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Old 01-11-2012, 08:23 AM   #61
Baja Designs
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Hey WHYNOWTHEN, actually I believe that may be possible, can you give me the exact year and I can check it out for you.

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Old 01-11-2012, 11:25 AM   #62
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2008!
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Old 01-11-2012, 08:14 PM   #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sparrowhawk
Great photos. Thanks for taking the time to shoot and post.
I got some more good ones (I hope) I will post them in a bit.

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Old 01-11-2012, 08:22 PM   #64
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Are they aimed similar to one another? You did have the TT light aimed considerably lower. I think the issue is how far the light cast forward as to not outrun the light at speed.
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Old 01-11-2012, 09:35 PM   #65
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More photos...

Dead end paved road. The little red dots at the center of each frame are reflectors just a bit under 2/10th of a mile away as measured by my Garmin 276C. Again, all photos were taken with a Canon Powershot G12.

All photos taken at 4sec f/7.1 ISO 500

First up, just to set some sort of haphazard standard, my truck low beam head lights. 2 x 55w:


Next the truck high beams. With the high beams the white fence the reflectors are mounted on becomes visable. 2 x 55w and 2 x 60w:


Yeah yeah, my trucked is aimed a bit the the left. For the moto lights I held them in front of the truck light which is about the same height as a dual sport. I did my best to aim each beam at the reflectors.

As before, the TT lights are first and as last time I let each beam "warm up".

TT 2" spot HID. Again the fence is visable.


TT 4" flood HID. The fence has faded a bit but this is a good broad beam pattern IMO.

Again the Canon G12 is picking up the very slight blue-ish hue in the light and making it more green than in reality. I am sure someone who knows more about HID lights and digital cameras could tell me why and how to fix it... But oh well. The amount of light and the beam pattern is accurate. The light is white to the eye.

Lastly, the Baja Designs Squadron. Speaks for itself.

traveltoad screwed with this post 01-13-2012 at 08:22 PM
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Old 01-11-2012, 11:27 PM   #66
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Nice photos TT.

Here are some preliminary (see below) lumen reports.

BD Soltek 8" driving light: 2077 lumen
BD Squadron LED: 1639 lumen

Lights were measured using a 250 watt 13.8 volt regulated supply. All measurements were taken in a darken room. Foot-candle measurements were taken at 1 degree field angle increments on a horizontal plane at beam center. Measurements below 10% of peak lumen were not included. The 10% lumen cutoff was at a 10 degree field angle for the race light and 22 degree field angle for the LED.

Interestingly, if the lumen cutoff is set at 5% the LED lumen output remains the same while the race light lumen output increases to 2500. What this means is that the race-light has a more distribution to the sides without the sharp drop off in light. Or put another way, the LED has a more focused beam. You can see that in the pictures as a bright spot in the middle of the field.

Just for fun I also measured a low cost Custom Products 4" HID. This light measured 8056 lumen at a 40 degree field angle. It also exposed a flaw in my measurements. The measurements were all taken on a horizontal line based on the lamp or beam center. That works fine for a lamp with an even (ie round) field. What was obvious with the CP light was that this method does not work with a fixture where the light output is focused into a beam that is wide in the horizontal plane and narrow in the vertical plane.

The original design was to use a stand with the light mounted on a rotary table and aimed at a light meter. This allowed me to rotate the fixture a set amount and to take a measurement. The advantage of this is the distance from the fixture to the target (light meter) remains the same. That makes the calculation and measurements easier.







The CP light, you can see the wide horizontal spread with minimal vertical spread.



The new test fixture will use a target with measurements taken at different quadrants in the beam field. That should account for differences in the vertical spread of the beam. As a side note, the BD fixtures appear to have a fairly flat field so the lumen comparison between the Soltek and Squadron fixtures should be close. Here is the Squadron field, the target board is at 20' from the fixture.



