Clutch drag when hot---oil fix? - Page 2

Chuckracer · 07-24-2012, 06:45 PM

Mine started doing this recently as well. I pulled the clutch cover and about a quart of oil came out. That's almost a quart too much!

I checked the oil jet and sure enough,it was very loose. Like, out of it's threaded boss. Tightening it fixed the problem.

Long time T6 user here.

Maybe check that before getting carried away bleeding and changing oil brands...?

gefr · 07-24-2012, 11:38 PM

They develop a groove because they are in contact with the belevil spring. Changing its position with another steel ring could help.
My #0.50 oil jet works fine. Loose central nut holding the inner clutch basket could also contribute to dragging clutch. I had my clutch assy replaced to get rib of dragging clutch.
Good luck.

ediehl · 07-25-2012, 05:38 AM

Just got an email from the PO, and it turns out that my 950 is indeed running Rotella 15/40 (not sure if it's synth or dino). Not sure what the size of the oil jet is (wish I'd looked for a stamped number), but I do know that I couldn't come up with a wire small enough to fit through the orifice. No question that it was open, though.

Since I've had issues with Rotella and clutches prior, and others on this forum report the same, that will probably be my first change. Next up will be the mineral oil flush, then I guess I'll verify the oil jet size, and finally I'll have a look at that bottom steel clutch plate.

I'll report back if and when I get a resolution.

sabink · 07-25-2012, 03:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gefr

They develop a groove because they are in contact with the belevil spring. Changing its position with another steel ring could help.
My #0.50 oil jet works fine. Loose central nut holding the inner clutch basket could also contribute to dragging clutch. I had my clutch assy replaced to get rib of dragging clutch.
Good luck.

Can you please share the part number of the .50 jet?

Scott Baja · 07-25-2012, 07:29 PM

Just switched from Castrol 20/50 dino to Mobile1 20/50 motorcycle oil, now creeping when clutch pulled in. Neutral is still easy to find. Gas millage the same. Dont know about oil usage tho. Will be checking. Start ups seems to be a little smoother with the Syn Mobile1, but it is the middle of summer.

gefr · 07-25-2012, 10:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sabink

Can you please share the part number of the .50 jet?

Mine was drilled on an OEM jet.
There are similar jets in here, but can't confirm size and thread:

http://www.pjmotorsports.com/keihin-...ml#main%20jets

Cheers.

ediehl · 07-26-2012, 09:26 AM

Curiously, I took my 2nd ride post-oil-jet-cleaning yesterday, in temps probably 10 degrees higher (mid-90s) than the first ride, and I did not experience the creeping once the bike was up to temp. I'd made no other changes or adjustments. Hmmmm

StmbtDave · 07-26-2012, 06:00 PM

Can anyone explain what the advantage is going from the stock 0.3mm to 0.5mm oil jet? I drilled mine out and now am experiencing creep with clutch disengaged, can't find neutral when stopped, and have very clunky shifts. I had the dealer order a stock 0.3mm so I can go back.

Dave

v8toilet · 07-26-2012, 09:02 PM

Meoni's mechanic did it to his Dakar bike.

I assume for severe use in extreme heat more oil means less heat which keeps the clutch from smoking itself. Someone smarter can help out here. Is it necessary for a dual sport that doesn't see the temps his did? Probably not but its the closest I'll get to Meoni status so I've got to do it right?

crofrog · 07-26-2012, 09:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by v8toilet

Meoni's mechanic did it to his Dakar bike.

