How often do you go too far?

[Ceri JC]

Only time I've really "gone too far" this year, was thrapping my F800GS round an Enduro track a couple of weeks back. I was just a smidgen faster than one of the marshals and I was fed up of being stuck behind him, so I overtook on a bit of straight where I shouldn't have, as I went over a crest. I knew that there was a bit of a drop off on the other side, but I mis-remembered quite how steep the run off into the drainage ditch was and also quite how gravelly that side of the track was. The back started to slither around at over 70mph and I was only about 4" from flying into the ditch (and I'd have been flung into the trees). When we were done, we had a good laugh about it and they said that the roost had to be seen to be believed.

[Ultravoyageant]

I don't like riding above 7/10ths to 8/10ths on the street. There's just too many variables that are outside my control there, even out in the sticks; deer (and other critters, like the fucking coyote that shot across the road not a bike length in front of me while I was up in the Catskills last weekend), random vehicles, deer, and deer. Did I mention fucking deer?

There are roads that I know extremely well where I will go really hard in the proverbial paint, but I always like leaving a bit on the table, just in case I need it. I do enjoy riding with folks who are better riders than I am, because it can certainly tighten up the skill set. But I shy away from the rides with folks who think its cool to ride competition level 9/10ths or 10/10ths on public roads. Every once in a while I'll go on those rides and frankly, I come away feeling pretty stupid, and thinking that the whole lot of us are fucking idiots for riding THAT FUCKING HARD off the track.

On the track its totally cool to fucking wring every last drop of you and bike out, because its a controlled environment, with room fly off the track and not launch off a cliff, hit a tree or hit the side of a building. There's medical staff RIGHT THERE, so that if you do fuck up you can get immediately whisked away to the hospital. Most importantly, there are no driveways, intersections, cages pulling out of hidden driveways in the middle of corners, and a reduced occurrence of motherfucking deer.

And really, who am I or anyone not racing a bike as their "food on the table, roof over one's head" gig to think that we're good enough to be "competitive" with anyone, especially away from the safe[er], controlled confines of the track?

It kinda reminds me of couch potato fools who rock professional sports team gear and speak of their favorite team's accomplishments in terms of "we" or "we're", like their ass was out on the field grindin' it out with the pros. Ridiculous.

So yeah, while I do "get it" sometimes, I try to keep it reasonable and hopefully harmful only to myself if shit goes sideways. I always try to remember that "fools rush in" and to keep the volume dialed back a bit when out on the road.

[Mambo Dave]

I hate to sound old - I'm 41 - but I just don't push it like that anymore.

Two factors play into this - I live in south Florida now. To some, perhaps even many, riders I may be considered "pushing it" when riding through extreme winds, rains or traffic for my commutes... but in as far as twisties... they don't exist.

And even if they did exist - the second factor is that I no longer wear a full set of Dainese race leathers. In such a suit, in an area with curves, I eventually do feel very comfortable pushing a bike to crazy limits. The ATGATT mesh stuff I wear, now, or even the fabric 3/4 riding jacket with nylon riding pants, just instill too little reassurance / confidence to push anything.

Even with all of that, without a sports bike and good tires... I soon find the limitations of other bikes' suspensions or lean angles too limiting and un-enjoyable to push it that far for any thrill.

[kabluie]

At 68 years old, I rarely push the limits. I don't really know what my limits are anymore, except to say that I'm really not in the mood to screw up and go off road and hurt something. I've had my big accident that included 10 fractures so I just don't push it so hard that I'm likely to screw up. I'm also lucky to have a 18 mile route that has lots of curves, very little traffic for most of the route and about 5 miles of small town traffic. The curves include off camber curves, on camber curves, curves that never see direct sunlight so they get slick after a rainstorm or before the morning dew melts off, up hills an down hills with curves just before and just after the hills and generally most every type of curve that you'll likely see on a track. It's good practice to just go out and learn the perfect line for the whole route. If I want a different track then I just go the other way around the route. I have yet to do a perfect line around the whole track, and I've been riding it since 2008. When I first got my bike, a sportster, It took me about 40 mins to make the whole lap. I've done it in 18 mins, but usually I make the lap in about 30 minutes. That's is riding just a little above the speed limit with plenty of room to make a sudden stop for road blockages. Ocasionally there are pedestrians and I slow down when I pass them. There are a few places where there are houses and I tend to slow down in those parts too. They have a few interesting curves there too, so I'm still able to keep my mind occupied. The down side is that if one goes off the road they are garranteed to hurt. One side is mostly a view of the bay with deep drop offs, and the other side runs the gamut from fields with the barbed wire fences or trees, or . . . One of my favorite parts is a series of right and left curves which is good in its own right, but the trees grow about a foot off the pavement so if you're not paying attention, you can bonk your head on the tree and I garrantee that will hurt, if you survive.

I got my first motorcycle endorsement when I was about 16 years old. Before that I was riding borrowed mopeds and small bikes that were good for trails. My first real bike was a street bike and after that I never went back to the dirt or trails. After the accident, I quit riding for about 10 years, and then went back to riding in my late 30's. It's been off and on for bike ownership since then. The gymkhana thing has really gotten my attention lately. I think that is a cheap place for people to realy push their limits and not get into a lot of trouble. Those skills will help with your track days which I think is expensive. I realize that "expensive" is a relative term.

