in 5 or 10 years we will look back at these bikes and be saying how much better and simpler,powerful and fun they were. The new bikes will have become much more complicated,power restricted, speed limited,emissions controlled to save us from our untrustworthy selves.
__________________
A mangy man chasing a cautionary tale

KTM 990R 500EXC
catalina38 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-18-2011, 02:03 PM   #21
Suncruiser OP
and Adventurer
 
Suncruiser's Avatar
 
Joined: Nov 2009
Location: Nelson....... New Zealand
Oddometer: 233
What I'd like

What I'd like in a bike is the fun factor of the current 990 r, the reliability of a hammer and if things really do go wrong I want to be able to fix them myself on the road.
I'd love to take my 990 r to africa and south america, but I don't want get stranded there with no support or weeks to wait for a fix. come on, who needs an immobilizer in an adventure bike with no workaround possible?
__________________
Good to be out there riding.
Peru to San Francisco 2011/2012 http://allthoseroads.wordpress.com/
Oz 2010 http://helmutgottschalk.wordpress.com/
2010 Adventure 990 R
Suncruiser is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-18-2011, 02:29 PM   #22
catalina38
Contrarian
 
Joined: Oct 2006
Location: Stingray bay CA.
Oddometer: 1,525
Maybe the TuneEcu thread can find a way to disable it.
__________________
A mangy man chasing a cautionary tale

KTM 990R 500EXC
catalina38 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-18-2011, 02:48 PM   #23
Chuckracer
Jerkus Maximus
 
Chuckracer's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2007
Location: Lowville, NY
Oddometer: 7,269
Quote:
Originally Posted by Killer Whale KTM View Post
I wonder how all of these new so called dual sports like the Yamaha,Ducati,Triumph etc. with all the traction control, key fob's and electronic gizmo's will do in the market and on the trail ?!
IMHO they are going in the wrong direction. For instance, I loved fuel injection after switching from carb's.............until it started "acting up" !
Technology is great when it works......or........even if you can fix it, but when it breaks..........
Killer Whale KTM
Yep, I agree with that. Look at modern cars and trucks. Now the Check Engine Light come on and your off to the dealer. You can't fix these things. You're not supposed to.
Bikes are following that model and going the same way. Too bad. It's the end of an era.
__________________
2005.5 KTM 950 Adventure
2001 Scorpa SY250

Chuckracer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-18-2011, 04:45 PM   #24
GoNOW
Beastly Adventurer
 
Joined: Feb 2006
Oddometer: 1,440
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chuckracer View Post
Yep, I agree with that. Look at modern cars and trucks. Now the Check Engine Light come on and your off to the dealer. You can't fix these things. You're not supposed to.
Bikes are following that model and going the same way. Too bad. It's the end of an era.

As an ASE certified mechanic in fuel injection, I can tell you that is bogus in most cases. I can plug in my $80 code reader into most cars and tell you a wealth of information in seconds. Look up the code in the service manual and it will tell you exactly what to replace and how to do it. Lots of EFI trash cam out in the 1980-1990 that gave EFI a bad rap, but the new stuff is a walk in the park.
GoNOW is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-18-2011, 07:09 PM   #25
Chuckracer
Jerkus Maximus
 
Chuckracer's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2007
Location: Lowville, NY
Oddometer: 7,269
My carbs don't throw codes. They just work. But if for some reason they don't work right, or I want to change they way they work and I'm NOT an ASE certified mechanic with a code reader, I can still fix or adjust them. No trip to see you required. No appointemnt, dropping off the bike, picking the bike a week later and hoping it's fixed...etc.

This is just my personal angle, but I don't have a KTM dealer within 250 or more miles, so it's all down to me. Less electronic BS, the better on MY bike.
__________________
2005.5 KTM 950 Adventure
2001 Scorpa SY250

Chuckracer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-18-2011, 08:04 PM   #26
GoNOW
Beastly Adventurer
 
Joined: Feb 2006
Oddometer: 1,440
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chuckracer View Post
My carbs don't throw codes. They just work. But if for some reason they don't work right, or I want to change they way they work and I'm NOT an ASE certified mechanic with a code reader, I can still fix or adjust them. No trip to see you required. No appointemnt, dropping off the bike, picking the bike a week later and hoping it's fixed...etc.

This is just my personal angle, but I don't have a KTM dealer within 250 or more miles, so it's all down to me. Less electronic BS, the better on MY bike.

You seem to have missed my point. Or I didn't make myself clear. Also, I am speaking of automotive in general. Motorcycle EFI is having some growing pains and like OBD1, it's different for every manufacture, so it's a bit of a pain to work on. But that will change for motorcycles like it did for cars.

I have have/had many bikes and quads with carbs over the years. My 950 has carbs. They work, but I still hate carbs. Want some examples from the past 2 months?

1986 GL1200 Goldwing: Carbs are so hard to get in and out, I will never get it to run, just right, because it takes 45 minutes to extract them. It's missing a bit, but it's good enough so I am leaving it.

2001 Ninja 250 (the gas guzzler) How can a Ninja 250 get 30MPG? Don't know, but this one does. I replaced every jet and spit shined the carbs. It's still running rich. I have to run the mains 2 sizes leaner just to get 50MPG.

