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Old 08-02-2012, 06:04 AM   #91
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Originally Posted by xr400r View Post
Hmmmm....... I just kinda started this thread to talk about who on ADVRider might be racing the 2013 Dakar Rally. People that we might know and be able to follow. Privateers and such....
Well, look what you have started, there's the HRC Dakar assault also - just goes to show the level of Interest and 5 months to go - is that about 151 sleeps to go?
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Old 08-02-2012, 06:08 AM   #92
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Huh... that strange I've never reviewed the results sheets from any of those 6000 km plus multi-day Supermoto events ... they do pretty well heh?
a world championship is a world championship...

Point being, I'm officially off the fence and on record in saying that I expect greatness from BF, I reckon within top 5 overall for the Mi1 in it's first year.

Hijack over, can someone please start the '13 coverage thread already?
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Old 08-02-2012, 06:18 AM   #93
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Originally Posted by xr400r View Post
Hmmmm....... I just kinda started this thread to talk about who on ADVRider might be racing the 2013 Dakar Rally. People that we might know and be able to follow. Privateers and such....
If you are feeling overwhelmed xr... maybe one of the kind mods can cut the last couple of pages (from about post #70) out of here, and toss it back into "The bivouac"...???
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Old 08-02-2012, 06:41 AM   #94
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Anyone know if Neduro will try it again?
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Old 08-02-2012, 07:01 AM   #95
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I'll second moving the conversation over to the Bivouac. It was just too irresistable of a conversation to join in on the pre-pre-pre-Dakar speculation. I'm guessing that it's a little too early to start the 2013 thread.

I'll put down the first by-name wager on this year's finish:

1. Coma (to the tune of a "She Wants Revenge" album)
2. Rodriguez (to Van Halen's "Runnin' with the Devil")
3. Despres (maybe a little Muddy Water sings the blues)

Rounding out the top five I see another non-factory KTM and possibly an HRC bike or one of the BF bikes (if they can keep the motor together).

Just speculation of course. I hope to be in Egypt for at least part of the Pharaons to see the magic happen prior to DAkar 2013.

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Old 08-02-2012, 05:30 PM   #96
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Has anyone heard if Quinn Cody will be back for 2013?

When can an official roster be expected?
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Old 08-02-2012, 08:43 PM   #97
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Has anyone heard if Quinn Cody will be back for 2013?

When can an official roster be expected?
Rumour has it that yes he will - the rumour of who with is another thing entirely

Last year the official roster didn't star appearing on the website until mid December, so some time to go yet.
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Old 08-02-2012, 09:16 PM   #98
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first off I would like to say I was but .. nope.. only in my dreams

Second was... exactly how long was Quinn Cody's contract with KTM ? He has been essentially injured all year.
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Old 08-02-2012, 09:24 PM   #99
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The critcal difference here (for me) as compared to the other Sherco/Aprilia type efforts we've seen before, is that when HRC say they have a "three year plan", their corporate history indicates that they mean; "We plan to compete at the (budget appropriated and funds/planning set out to maintain the technical, financial, media and race support needed) DAKAR for the next three years".


The nominated HRC riding line up themselves are good on paper; Helder is (on form over the last 18 months) arguably the "best of the rest" after the two aliens... a logical choice for Honda to pick up. Wagon wheel Sam is undoubtedly a big prospect for the future... but he still has yet to COMPLETE a few rallies (yes I know technology let him down in the '12 DAKAR... but you still need seat time/completeion in Dakar before a rider can compete at the front)... even Coma/Despres had a couple of Dakars (and other rallies) under their belt before they joined the "elite" few up front. As far as the other two nominated team riders go, good solid performers, who can make inroads on top 15 maybe top ten... but nothing I've seen in results to date that indicate they would be podium threats.

[B]When will the throne be abdicated...?[/



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Hi Troy, just a bit more from a realist.
You may or may not have noticed that I am a big supporter of Sam, so maybe we will find him a new tag soon, although I appreciate you recognise his position - and that isn't upside down!
He doesn't actually come off that much more, or less than anyone else, but an all round occupational hazard in the sport, especially if you are pushing it - even the aliens arn't immune from that.

