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Old 08-01-2012, 02:34 PM   #31
JimRidesThis OP
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Question Bearing plate?

These images are from the Honda workshop manual here... http://www.hondaxl.it/manuali.htm (Section 10)



There's a specific reference to a bearing plate in right-hand side crankcase 'behind' the main bearing. My XL doesn't have one and there doesn't seem to be one in the other photos in the manual (you can see the bearing cage, not a plate)...



So, what's the story with this bearing plate? Has your XL got one? Should my XL ('85 model) have one?
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Old 08-01-2012, 02:39 PM   #32
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Your wrong. The plate goes on the LEFT side of the crank between the bearing and the case. What it does id shield the bearing and keeps oil in the crank area. Never seen a Honda big single without one.
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Old 08-01-2012, 03:17 PM   #33
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My earlier post should have said my XL didn't have one. Now corrected.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mcma111 View Post
Your wrong. The plate goes on the LEFT side of the crank between the bearing and the case. What it does id shield the bearing and keeps oil in the crank area. Never seen a Honda big single without one.
Steve, thanks for clarifying that and so quick too. You've gotta love this forum.

Of course, I can see that you're right from the photos (i.e. it's a left-hand side crankcase in the picture), but the text is unambiguous (and then confused).

"Install the new right crankshaft bearing and bearing plate"

"Install new left crankshaft bearing into the right crankcase" (that one I was going to ignore I think the technical writer must've been stoned that day)



...plus I still haven't removed the rotor or crank from the left side crankcase yet so I can't get a good look at the left main bearing.


Thanks again. I'll stop worrying about it now
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Old 08-01-2012, 03:20 PM   #34
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Carry on. Next....
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Old 08-01-2012, 07:32 PM   #35
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Keep it up and you'll end up with a cool big ol' thumper, gobs of torque.

I bought my 83 XL600 as a $200 chassis/basket case, complete but only the crankcase in the frame. Kid I bought it from said he tore it down because of a bent valve, and then quit the project. Good enough challenge for me!

I replaced the bent valve, freshened up the cylinder, new rings, bolted it all back together and it fired on the 5th kick, no decomp lever. I had a cheapo running thumper for less than $300. Did some trail riding and got some dirt on it. But, when climbing a hill in 2nd gear, I found my error in using the original cam chain. See, I thought the cam chain installed real easy, but simply went ahead with it. Yup, worn cam chain skipped teeth under load and the piston wacked the intake valves. Bent them both.

So I torn it down, replaced the cam chain, chain guides, intake valves, few other parts. Again, bolted up, and it fired again after a few kicks. Been good ever since, just a bugger to start sometimes as it is a big single. I need to get the decomp lever/cam working again. Since I have since bought a 2004 DRZ400E (electric start) my plan is to turn the XL600 into a retro-motard/street-tracker.

I still like the bike. But if I were you I'd replace the cam chain and guides before putting it back together. One thing about the big ol Honda singles is they tend to use up cam chains.
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Old 08-02-2012, 01:51 PM   #36
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Talking

Thanks Andy. A cam chain and guides are on the shopping list


Meanwhile, back at the ranch...


...the tear down continues.



This is roughly where I'd got to; 'cases still together but ready to split, rotor still attached.





From there it was easy enough to split the 'cases...




Hmmn, Hermatite Orange

...pull out some bearings, clean the cases up a little...





...and start ordering new bearings and seals.


Gearbox bearings and seal, clutch side


Mainshaft bearing and seal

For UK info, the bearings and seals came from Simply Bearings in Leigh (do a Google search). These were ordered using their online service but didn't list the right sizes for the main and balance shaft bearings, I'll give 'em a call.
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Old 08-02-2012, 01:56 PM   #37
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The main and balancer bearings may be Honda specific.
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Old 08-02-2012, 02:29 PM   #38
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Has that been apart before? Was there no center case gasket? It looks like high temp red silicone sealant on the center cases. I wonder why anyone would risk using that stuff. Hondabond HT is great stuff, it works well enough for Honda at the factory, but I thought they only applied it to the cam cover. I don't apply it in a bead then slap the cases together...that just leaves those big globs behind like in the pictures. I apply a thin bead as uniform as possible then go back and dab my index finger on the bead all the way around the case so there is a nice uniform "textured" appearance to the sealant when I'm done. When you put the cases together you get a nice thin amount of sealant squishing out like it comes from the factory...no blobs squishing inside or outside the cases. Excess sealant inside the case can break loose and get into oil passages and starve the internals of oil flow...gotta be careful with sealant..

