Another alternator hits the dust and not under warranty

[LukasM]

Originally Posted by Oso Blanco

I emailed Ricky Stator yesterday to see if they'd be interested in rebuilding and selling F series stators, hopefully with more power. I haven't heard anything back yet.

I have talked to Rick's (Motorsport electrics), and so has somebody else on F800riders. They are willing to do it and would simply copy the stock configuration. I think it's $145 which includes return shipping:

http://f800riders.org/forum/showthre...sed-Durability


In Europe, there is Carmo in the Netherlands that does rewinds for the F-series:

http://www.carmo.nl/index.php?main_p...roducts_id=752

[TheCowboy]

OK, now I am freaked out. My wife (F650GS) and me (F800GS) are leaving on a 6000+ mile trip in a few weeks. I've got 45,000 miles on my F8, she has close to 30,000 on her F650. We don't need no stinkin Alternator to go out on this trip. Maybe we will just take our trusty DR650's - they don't break.

TheCowboy

[mrmrva]

This is really pathetic from BMW, if it is known problem there was enough time to find solution by now. I guess they just don't care.

[TheCowboy]

I am guessing that if I pull the cover off and inspect the windings it should tell me if she is good to go or not. Any thoughts on that? I don't want to blast off on a 6000 mile trip with windings that look like they have been dipped in tar.

TheCowboy

[EnderTheX]

Originally Posted by Cowboy2

I am guessing that if I pull the cover off and inspect the windings it should tell me if she is good to go or not. Any thoughts on that? I don't want to blast off on a 6000 mile trip with windings that look like they have been dipped in tar.

TheCowboy

One thing you could try is to check the output of the alternator using the method described in this thread: http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=685465

If your alternator is weak it may be showing lower voltages... Joel said something about 18 volts but I have heard conflicting numbers. If I remember I will go check out what my new alternator is putting out when I get home and post it up here tonight.

I'm not sure if the problem can be detected before failure or not... Worth a look though!



FYI... my alternator went out at 17,000 miles But it was replaced by BMW under warranty and ran fine on my 3k mile trip I just got back from

[C5!]

Originally Posted by mrmrva

This is really pathetic from BMW, if it is known problem there was enough time to find solution by now. I guess they just don't care.

I don't know; maybe they have been designed for cold Northern climate. We would have to see the correlation between all the alternators which failed in what kind of climate they are riding. for one I ride in the tropics, and I think ender is in Texas, also a warm weather area... I think chitown as well ?

[JRWooden]

Originally Posted by C5!

I've asked for it, ...If you want serious reliability meg / hot test, dip it again and bake it again if your really hard core. DONE

and yes it is pretty depressing to see this happening at 21000 miles!! not being recognized by bmw and even worst when it happens in the middle of nowhere!

Thanks C5!
It is a huge disappointment that the OEM unit seem to be so under-designed.

[ragtoplvr]

I am sure the alternator failures are caused by using the wrong oil. You know Dino oil does not carry away heat as well as synthetic, and if you put BMW on the can, it is even better.

Seriously, the varnish can darken and the wires can still be good. A heavy varnish coat can contribute to heat build up.

When an air cooled alternator stator goes bad you can hear a whine from the shorted turns. I wonder if anyone has noticed a difference in sound before a failure.

those who get them rewound, as for the highest temp magnet wire you can get, It does cost extra.A single thin dip of vanish is all you want.

Rod

[C5!]

Originally Posted by Cowboy2

I am guessing that if I pull the cover off and inspect the windings it should tell me if she is good to go or not. Any thoughts on that? I don't want to blast off on a 6000 mile trip with windings that look like they have been dipped in tar.

TheCowboy

I don't know about that. I saw the stator of a 2008 F800 (the Street one) at the bmw shop, it was pretty dark but the technician told me it was OK. What I would consider is installing some kind of voltage sensor to alert you when it suddenly dies, so that gives you a few hours ride to reach a shop or a safe area somewhere before you are completely stranded when the battery dies... I will do that.
Someone on this forum suggested this one http://signaldynamics.com/index.php?...hk=1&Itemid=77 , any other options?

[Gangplank]

Is this a known problem? This thread is the first I have heard of it. 13,500 on mine....

[C5!]

here is the stator "rewired"
supposedly with high temp wires and glass-type resin.
we'll see what happens when installed

[LukasM]

Originally Posted by Gangplank

Is this a known problem? This thread is the first I have heard of it. 13,500 on mine....

From what I have seen I would say the average life expectancy of the F-series stators is around 30-50k miles, with a few exceptions on either end (more seem to die earlier than survive longer).

[ragtoplvr]

Not to raise alarm but looking at your picture of the rewound stator, there is enough varnish that the space between the poles is filled.

Harley Davidson used to attach the leads between the poles and fill the space with epoxy. I have seen 100's of Harley stators where the poles with the epoxy failed, from the extra insulation of the epoxy. The newest versions use a different lead attachment system.

The purpose of the varnish or resin dip is to keep the wires from vibrating and failing. A thin coat does this just as well as a thick one. Where an alternator is exposed to water with road salt, like on cars, the thick dip is often better, Enclosed in a crankcase, water should not be an issue and I personally would prefer a thin Dip

Now this is NOT a HD, so maybe it does not apply, It will be an interesting experiment.

And I only know about HD

Your stator may be fine, the wire used might be higher temp than BMW used, and the thick varnish may not be an issue. But if it fails again, opt for thinner varnish coat.

Rod

[C5!]

Originally Posted by ragtoplvr

But if it fails again...

Rod

Noooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo !

[C5!]

Got the bike back from the dealer yesterday.
Rode only about 5km back home and just by curiosity touched the alternator cover once parked, and couldn't even touch it so hot it was... would that be normal? Left the bike in the garage and came back an hour later and the cover was still hot. Obviously not as hot as initially but still... As in the past I never worried about the temperature of the alternator I never took notice of that and don't know if that is normal... but coming out of that experience, and about to start another 1000 km trip, I am a bit worried. Should I? on a "normal" bike, does the alterator cover gets as hot? and keep so long in dissipating the heat once stopped??