I assume for severe use in extreme heat more oil means less heat which keeps the clutch from smoking itself. Someone smarter can help out here. Is it necessary for a dual sport that doesn't see the temps his did? Probably not but its the closest I'll get to Meoni status so I've got to do it right?

the meoni bike was running a bigger jet 1mm is considered the min for desert racing it's to keep the clutch plates properly lubricated and cooled.

http://www.ktm950.info/how/Orange%20...utch_mods.html

bighoss550 · 09-20-2012, 09:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ediehl

Curiously, I took my 2nd ride post-oil-jet-cleaning yesterday, in temps probably 10 degrees higher (mid-90s) than the first ride, and I did not experience the creeping once the bike was up to temp. I'd made no other changes or adjustments. Hmmmm

ediehl all good then right? just oil jet cleaning? you mentioned you couldn't find a wire to clean it (?)... what did you do?

I have same symptoms, plus trouble engaging neutral. I guess ill flush the line again, and now the jet.

An further advice while im into it?

TheMuffinMan · 09-20-2012, 09:53 AM

The clutch dragged on my bike ever since I bought it from the previous owner 20,000 miles ago. It was about the same amount of creep after I put a .5 clutch oil jet in.

I toasted a clutch on a long slow uphill with the stock size jet. Ever since I put the .5 in I have never had any issues with the clutch. I do have to shift into neutral when rolling, or rev it up to 2.5k with the clutch pulled in to shift into neutral if I'm stopped. The gearbox is a little clunky when it's cold but only from first to second. After it heats up I don't notice any difference.

I run Rotella T6 5w-40 and my bike has 35,000 miles on it.

Another thing I noticed is if I have the clutch pulled in at a stoplight and the bike's dragging I can blip the throttle and the drag goes away until the rev's return under 1800-1900 rpm. The drag doesn't bother me since my legs are too short to get both on the ground anyway so I just put my left foot down at stops and hold the other on the rear brake.

crofrog · 09-20-2012, 09:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheMuffinMan

I toasted a clutch on a long slow uphill with the stock size jet. Ever since I put the .5 in I have never had any issues with the clutch. I do have to shift into neutral when rolling, or rev it up to 2.5k with the clutch pulled in to shift into neutral if I'm stopped. The gearbox is a little clunky when it's cold but only from first to second. After it heats up I don't notice any difference.

I run Rotella T6 5w-40 and my bike has 35,000 miles on it.

I know allot of you rotella guys don't want to hear it, but seriously switch to motorex and I'd put money on that going away. My bike shifts _so_much_better_ with motorex.

MortimerSickle · 09-20-2012, 09:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bighoss550

...
I have same symptoms, plus trouble engaging neutral. I guess ill flush the line again, and now the jet.

An further advice while im into it?

Remember to try this.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MortimerSickle

...
If you have flushed your system with fresh fluid, and still have these symptoms, try taking the slave apart to clean manually. The way this system is set up, the fluid goes from the line right out the bleeder, leaving the fluid in the cylinder largely undisturbed.
...

TheMuffinMan · 09-20-2012, 01:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MortimerSickle

Remember to try this.

+1

I usually take the slave off and shake the fluid out of it and flush it once or twice. If you take the fluid out make sure you pre-fill the slave with fluid when you put it back on the bike, getting the bubbles out of it is really annoying otherwise!

07-24-2012, 06:45 PM	#16
Chuckracer More Ride, Less Google Joined: Aug 2007 Location: Lowville, NY Oddometer: 5,789	Mine started doing this recently as well. I pulled the clutch cover and about a quart of oil came out. That's almost a quart too much! I checked the oil jet and sure enough,it was very loose. Like, out of it's threaded boss. Tightening it fixed the problem. Long time T6 user here. Maybe check that before getting carried away bleeding and changing oil brands...? __________________ 2003 Kawasaki KLR650 "Reality" 1993 Ducati 900SS "L'evento"

07-24-2012, 11:38 PM	#17
gefr Life is a trip Joined: Nov 2005 Location: East Med, Greece Oddometer: 3,200	You could also try replacing the far deep steel disc in your clutch. They develop a groove because they are in contact with the belevil spring. Changing its position with another steel ring could help. My #0.50 oil jet works fine. Loose central nut holding the inner clutch basket could also contribute to dragging clutch. I had my clutch assy replaced to get rib of dragging clutch. Good luck. __________________ There is always a reason!!