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Old 08-02-2012, 02:32 PM   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mcma111 View Post
The main and balancer bearings may be Honda specific.
I reckon so Steve. The main bearings are still listed as available but the balance-shaft bearings aren't. I'll find 'em though
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Old 08-02-2012, 02:38 PM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tech23 View Post
Has that been apart before? Was there no center case gasket? It looks like high temp red silicone sealant on the center cases. I wonder why anyone would risk using that stuff. Hondabond HT is great stuff, it works well enough for Honda at the factory, but I thought they only applied it to the cam cover. I don't apply it in a bead then slap the cases together...that just leaves those big globs behind like in the pictures. I apply a thin bead as uniform as possible then go back and dab my index finger on the bead all the way around the case so there is a nice uniform "textured" appearance to the sealant when I'm done. When you put the cases together you get a nice thin amount of sealant squishing out like it comes from the factory...no blobs squishing inside or outside the cases. Excess sealant inside the case can break loose and get into oil passages and starve the internals of oil flow...gotta be careful with sealant..

Tech23
You're absolutely right Tech23, your method is exactly how I would apply silicone sealant too - I would also allow the flattened 'bead' of gasket goo to go off slightly; used to work a treat on my old Thunderbird's primary chain cases . Apparently the previous builder didn't know any of that and didn't use a 'paper' gasket.

This was the clutch cover. He'd obviously used a tube of the orange stuff on the crankcases and only had black stuff left!



A full gasket set was delivered today!
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Old 08-02-2012, 03:28 PM   #41
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Balancer Bearings

From a Honda parts fich. The balancer bearings

BEARING, RADIAL BALL (16X44X13) (TOYO)

Ask your bearing supplier for a bearing by these dimensions and you should be good to go.
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Old 08-11-2012, 01:45 PM   #42
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Old 08-25-2012, 01:04 PM   #43
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Other priorities have eaten up money and, crucially, time, so the mains bearings, balance-shaft bearings and cam-chain will all have to wait 'til next month.

I've not been entirely idle though. I've finally removed the rotor and crankshaft and got round to fixing a couple of minor case issues.


A snapped drive chain caused both of these... firstly, a crack that would leak oil, near the generator wire outlet in the generator casing


and a broken stud boss (top of the sprocket cover)


Thought I'd try this stuff to make the repairs, I'll let you know if it's up to the job


The finish is a bit rough and ready and more time with the wet and dry would have resulted an invisible repair.

As you can see, after a good clean up, I decided to paint on a satin finish. I've really made a rod for my own back as I'll have to do all the other cases now too. Still, as it's brush painted, it's not going to look like it's out of a showroom

Next thing on the to do list is to clear up my workspace so I can progress the top end - cleaning, inspection, valve grinding, and so forth.
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Old 08-25-2012, 09:02 PM   #44
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Steve is right about Honda specific, the left side main non-genuine bearing to the same dimensions as the 6308 Honda bearing may have a smaller diameter relief radius and will not seat right up against the crank cheek which would make it tight when the cases are assembled.
I ordered it and when it turned up the bearing guy highlighted it so I checked the crank radius and he was right but there may be different dimensions on other brands.
I ordered the Honda bearing which only cost $20 more and got here quicker, it was for my XR600 but I imagine the crank specs match for bearings.
I had to get genuine balancer bearings as well because they could not match them in the time frame I had to get to the ADV OCR rally but 2012 XRL bearings might be the same part.

Ken

Quote:
Originally Posted by mcma111 View Post
The main and balancer bearings may be Honda specific.
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Old 08-25-2012, 10:54 PM   #45
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Same project different garage

I working right along beside you, probly at a slower pace though over in the main XL thread.
Pete
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