He is without doubt one of the brighter prospects, hence why Honda/HCR have risked, no, invested in him.
KTM may have done, as he was riding MC and Baja for their local rep in Dubai, but of course they couldn't with their existing set up, so their loss (for now).

All motorsports and indeed sports, require an element of luck and that is hopefully turning round for Sam, he entered this year's desert challenge with an unhealed broken foot, but when possibley leading in the first stage jarred it and broke it again - he rode the last 50 k without being able to change gear and still finished 3rd!

He missed Qatar because of it and then went below the radar in sardegna. The Italians scuppered him - gave him a number and a start in the 70's and wouldn't reseed him. He was on the rally bike as opposed to the majority on the enduro. As you know the track was tight and dusty and overtaking was extremely difficult, if not suicidal at times, so being stuck behind 50 or so slow riders was never going to be easy. He struggled with this for the week but finished and still managed an overall 14 th in the wrc class

The Dakar is totally different, I accept that, but you won't find a more dedicated or physically prepared rider, he has put in days of long riding on his own and with HRC and has more to come - let's see what happens on the bigger stage of Egypt, but a head and not a heart thought is going to show very soon why he is wearing the colours of HRC and at 23 he has the time and the skill to become an alien himself one day

too old screwed with this post 08-02-2012 at 09:45 PM Reason: Fat fingers and spell dummy
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Old 08-03-2012, 01:42 AM   #100
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Originally Posted by wrk2surf View Post
first off I would like to say I was but .. nope.. only in my dreams

Second was... exactly how long was Quinn Cody's contract with KTM ? He has been essentially injured all year.
Don't know for how long, but it took him away from JCR. I do understand though that the contract does not include the Dakar, so who knows?
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Old 08-03-2012, 01:48 AM   #101
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Re: Sam

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The Dakar is totally different, I accept that, but you won't find a more dedicated or physically prepared rider, he has put in days of long riding on his own and with HRC and has more to come - let's see what happens on the bigger stage of Egypt, but a head and not a heart thought is going to show very soon why he is wearing the colours of HRC and at 23 he has the time and the skill to become an alien himself one day
^^^ Agree 100% with everything you've said. Have heard nothing but praise from EVERYONE I know who has had anything to do with Sam in rally circles (I have - as yet - not had that pleasure). My comments are PURELY from an observers perpective, based on the results and efforts Sam has put in at rallies over the last 18 months.

He has youth, fitness, tons of skill and evidently ambition/drive going for him... so at 23, already having chosen rally as his riding career path, he has time on his side.

But I still stand fast with the analogy; it's one thing to go fast for a stage or a leg or two and Sam's record of injuries/mechanicals aside... In rally you kind of make your own luck. To finish first - first you must finish... and the tried and true formula to achieve that is to get "completed competition miles" under ones belt.

I can go back through the Dakar record books and cite many top line riders who despite being visibly faster than anyone else in the field; never made their mark (on anything other than the ground). Malherbe, Kinigadner & Tianen (all multiple world champions) were soooooo much quicker than anyone on a few stages of the Dakar when they competed, but none managed to finish.

So If I ever had the chance to sit down and have a cuppa with either yourself or mxmum (who obviously have Sam's best at heart, it is clear), my heartfelt advice would be; to wind it off 5% and get some finishes/results in the immediated future under his belt. With Sam's pedigree of motocross, supercross and desert racing behind him; the fitness, skill and ambition he posses coupled with the investment that HRC have made in him... even if it takes until 2014/15 before the "breakthough" comes... the guy has the potential to put together a "five year winning streak" with the right team behind him, and he wouldn't even be 30 yet!

Oh to be 20 years younger again...
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Old 08-03-2012, 02:29 AM   #102
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^^^

So If I ever had the chance to sit down and have a cuppa with either yourself or mxmum (who obviously have Sam's best at heart, it is clear), my heartfelt advice would be; to wind it off 5% and get some finishes/results in the immediated future under his belt. With Sam's pedigree of motocross, supercross and desert racing behind him; the fitness, skill and ambition he posses coupled with the investment that HRC have made in him... even if it takes until 2014/15 before the "breakthough" comes... the guy has the potential to put together a "five year winning streak" with the right team behind him, and he wouldn't even be 30 yet!

