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Old 11-10-2011, 06:16 PM   #31
wmax351
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Originally Posted by geoffh View Post
Thanks, doing it myself is not an option really. I'll be leaving the country at the end of December and won't be back until deep into next year's riding season. I'd prefer to come back to a ready to ride bike or just buy a new one at that time.
I'll consider it a bit longer, but I think it may be time for a replacement.
Yeah. Sounds like you should just get something else. You may still want to buy back the salvage, and sell it to some kid as a project. Might end up as a cool cafe/etc bike instead of parts.
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Old 11-10-2011, 07:09 PM   #32
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Yeah. Sounds like you should just get something else. You may still want to buy back the salvage, and sell it to some kid as a project. Might end up as a cool cafe/etc bike instead of parts.
Another decent idea, thanks man.
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Old 04-12-2012, 09:08 PM   #33
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An update for those who still remember:
It's been determined that the USAA customer was 80% at fault, but the other 20% is my fault for speeding based on the "eye witness testimony" of people who "head me speed up to make the light." I think that's bull, because the light was green from the time they turned into me to the time we crashed. Oh well.

I'm not actually sure if USAA agreed to this or if an arbitrator found this. Based on the time involved, I think it went to an arbitrator who decided it. That means I get 80% of my deductible back. I wonder if it'll have any bearing on any future lawsuits, I would imagine so.
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Old 04-13-2012, 05:41 PM   #34
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By way of background, I have been a claims adjuster/supervisor for 24 years.

It sounds like the property damage claim for your bike went to Inter-company arbitration. The arbiters (I was one for awhile, got sick of it) are insurance company employees. They are given a free lunch and basically volunteer to review cases. The 80% decision has no bearing on your injury case. It is not admissable in court. The insurance company may use it as a negotiation tactic, but in the end, it really means nothing.

They should also pay you for your damaged gear as part of your property damage claim. You also most definitely have a bodily injury claim. That is separate from the property damage claim.

Bottom line is you were minding your own business, not doing anything illegal or otherwise wrong, and the other driver totaled your bike and injured you. You have a right to be pissed about that, and to pursue that way. Don't let them rip you off.
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Old 04-14-2012, 12:19 AM   #35
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Originally Posted by Duken4evr View Post
By way of background, I have been a claims adjuster/supervisor for 24 years.

It sounds like the property damage claim for your bike went to Inter-company arbitration. The arbiters (I was one for awhile, got sick of it) are insurance company employees. They are given a free lunch and basically volunteer to review cases. The 80% decision has no bearing on your injury case. It is not admissable in court. The insurance company may use it as a negotiation tactic, but in the end, it really means nothing.

They should also pay you for your damaged gear as part of your property damage claim. You also most definitely have a bodily injury claim. That is separate from the property damage claim.

Bottom line is you were minding your own business, not doing anything illegal or otherwise wrong, and the other driver totaled your bike and injured you. You have a right to be pissed about that, and to pursue that way. Don't let them rip you off.
Why wouldn't it be admissible in court? I know that arbitrations are usually kept secret, but the underlying facts should be allowed. Those being that A) there was an arbitration and B) I got 80% of my deductible back.
A finder of fact should be able to infer that the arbitrators already decided fault.
I know that won't have any precedent or power over any subsequent court decision or settlement, but it very well could be persuasive to a jury or fact finder.
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Old 04-14-2012, 06:29 AM   #36
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The arbitration finding is by "volunteer" (most are forced to go by their bosses) insurance company employees. There are no rules of evidence - the cases are decided by paper files submitted by the carriers. The finding is not admissable as evidence, the court considers the finding "hearsay".

It is really a next to moot point though, few cases ever go to trial. In my 24 years, I think I have had about 5 trials. The reality is trying a case costs a bundle, cheaper to settle. Be a pest. They will give you the money
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Old 04-16-2012, 05:48 PM   #37
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Yeah I'm yelling.