07-26-2012, 06:00 PM	#23
StmbtDave AKA Invisible Dave Joined: Aug 2005 Location: Loveland, CO summer - Tucson, AZ winter Oddometer: 2,476	Can anyone explain what the advantage is going from the stock 0.3mm to 0.5mm oil jet? I drilled mine out and now am experiencing creep with clutch disengaged, can't find neutral when stopped, and have very clunky shifts. I had the dealer order a stock 0.3mm so I can go back. Dave __________________ Why are we stopping? We don't have time for that! http://share.findmespot.com/shared/f...8pP8skl622N3ri

09-20-2012, 09:53 AM	#27
TheMuffinMan Beastly Adventurer Joined: Mar 2010 Location: Denver, USA Oddometer: 3,827	The clutch dragged on my bike ever since I bought it from the previous owner 20,000 miles ago. It was about the same amount of creep after I put a .5 clutch oil jet in. I toasted a clutch on a long slow uphill with the stock size jet. Ever since I put the .5 in I have never had any issues with the clutch. I do have to shift into neutral when rolling, or rev it up to 2.5k with the clutch pulled in to shift into neutral if I'm stopped. The gearbox is a little clunky when it's cold but only from first to second. After it heats up I don't notice any difference. I run Rotella T6 5w-40 and my bike has 35,000 miles on it. Another thing I noticed is if I have the clutch pulled in at a stoplight and the bike's dragging I can blip the throttle and the drag goes away until the rev's return under 1800-1900 rpm. The drag doesn't bother me since my legs are too short to get both on the ground anyway so I just put my left foot down at stops and hold the other on the rear brake. __________________ "Civilize the mind, but make savage the body." To the house of a friend the way is never long. "Show respect to all, but grovel to none." '12 690 Enduro // 690 Wiki

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07-25-2012, 05:38 AM	#18
ediehl ^OP Gnarly Adventurer Joined: Apr 2006 Oddometer: 141	Just got an email from the PO, and it turns out that my 950 is indeed running Rotella 15/40 (not sure if it's synth or dino). Not sure what the size of the oil jet is (wish I'd looked for a stamped number), but I do know that I couldn't come up with a wire small enough to fit through the orifice. No question that it was open, though. Since I've had issues with Rotella and clutches prior, and others on this forum report the same, that will probably be my first change. Next up will be the mineral oil flush, then I guess I'll verify the oil jet size, and finally I'll have a look at that bottom steel clutch plate. I'll report back if and when I get a resolution.

07-25-2012, 07:29 PM	#20
Scott Baja el semental negro Joined: May 2010 Location: Missoula MT Oddometer: 230	Just switched from Castrol 20/50 dino to Mobile1 20/50 motorcycle oil, now creeping when clutch pulled in. Neutral is still easy to find. Gas millage the same. Dont know about oil usage tho. Will be checking. Start ups seems to be a little smoother with the Syn Mobile1, but it is the middle of summer.

07-26-2012, 09:26 AM	#22
ediehl ^OP Gnarly Adventurer Joined: Apr 2006 Oddometer: 141	Curiously, I took my 2nd ride post-oil-jet-cleaning yesterday, in temps probably 10 degrees higher (mid-90s) than the first ride, and I did not experience the creeping once the bike was up to temp. I'd made no other changes or adjustments. Hmmmm

07-26-2012, 09:02 PM	#24
v8toilet Nothing to see here. Joined: Jul 2005 Location: Northwest U.S. Oddometer: 1,597	Meoni's mechanic did it to his Dakar bike. I assume for severe use in extreme heat more oil means less heat which keeps the clutch from smoking itself. Someone smarter can help out here. Is it necessary for a dual sport that doesn't see the temps his did? Probably not but its the closest I'll get to Meoni status so I've got to do it right?