Ride safe.

[David R]

Riding in the city on my Versys doing errands for my business. At one of the busiest intersections, I was back a ways from a left arrow. I goosed it to make the light, then slowed down for the corner. I started the turn with the brakes still on and heard the front tire chirp from a pothole. A little light came on in my head.
STUPID! I then realized I should have never been trying to make the light and just stopped.

No harm, no foul, but that is the way you end up in the newspaper.

David

[B.Curvin]

5 to 10 over on the straights, and I slow down very little for corners. I trail the front brake to the apex most of the time, street and dirt. I typically ride an 80% pace. I back off when there are houses around, and wick it up when there are no houses (there are no houses in most of the places I ride ). The pegs of my new to me KLR are on the deck in most corners. Mind you, I haven't drug a knee on the street in 5+ years. I've had one wreck in the last 10 years. I looped a wheelie on my XR650R at 60mph about 4 years ago. There were no houses around.

[Low Budget]

Never more than maybe 7/10ths in a perfect no traffic, situation after running through it beforehand to see what the pavement surface looked like.

I worked at a bike shop that had alot of squidly kids for customers. Nearly every week one of them would toss it bad. Some even died. Some nearly killed others.

The street is not a place you have the right to needlessly endanger innocent others.

Spend a few seasons sprint racing on a real track and Im guessing most would slow way down on the street afterwards.

I know myself and many others did. You become aware of the uncontrolable variables on the street and that combined with the reality that you can go SOOOOO much faster on the track, you wont have much desire to push it hard in a lesser enviroment.

I even knew racers that QUIT street riding after they spent alot of time on the track. They realized the uncertain danger of the street and went to dirt bikes for casual riding instead .

[CurveLover]

Ok. So who was the motard yesterday that got behind me and propelled me into pushing my little scooter further than I ever have by getting all up on my rear and acting like you were gonna pass me in those tight corners?





FAIL.

If you wiped out on those knobbies behind me somewhere trying to keep up, sorry, but you had it coming. I was too hungry and didn't stop, so I am hoping you just turned off somewhere and didn't crash. You were right behind me most of the way and then I looked again in my rear view and *poof* you were gone. I can't be doin that shit. Stop it.

[B.Curvin]

Originally Posted by Low Budget

Spend a few seasons sprint racing on a real track and Im guessing most would slow way down on the street afterwards.

:

I did, and I did. I used to ride the Cherohala on my SV and never get below 60, sometimes hitting 100 and get my knee down in every corner. Last time I rode the Cherohala I ran 55 the whole way. I didn't drag a peg or a knee.

Telephone poles, fire hydrants, trees and guard rails are much more unsettling after racing.

[Low Budget]

Originally Posted by B.Curvin

I did, and I did. I used to ride the Cherohala on my SV and never get below 60, sometimes hitting 100 and get my knee down in every corner. Last time I rode the Cherohala I ran 55 the whole way. I didn't drag a peg or a knee.

Telephone poles, fire hydrants, trees and guard rails are much more unsettling after racing.

EXACTLY !!

And after floating along in a pack draft exceeding 150 MPH on the track, Seeing a wandering fully loaded log truck crossing into your lane head on as he drifts wide in a mountain canyon sweeper, you really realize how STUPID you would have to be to ride at your limit on the open highway .

The track is a far safer enviroment. Everything is meant to make it so you can go a full 100% with the minimum of risk.


Its not the things you have control over that are the only factors, its the things that are not controled and what you have no control over that will cause disaster on the street if you add the elevated risk of riding to hard .

Most street riders dont realize the danger involved in public road riding if they have never raced on the track. It really gives you a completely new perspective on risks.

[Mat]

Originally Posted by sphyrnidus

If you're talking about straight ahaed riding you are right, but in the twisties the GSA is very hard to beat.
Did I go to the limit...yes I do. Last year I rode the col d'Izoard. Half way up I met these two Italian chaps, also on GSA's and we raced for the top. On arrival, my mouth was dry and my heart was racing.
In resedential area's I'm tranquile but in the mountains the brake goes of.
And I'm not a young idiot at 59, neither are the guys I ride with, but every year we go on a trip and ride like we're chased by the devil (that's what my wife called it) And we love it, even some motorcycle cops joined us Ah leaving this weekend for the Dolomites as in the Stelvio.

I did have a friend who died in the mountains with his bike. I always try to remember him when I am in the mountains, and to remind myself that in most places, a ride off the road would end in a 200 m tumble down the mountain and likely death, or at least an unimaginable amount of hassles.

As it happens, I ran into a couple of Dutch riders on street bikes on the Albula last year. They were faster than me, until there was construction and I took off. I like to have TKC80s, not only for the gravel, but also because they are decent on tarmac, but still remind me to not go too fast.

After that, we just cruised the three of us down the pass, all about the same speed. Not very fast, not slow. That reminded me that you don't have to race to have fun. We didn't even talk when we met at the gas station, just nodded and all smiled contently.


Other than that, I will adopt Scott's "Am I being an asshole" test. I really like that, and probably it will make me a better rider. Thanks!

Sometimes I also do the "am I being an ass?" test. I fail if it means I've taken a look at my riding and have seen aggressive behavior in heavier traffic conditions. This is mostly caused by being late or pissed off and those are two good reason right there to park the bike for a few minutes before something bad happens.