More to come as time allows.
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Old 01-13-2012, 11:11 AM   #67
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Hey MJS that is an interesting test, but unfortunately that test cannot accurately examine the true Lumen output. I know you even said that you weren't sure about the correctness of a few things, but to reveal test results with many forms of guesstimate's and preliminary forms of information isn't really fair to us and everyone else. We have thoroughly tested and had professional outside sources test our lights as well. To truly get an accurate factual output of Lumens you would need a Goniophotometer. (An Optic test, designed to measure the intensity of light reflected from a surface at various angles) Please don't take this the wrong way I am not trying to be rude or take away from your hard work, but to accurately test these lights this is what you need.
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Old 01-13-2012, 11:33 AM   #68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Baja Designs View Post
Hey MJS that is an interesting test, but unfortunately that test cannot accurately examine the true Lumen output. I know you even said that you weren't sure about the correctness of a few things, but to reveal test results with many forms of guesstimate's and preliminary forms of information isn't really fair to us and everyone else. We have thoroughly tested and had professional outside sources test our lights as well. To truly get an accurate factual output of Lumens you would need a Goniophotometer. (An Optic test, designed to measure the intensity of light reflected from a surface at various angles) Please don't take this the wrong way I am not trying to be rude or take away from your hard work, but to accurately test these lights this is what you need.
Or...

You can just get one of these lights and turn it on. The hairs on the back of your neck will raise up, the corners of your mouth will curl up, your eyes will twinkle, you will make excuses to bring your bike to work, excuses to cancel dinner plans, excuses to get home late...
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Old 01-13-2012, 11:38 AM   #69
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That is also another great option, Thanks for the support Travel Toad, you crush it
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Old 01-13-2012, 07:07 PM   #70
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Quote:
Hey MJS that is an interesting test, but unfortunately that test cannot accurately examine the true Lumen output. I know you even said that you weren't sure about the correctness of a few things, but to reveal test results with many forms of guesstimate's and preliminary forms of information isn't really fair to us and everyone else. We have thoroughly tested and had professional outside sources test our lights as well. To truly get an accurate factual output of Lumens you would need a Goniophotometer. (An Optic test, designed to measure the intensity of light reflected from a surface at various angles) Please don't take this the wrong way I am not trying to be rude or take away from your hard work, but to accurately test these lights this is what you need.
I won't take it the wrong way. I am familiar with a Goniophotometer. Actually, the turntable test is really accurate and repeatable for a fixture with an even round field. Not so accurate when the beam is shaped into a different horizontal and vertical spread. And I am not trying to determine total lumen output but rather usable output. A hageon lamp with no housing around it could have high lumen output but all the light shining to the side and back would be wasted if you only wanted to see in one direction. But that's why you spend money on reflector and housing designs, no?

If you have had the fixtures tested than you should have all of the data necessary to prepare either an Iso-Illuminance curve or better yet a Cosine Candella Plot (Cartesian Curve).

Background info with credit to the author, T Pincu.

Background:

In 1957 the Illuminating Engineering Society established a standard for reporting photometric performance of incandescent filament lighting units used in theatre, film, and TV production. That became the defacto standard for reporting performance in performance lighting equipment.

Candelas:

Candelas and Candlepower are the same thing. Beam Candlepower is Candelas in a specific direction as in a field of light from a spotlight.

If you take a 2’ diameter sphere and put a one candela or candlepower source in the center of the sphere, it will generate 1 lumen or footcandle over every square foot of the interior surface of the sphere. A footcandle is a lumen per square foot.

A Little Technical Stuff

A steradian is a unit solid angle (think of a little pyramid) subtending (defining) an area on the surface of the interior of a sphere equal to the square of the sphere’s radius.


ONE FOOT RADIUS SPHERE ILLUMINATION

The formula for the area of a sphere is 4 π R2. The radius of the sphere is one foot. Therefore 4 x 3.14159 x 12 = 12.57 square feet. The one candela source will generate a total of 12.57 lumens on the surface of the sphere.

