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Old 11-20-2012, 10:07 AM   #31
Pantah
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The comment about learning off road skills on a small motorcycle is probably the best advice so far. Nothing teaches technique faster than riding lightweight machines on low traction surfaces. But that might not be practical.

You just need lots more seat time. The stalling issue is a common problem and if you are on a tall motorcycle and it stalls at the wrong spot, you are likely to drop it. Particularly if it is a top heavy pig like the big adventure machines. Once those things start going down, it's pretty hard to pull them back up. I have dropped mine many times in very slow situations like parking lots or the intersection you discribed. I basically just step off rather than hurt myself trying to be a hero.

Since yours stalls a lot, you must have some sort of mechanical problem. My KTM 690 can stall when plonking through rock gardens and such. Once I discovered that I began feathering the clutch when the going gets too slow. But it takes lots of experience to make good use of such simple techniques.

Lowsiding on the tarmac is a serious error. Particularly if it is dry. You must not be very mindful of your grip limits. I hope you don't do that again.

Anyway, keep plugging and don't think about so much. It's not that hard.
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Pantah screwed with this post 11-21-2012 at 02:58 AM
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Old 11-20-2012, 12:09 PM   #32
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Time

It always takes me a year or so to get used to the manners of a new bike. Those two are truly different animals. Each ride you complete and keep it on two wheels will only increase your confidence. And, now you know two things that you can't do . . .
Keep at it!
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Old 11-20-2012, 12:56 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by ItalianRider View Post
I am 99% convinced that there's nothing wrong with the bike and it's my fault at this point ... so any tips or pointers anyone can offer ... I'll take it.
OK, go take a motorcycle course with your bike. Matters little what one you take. You will be under an instructors supervision and will get critiqued on what you are doing with your bike and your controlling of it. You will learn a whole lot. Different courses will teach you different things of course, but they will all help you to better control your bike.

If you can't find that, get with a friend who knows how to ride well and work with that friend on enhancing your skills. Have them watch you braking and turning and such.

And then for yourself, go practice things. Every time you ride. Personally, I pick a subject for each ride, and work on it during each ride. What I work on varies with each ride and what I think I need to improve the most.

foxtrapper screwed with this post 11-20-2012 at 04:55 PM Reason: remembered the word instructor!
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Old 11-20-2012, 04:14 PM   #34
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I don't know if this has been mentioned, but perhaps you're used to the high-end suspension on the Speed Triple, and the F700s lower-rent stuff is why you say you can't really feel the bike? To my knowledge, the F700 has a damper rod front and a very basic rear shock with minimal adjust-ability.
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Old 11-20-2012, 07:04 PM   #35
steve3b3
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Originally Posted by ItalianRider View Post
So ... I "crashed" my F700 again.

The first time was a month ago, when I was doing a tight right hand turn and lowsided. I leaned too hard and was going too fast and the rear wheel lost grip and I slid down the highway ramp for a good 200 feet or so.

I dislocated my arm, my bike's front fork got twisted, lots of little spots of damage here and there.

Today I crashed again. I was doing a left turn on a busy street and people coming from the opposite lane stopped to let me go.

I got the bike going as always, then I stalled it while leaned and down I went.

Not really crashed at high speed this time. It was lower speed and also now I got the engine guard, hand guards, etc.

Bike is fine and I fell on the left side. So the bike is basically looking like nothing happened. Same for me. Other than a bruised ego and a sore left leg.

But my most serious question is: WTF am I doing wrong??

I had a Speed Triple for a year. That's a liter sport bike. I have done some stupid, insane shit on my Triple and other than dropping it in a parking lot at a standstill because my side stand wasn't fully down, I never got into an accident with it.

I never dropped it "in motion".

This bike it's the second time in 2 months, and I got it 2 months ago ...

Seriously ... is it that the F700 falls more easily? Unlikely scenario

Is it that I suck and I just got lucky after 6000 miles of crazy shit on the Speed Triple?

I mean I rode the Triple like I stole it and nothing bad ever happened to it.

I am extra, extra careful with this one and today, without any justification or excuses, I screwed up and dropped it in a turn that should have been totally safe and fine and that I have done a million times on other bikes.

The F700 doesn't like me or my inner squid is coming out.

Or maybe the Triple was more stable than the F700 and was able to forgive the fact that I am not a good rider at all ...

Not quite sure what to think at this point.
In the first crash, it sounds to me like you've got a handle on what you did wrong.
My impression is that they were two dissimilar incidences.
Question: in the second incident, is it possible that you were in a higher gear than was appropriate? I've stalled my bike at low speed when I was in third when I should have been in a lower gear, and I wonder if you just haven't developed a feel for the proper gear for the speed.

I normally ride an ST1300, and bought a VStrom a year ago. I can't tell you the number of times I've stopped and not been in neutral or first gear when I attempted to start out again.

All the best,
Steve
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Old 11-21-2012, 12:54 AM   #36
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Originally Posted by Two Wheeled 'Tard View Post
I don't know if this has been mentioned, but perhaps you're used to the high-end suspension on the Speed Triple, and the F700s lower-rent stuff is why you say you can't really feel the bike? To my knowledge, the F700 has a damper rod front and a very basic rear shock with minimal adjust-ability.
It's an entry-level bike, and though the components are without a doubt quite basic, they do not cause crashes in situations described, its more of a user error. But maybe the OP's bike also has some sort of fuelling issue, that contributes to stalling the engine.
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Old 11-21-2012, 01:45 AM   #37
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First drop, most likely your 'problem' not used to the bike the handling or the level of grip.

The stalling, not so sure that's a user problem.

I had similar problems on my K6 DL when the idle speed crept down - tall top heavy pig, and when the engine cut, it just wanted to lie down. It also had budget level suspension, but not a lack of feel.