Kohler 2 cylinder 25HP engine. It just formed a hole in the brass float and hydro-locked the engine. I took out the spark plugs and cranked it and got showered with fuel. That could have been really bad (aka, BOOM). I have had the carb out of this engine at least 15 times last year.

Honda FL250. Won't idle when warm. Swap carbs with another one, works great. Can't see anything different between the two carbs or why it won't idle.

Yamaha TW. The new gas has eaten all the seals away from the carb. So it seeps fuel. And it does not like starting on the electric starter, but the kick start works great.

See why I hate carbs? Anything EFI (admittedly, I have only worked on EFI cars, no bikes yet) tends to be very simple to fix. Plug the scan tool in, it tells you what is wrong, then you replace that. Trained monkeys (aka, certified auto mechanics) could do it. If no codes come up, you have live information on what exactly is going on that will often tell you what is wrong.

My point being, you can fix modern cars yourself. Don't let the computer stuff scare you. It's easier then working with stupid carbs.
And I can't wait till motorcycles get generic DLC connectors so I can plug any old scantool in and get codes. It will happen.
GoNOW is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-18-2011, 08:10 PM   #27
catalina38
Contrarian
 
Joined: Oct 2006
Location: Stingray bay CA.
Oddometer: 1,525
The new tools like TuneEcu are quickly changing the ability of owners to diagnose and repair their own bikes
__________________
A mangy man chasing a cautionary tale

KTM 990R 500EXC
catalina38 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-18-2011, 08:39 PM   #28
nomad guy
A legal alien
 
nomad guy's Avatar
 
Joined: Oct 2008
Location: Stranded in Berkeley, CA
Oddometer: 790
i remember how in the beginning of the 90's we started seeing more and more electronics coming into heavy equipment e.g CAT, J.D, CLAAS, NEW- HOLLAND, CASE etc.
the old mechanics that didn't want to adapt or were just to lazy or scared to learn said: "that this is the end of the industry and nothing would work. nothing is reliable as steel."
they said the same thing about can-bus when it was introduced. sure why dont you try finding a short circuit in a 45 wire harness bandle with 7 multi conectors along the way.
sure the electronics had some childhood problems but in general electronics are more reliable and easier to fix then the mechanics.
not to mention the performance in every field they are introduced to:
hydraulics, engine controllers, controllers in general.
how many of you whiners want to have points instead of an ecu.
saying all that i am riding a carbureted 04 950s .
__________________
Cheers
Guy

04 KTM ADV 950S GO!!!!!
09 KTM 690 ENDURO R
nomad guy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2011, 09:48 AM   #29
Head2Wind
MotorcycleMayhem
 
Head2Wind's Avatar
 
Joined: Mar 2006
Location: NorthWet Washington
Oddometer: 2,469
to continue the EFI or not discussion

I agree that the 'management' systems on a machine that is supposed to be 'worldwide adventure ready' should have better in situation overrides or limp modes to enable the owner/rider to continue operating the machine. I see this as one of the main design failures of the current 'management' systems. One of the others is related to the EFI system itself, and in some respects is the heart of it or at the very least a critical component, the filtration. Aside from the tendency of the OEM maps to cause abrupt throttle response and in some cases poor fuel consumption, the high pressure fuel system should be at minimum a 50,000 mile serviceable item. Example: My 94 Subaru Legacy Turbo has 240000 miles on the original injectors, I just replaced the inline fuel filter as a mater of 'well I should do that at some time' after 160000 miles of use... and the in tank fuel pump and intake filter had ~160000 on it before I replaced it with a 255lh high performance pump. Point being is that the well designed 'modern' EFI systems work for a very long time and in most cases do so with little to no problems.

Personally I prefer 1s and 0s when it comes to tuning, but there are challenges present there that good old analog (carbs) systems do really well. I ride a 04 950 w/ carbs. It runs well and I usually don't have problems with it. Yes, sometimes simple is better, but I believe that a EFI/ECU managed engine can be a better solution provided there are failure modes and/or overrides that will allow the rider to at the very least get to a place where repairs can be made.

__________________
“The mind is sharper and keener in seclusion and uninterrupted solitude. --- Be alone, that is the secret of invention; be alone, that is when ideas are born.” - Nikola Tesla
2006 KTM 970 frankinADVsmSD
ADVmachines™ Proven Solutions for your Worldwide Adventures...www.ADVmachines.com
Head2Wind is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2011, 03:30 PM   #30
GoNOW
Beastly Adventurer
 
Joined: Feb 2006
Oddometer: 1,440
Quote:
Originally Posted by Head2Wind View Post
Yes, sometimes simple is better, but I believe that a EFI/ECU managed engine can be a better solution provided there are failure modes and/or overrides that will allow the rider to at the very least get to a place where repairs can be made.

Agreed. To win a bet, I had a mid 2000 Honda Accord V6 running on just 2 cylinders and with every sensor unplugged but the crank position sensor. There is quite good fail over/limp home modes in modern cars.

In contrast, most 1990s cars are not failure tolerant. Unplug the MAP sensor and it won't run. Motorcycle EFI tech seems to be around the 1990s right now. Give it time.
GoNOW is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Share

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

.
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump


Times are GMT -7.   It's 10:34 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.5
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ADVrider 2011-2014