If the source is 10 Candelas, 10 lumens will be generated over each square foot of the sphere for a total of 125.7 lumens

If the source is 100 Candelas,100 lumens will be generated over each square foot of the sphere for a total of 1257 lumens

If the source is 1,000,000 Candelas, 1,000,000 lumens will be generated over each square foot of the sphere for a total of 12,570,000 lumens. The increasing amount of candelas is a function of the brightness and power of the source.

BEAM CANDLEPOWER OR BEAM CANDELAS

A measure of a spotlight’s ability to deliver footcandle values at any given distance to a point on a surface. Regardless of the distance candelas will always be the same for a given fixture.

Candelas = Foot Candles x Distance2

Footcandles = lumens/square foot.
A meter = 3.281 feet. A meter squared = 10.76 square feet.
Lux = lumens/square meter.
Dividing candelas by distance in meters squared = lux.
Dividing candelas by distance squared in feet = footcandles.
Lumen efficiency = output of a light source (lamp) or fixture.
Beam Lumens = fixture output measured to 50% of center intensity.
Field Lumens = fixture output measured to 10% of center intensity.



The field angle of a fixture is measured to 10% of center intensity for photometric reporting purposes .

LUMENS

Calculating fixture efficiency and understanding the IES Method

Surface area of a 1’ radius sphere formula - 4 π R2 = 4 x 3.14159 x 12 =12.57 sq. ft.

A one candela (or candle-power) source emitting 1 footcandle uniformly over every square foot of the inside of the 1’ radius sphere produces a lumen per square foot or 12.57 lumens.

By scaling up, a 10 candela source in the same sphere emits 10 lumens per square foot or 125.7 lumens, and a 100 candela source emits 1257 lumens.

By using this technique any directional source can be analyzed for lumen efficiency through a technique using ZONAL CONSTANTS.

What’s a zonal constant? It’s area in decimal square feet within a 1 foot radius sphere. Zonal constant was a term to describe the zone or area within a defined spherical space by the IES and the technique is built into most analytical devices’ software. The constants can be applied once candlepower is established.

Candelas x the zonal constant measured in the center of the zone = the lumens in the zone.

Once you understand how to apply this, you can take any spotlight and determine its efficiency by measuring the candelas in each of the zones, converting the candelas to lumens by multiplying by the zonal constant in the zone measured, and adding up the lumens to 50% and 10%. Those two numbers divided the published lumen output of the lamp used provide the lumen efficiency at 50% and 10% of the spotlight’s performance.

When you are comparing spotlight performance with another, make sure you are comparing beam lumens with the other spotlight and field lumens with the other spotlight. You can’t compare beam and field lumens.

The illustrations that follow describe the angular zones and their constants. All this is to illustrate the method behind the calculations.


Notice how the smallest zone in the 1 foot radius sphere, - 0 to 10 degrees compares with the 40 to 50 degree area. In the center of the field regardless of the candelas produced the lumens produced are significantly less that the lumens in the 40 degree area because the area of the zone is so small.

The candelas x the zonal constant or area in square feet determines the lumens in each zone. Those lumens added together tell you the lumen output of the spotlight in the beam or field. For measuring purposes only one half of the sphere is used.

A simple method for measuring a fixture’s output. The light is mounted on a turntable calibrated in degrees and rotated about its center. The distance is constant for each reading. Ideally the square root of 1000 or 31.6 foot throw distance will permit you to calculate candelas quickly – footcandles times 1000 = candelas or beam candlepower for each reading. The formula is FC x D2 = Candelas

Candlepower times the zonal constant or area in square feet = the lumens in that zone. The lumens in each zone added up to 10% of center intensity = the field lumens of the fixtures. Lumens added up to 50% of center intensity = beam lumens of the fixtures. Beam and field lumens divided by the published lumens of the lamp = fixture efficiency in beam and field.

This illustration shows what the various zones types look like depending on which one is used.




Zonal constants are areas in square feet based on the 1 foot radius sphere. But they can be applied at any distance and angle. 1 degree zones might be used to measure the lumen output of a 5 degree fixture. 2 degree zones might be used for a 10 or 20 degree unit. 5 degree zones for a 40 or 50 degree unit.