However a modern bike stalling multiple times is unlikely to be a user problem, it's more likely either a setup or a design problem.

Check the clutch adjustment, if possible up the idle speed, if you can't up it, bitch at the dealer and get it on record that the bike has a stalling problem.

Pete
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Old 11-21-2012, 03:48 AM   #38
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Originally Posted by Pecha72 View Post
It's an entry-level bike, and though the components are without a doubt quite basic, they do not cause crashes in situations described, its more of a user error. But maybe the OP's bike also has some sort of fuelling issue, that contributes to stalling the engine.
You're probably right. But I was thinking it may contribute heavily to the OP saying he doesn't have any ability to "feel" the bike and what the bike is doing, especially compared to something with fairly good suspension like his previous Speed Triple. Lack of feel of the bike may have caused him to over-estimate the grip and traction, especially with likely very different tire profiles and compounds when compared to the Triumph.

When I went from my SV650 with a GSX-R front end and a ZX-10 rear, to a V-Strom 650 with stock suspension, the difference was so astounded I almost found the V-Strom unrideable. It was so unpredictable and mushy when compared to my SV that I felt like I couldn't ever trust it. $2000 of suspension parts took care of it, but by the time I speced up the front end, rear shock, and brake calipers, I could probably have gotten a Tiger for the same money :\
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Old 11-21-2012, 04:37 AM   #39
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Originally Posted by Two Wheeled 'Tard View Post
...

When I went from my SV650 with a GSX-R front end and a ZX-10 rear, to a V-Strom 650 with stock suspension, the difference was so astounded I almost found the V-Strom unrideable. It was so unpredictable and mushy when compared to my SV that I felt like I couldn't ever trust it. $2000 of suspension parts took care of it, but by the time I speced up the front end, rear shock, and brake calipers, I could probably have gotten a Tiger for the same money :\
Add that to the fact that the engine seems to have a stalling issue and you pretty much nail how I feel ...

I'm sure that a better rider/more experienced rider would be able to handle this bike safely. I'm sure that if I keep at it, practice some more, take more classes with the F700, I'll get a better handle on it.

To fix this situation, the stalling engine issue needs to go away and I need to develop good habits and good muscle memory for riding this bike and rebuild confidence as well because right about now I feel none.
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Old 11-21-2012, 04:59 AM   #40
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That 700 can probably be lowered 1-1,5 inches quite easily, this usually helps a bit, if you're a little short for the bike (?) and have trouble holding it upright, when the engine stalls.

Another small help with the feel could be switching to full-on street tyres. I put Michelin Pilot Road 3's on mine (not a Beemer, its a DL650, but wheel size should be the same) and I'd say this greatly improved handling on tarmac compared to the OEM tyres, that are known to suck. What tyres your 700 comes with, is unknown to me though..

Pecha72 screwed with this post 11-21-2012 at 05:12 AM
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Old 11-21-2012, 05:21 AM   #41
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Add that to the fact that the engine seems to have a stalling issue and you pretty much nail how I feel ...

I'm sure that a better rider/more experienced rider would be able to handle this bike safely. I'm sure that if I keep at it, practice some more, take more classes with the F700, I'll get a better handle on it.

To fix this situation, the stalling engine issue needs to go away and I need to develop good habits and good muscle memory for riding this bike and rebuild confidence as well because right about now I feel none.
Perhaps a better rider could compensate for the low-rate suspension on the F700, but after having spent time on a bike with good suspension, it's not much fun trying to adapt to something worse.

If at all possible, you might want to consider upgrading the front suspension (as well as sorting out the stalling problem :) ). Some proper springs for your weight and Racetech cartridge emulators will make a WORLD of difference with how much feel you get of the front end through the handlebars, and they're relatively inexpensive. I think you can usually get them as a package for around $300.

I checked Racetech's site and they don't list the F700 but it probably shares forks with the F650 or F800, so you should still be able to get stuff for it.

Now as for upgrading the rear end, there's not many things you can do there that don't involve spending at least a thousand bucks :\

*edit* Not sure what rubber you're running, but something more specialized would probably help a great deal as well. Maybe a pure street tire if you're not taking it off road. They'll have a rounder profile and will probably feel much more familiar to you.
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Old 11-21-2012, 06:56 AM   #42
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To fix this situation, the stalling engine issue needs to go away
The stalling issue is you. Sorry.

I had a similar issue when I switched bikes during my training (in Germany) - I went from a rev-happy 250cc Kawi with a 12K redline to an F650 twin (previous of yours). I wanted to kill that bike - I must have stalled it ten times in the first session.

The parallel twins are not happy at the low end. They are not fast at the top end. The powerband is not a mile wide. You are going to have to get used to being on the throttle and feathering the clutch. It's just a very different motor and it does different things.

It's ok if you don't like it. There are lots of other bikes out there to ride!
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Old 11-21-2012, 08:49 AM   #43
Grainbelt
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If you stalled it, and you aren't getting a good feel from the controls, perhaps look into some nice adjustable levers. Check your throttle and clutch cables for binding, and adjust the free play to your liking. Adjust the rear brake and shift lever to your preference.

Those things all tend to go unnoticed and are usually left at whatever adjustment they were delivered at from the assembly schmuck at the dealer.

It seems unlikely that you're suddenly a hamfisted putz, but if you're not getting along with the bike, the above are easy to adjust or replace to get that loving feeling back.
Since this got absolutely no traction the first time around, I'll try it again.

Then I'll be done.
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Old 11-21-2012, 09:08 AM   #44
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Please allow myself to quote...............myself.
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Old 11-21-2012, 07:01 PM   #45
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Get a dual sport bike and ride it on sand, gravel, wet grass, etc.
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