Oh to be 20 years younger again...
Thanks Troy, I think we all agree with that and even Sam can back off when the opportunity is thre - he can find it a little difficult though as it's not natural to him.
Essentially he needs to find himself not having to chase the pace in the rally - at the start of the last Dakar, he picked a 30 sec penalty, said he took it easy and still finished 7th, so the base is there

He is getting a lot of tactical guidance from Henk and the team at Honda Europe, so let's see what the rest of the year and of course Jan brings

Mxmum and myself are his unofficial PR managers, so we will give you the inside track when and as far as we can .
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Old 08-03-2012, 04:55 AM   #103
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Thanks Troy, I think we all agree with that and even Sam can back off when the opportunity is thre - he can find it a little difficult though as it's not natural to him.
Essentially he needs to find himself not having to chase the pace in the rally - at the start of the last Dakar, he picked a 30 sec penalty, said he took it easy and still finished 7th, so the base is there

He is getting a lot of tactical guidance from Henk and the team at Honda Europe, so let's see what the rest of the year and of course Jan brings

Mxmum and myself are his unofficial PR managers, so we will give you the inside track when and as far as we can .
Just one interesting addition though, is that the current feedback is that to stay in touch with the quickest then you have to be going flat out for the actual track - so a tough call, or a quicker bike - HRC

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Old 08-03-2012, 06:21 AM   #104
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Thanks Troy, I think we all agree with that and even Sam can back off when the opportunity is thre - he can find it a little difficult though as it's not natural to him.
Essentially he needs to find himself not having to chase the pace in the rally - at the start of the last Dakar, he picked a 30 sec penalty, said he took it easy and still finished 7th, so the base is there

He is getting a lot of tactical guidance from Henk and the team at Honda Europe, so let's see what the rest of the year and of course Jan brings

Mxmum and myself are his unofficial PR managers, so we will give you the inside track when and as far as we can .
With the two of you as his PR managers, he can only do well!

Sam reminds me quite a bit of Zé Helio who won the Dos Sertoes 6 times, and was expected to do very well in the Dakar, but he crashed out twice in a row, and crashed out in the 2010 Dos Sertoes too. He is super fast and skilled, but maintaining insane speed for 10-14 days is going to put you anyone at risk. One thing I have noticed while editing the Dakar video footage over the years is that the aliens actually do ride to the road conditions; there are times when you can see they are riding at a reasonable pace at certain points versus at full gas.

Having watched Zé ride really closely, his speed seemed recklessly fast to me. His speed made him the favorite rookie in 2011, but he DNF, because he was simply too fast. Maybe I'm not used to it but it certainly seemed like he was riding at 100% all the times, which increases the risk of things going wrong. Comparing that to, say, Coma who is insane fast when he needs to be, but even then appears to be riding smooth and in control.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that slower is actually faster on a rally like this, and I believe if Sam rode at a sustained 80% of his ability he would firstly finish more easily and secondly get a good placing because his 80% could get him into the top 20 - Not a bad result at all!

Interestingly, there are 55 elite riders on the list this year. Kinda puts into perspective the level of skills required to get a top 50 placing.
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Old 08-03-2012, 07:17 AM   #105
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I guess what I'm trying to say is that slower is actually faster on a rally like this, and I believe if Sam rode at a sustained 80% of his ability he would firstly finish more easily and secondly get a good placing because his 80% could get him into the top 20 - Not a bad result at all!

Interestingly, there are 55 elite riders on the list this year. Kinda puts into perspective the level of skills required to get a top 50 placing.[/QUOTE]

----------------------------------------------

Good point Bluebull, but perhaps a combination of 100% & 90 % will see him on the right track - but if the bike is ok he will be close.

Don't forget, the only time Sam has ever crashed out in a Rally or a Baja was in Oz last year when a Kangaroo hit him at high speed on day 1 - he missed one day because the medics would not let him ride on but still went on to win 3 stages, so contrary to all the discussion he is not actually suspect to bombing it

too old screwed with this post 08-03-2012 at 07:20 AM Reason: Automatic spell check was changing Bluebull's sex - lol
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