As long as you define the area being illuminated by the zonal constants you can extract the lumens in that area


Turntable solution:
Rules
Voltage - Must be at rated voltage of the lamp
Lamp Condition – Should be new
Fixture Condition – Should be new and properly aligned to provide
cosine distribution if adjustable

Test Distances

Square root of 1000 = 31.62 feet. Footcandle levels read at this distance x 1000 provides candela levels instantly. If fixture is too large or it’s field angle too narrow, longer test distances must be used.















So the turntable test is not a good test for fixtures with shaped beams (as opposed to a round beam). That's why I was going to retest using a different method. The new test to be done using the Dubinovsky method. The test set-up is straight-forward with data being recorded, and calculations being made, in an Excel spreadsheet.

On a piece of board approximately 4 feetin diameter, mark three circles with diameters 1’, 2’ and 3’ concentrically revolving around a common center point. Then, divide the circles with lines at 45 degrees (see Fig. 1).

Fig. 1




Draw small targets upon each point that the lines intersect the circles. Then draw one target in the center point. Mount the board on a stand so that the center point of the circle is at the same height as the center of the light fixture to be measured (see Fig. 2).

Fig. 2




For Spot fixtures, or a hard-edge beam, point the light fixture output at the board and adjust the distance of the fixture from the board so that the outer edge of the beam is the same diameter as the outside circle of the target on the board. Measure the distance of the front of the fixture output lens from the board and record on the spreadsheet. Record the light level readings at each of the 25 points and record into the spreadsheet.

For Wash fixtures, or a soft-edge beam, point light fixture output at the board and adjust the distance of the fixture from the board so that the illumination at the outer edge is 10% of the center point illumination. Measure the distance of the front of the fixture output lens from the board and record on the spreadsheet. Record the light level readings at each of the 25 points and record into the spreadsheet.
When all the values have been entered into the document, the total lumen output will be calculated and displayed along with the beam angle.


The test stand for this is easy, I just need to sit down and build the Excel spreadsheet.




PS: I know the BD light is bright but so are lots of other lights. My point is that what customers need is objective data free of the "my light's brighter than yours" marketing hype. Ideally independent testing or mfg testing to a standard that could be applied across the industry. Then a potential customer can compare fixtures based on real data to determine what suits their needs. BWOE, the Squadron LED is listed at 44 watts, the 8" racelight is approx 46 watts (12v x 3.8 amp). So if power consumption is a non-factor then does the 8" light give more usable light? But maybe size or mounting is a concern and the LED is the better choice? Different needs for different folks.
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MJS screwed with this post 01-13-2012 at 08:02 PM
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Old 01-13-2012, 09:54 PM   #71
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How does the Squadron compare to Rigid Dually D2?
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Old 01-14-2012, 11:55 AM   #72
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How does the Squadron compare to Rigid Dually D2?
I don't have a D2 to photograph... but is the D2 available in a headlight shell?
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Old 01-15-2012, 04:39 PM   #73
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MJS made my head hurt.
Funny to have a Tom Pincu reference on Advrider.
I worked on his trees a few years back. Smart fella.

Hey TT, have you actually mounted the light on your bike?
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Old 01-15-2012, 05:03 PM   #74
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MJS made my head hurt.
Funny to have a Tom Pincu reference on Advrider.
I worked on his trees a few years back. Smart fella.

Hey TT, have you actually mounted the light on your bike?
Yep, let's do some real world test this weekend.
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Old 01-16-2012, 08:49 AM   #75
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My point is that what customers need is objective data free of the "my light's brighter than yours" marketing hype. Ideally independent testing or mfg testing to a standard that could be applied across the industry. Then a potential customer can compare fixtures based on real data to determine what suits their needs.
Exactly. Thanks for taking all the time to test the lights and provide the clear and detailed description. Educational stuff. I've learned something new today, now I can go play.
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