DO NOT TAKE THE INSURANCE COMPANIES FIRST OFFER!!!
I believe they want to make it go away as inexpensive as possible. In my u-turning cage accident, for personal injury I was offered $5500 or so, I fired back with a 10k settlement offer. They settled in the middle. Work them until you are satisfied.
Sorry about about the anal intrusion, that didn't happen in my treatment.....
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Old 04-17-2012, 06:00 AM   #38
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DO NOT TAKE THE INSURANCE COMPANIES FIRST OFFER!!!
Sorry about about the anal intrusion, that didn't happen in my treatment.....
You got it man, no first offers!

You missed out on the anal intrusion man, you don't know what you're missing
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Old 04-19-2012, 08:56 AM   #39
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Why wouldn't it be admissible in court? I know that arbitrations are usually kept secret, but the underlying facts should be allowed. Those being that A) there was an arbitration and B) I got 80% of my deductible back.
A finder of fact should be able to infer that the arbitrators already decided fault.
I know that won't have any precedent or power over any subsequent court decision or settlement, but it very well could be persuasive to a jury or fact finder.
Any witness can give testimony regarding an issue of fact (e.g. the car turned left in front of the motorcycle), but only an expert witness can give testimony regarding an issue of law (e.g. who is at fault).

Thus the arbitrator's decision could be admitted into evidence, but the court would have to find that the arbitrator is an expert. Expert's also have to show their work (i.e. how they came to the conclusion), usually in the form of a lengthy written statement.

My guess is that most insurance arbitrators would not qualify as experts in the eyes of the court. Even if they did, showing their work (which can be picked apart by opposing counsel) would likely cost more $$ than they want to spend.

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As far as people taking advantage of me, none of that has happened yet
You sure about that?

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I was released later that evening after some x-rays, ultrasounds, cat scans and a finger in my butt.


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Old 04-19-2012, 10:41 AM   #40
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Why wouldn't it be admissible in court?
This is a technical thing, but generally (note I said generally) the arbitration process is considered pre-trial negotiation, and pre-trial negotions and offers and such are not admissible, This is a policy thing designed to promote free and full discussion in the course of negotiations; if these types of statements were admissible in a subsequent trial, everyone would be sweating what they were saying and how it might be used against them later. That would defeat the purpose of negotiation, and result in more litigation, not less.
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Old 04-19-2012, 12:30 PM   #41
Alton
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Just a small updated. My insurance called today, they decided to total the bike. Seems like KTM parts are pretty expensive and it all ended up being too much.
Their initial offer was for 6411.83 and with my $500 deductible puts me at 5911.83. I'm not sure how I feel about it yet, but mostly I'm worried that I won't be able to find another Duke 690 that I can afford.

I don't know if its too late for this or not, but if you think the offer is low, many states require insurance companies to offer Fair Market Value. That means if you can find a few examples of the same bike for sale locally/nearby, they will have to honor that value. Start looking on CL and CycleTrader.com and see what the normal value is. If its higher than they are offering, print a few out and send it to them and ask for more.

After my accident, my insurance company even gave me a flyer with my payment stating that I could claim a higher FMV for the next 6 months if I could find multiple examples and bring it to them.
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Old 04-19-2012, 06:32 PM   #42
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Great answers Hoo and spez, very informative. Thanks!
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Old 04-19-2012, 07:21 PM   #43
Droptop50
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You missed out on the anal intrusion man, you don't know what you're missing
Great. Now I'm curious....
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Old 04-19-2012, 11:22 PM   #44
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Great. Now I'm curious....
I know a nice place in chinatown where you can learn all about it for a VERY reasonable price.
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Old 04-20-2012, 12:09 AM   #45
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Go back to the cops, get a citiation issued on the driver for turning in front of you, which he clearly did.
They cant cite you for speeding on the say-so of a witness not trained to estimate speed (like cops claim to be) and the minor damage to your bike and self certainly points to low speed.
Then you have some ammunition to fire at the insurance about the bogus speeding claims. Who were their witnesses anyhow? The driver and his wife? Not credible. Bystanders? Do they know the difference in sound of a bike engine speeding up and a bike engine running down through the gears in a crash stop? Not.
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