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Old 11-20-2012, 06:29 AM   #91
ohgood
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Domromer View Post
Don't do it. Add 3 givi E45s to you klr and you have more storage than the Burgman, you also have a bike that's easy to work on, reliable and can be ridden everywhere. Oh and it's fun to ride.
what's this "work on" thing you speak of ? I don't believe you own a klr at all.



oh, or a scooter. neither requires this "work on" thing you've mentioned.
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Old 11-20-2012, 07:22 AM   #92
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Originally Posted by ohgood View Post
what's this "work on" thing you speak of ? I don't believe you own a klr at all.



oh, or a scooter. neither requires this "work on" thing you've mentioned.
I do all my own maintenance. This is one my main considerations when looking at bikes. For example Silverwing 15miutes to change air filter and spark plugs. Vstrom two hours requires removing fuel tank, fairing and moving radiator. Klr 15 minutes to do the job.
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Old 11-20-2012, 08:07 AM   #93
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From my experience, scooter tend to require maintenance more often than motorcycles and getting to things are complicated due to all the plastic. However, this varies from scooter to scooter as well as motorcycle to motorcycle.

Valve adjustments in particular can be very complicated on a scooter due to all the body work. Adjusting the valves on my KLR is easier than on my Sport City 250. This, despite the fact that the Sport City has Screw & Locknut adjusters and the KLR uses shims. Luckily, neither requires valve adjustments that often. On my Kymco on the other hand, Valve adjustments are very easy, but are required every 2500 miles. I have read that the valve adjustment on the Burgman 400 is very time consuming so you may want to look into that.
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Old 11-20-2012, 08:19 AM   #94
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Originally Posted by klaviator View Post
From my experience, scooter tend to require maintenance more often than motorcycles and getting to things are complicated due to all the plastic. However, this varies from scooter to scooter as well as motorcycle to motorcycle.

Valve adjustments in particular can be very complicated on a scooter due to all the body work. Adjusting the valves on my KLR is easier than on my Sport City 250. This, despite the fact that the Sport City has Screw & Locknut adjusters and the KLR uses shims. Luckily, neither requires valve adjustments that often. On my Kymco on the other hand, Valve adjustments are very easy, but are required every 2500 miles. I have read that the valve adjustment on the Burgman 400 is very time consuming so you may want to look into that.
ya, I heard about some of that, body panel mess. yuck

4 bolts and the entire rear of my cheap chinese scooter comes off, engine is -right-there-. the drz takes longer to change throttle cables than I think the entire scooters assembly time.
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Old 11-20-2012, 01:24 PM   #95
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Interesting thread. My everyday ride is a Vespa GTS 250 and I also have a Triumph Tiger 800. I've had 2 or 3 other scooters and a selection of Honda and Ducati motorcycles over the years and I can say with confidence that the Vespa is my all time favorite daily ride. With a Givi topbox I can fit a week's worth of groceries or use the bike for riding into downtown Denver and parking just about anywhere.

While I love the Vespa, I have not been able to find a real maxi scooter that I prefer over a motorcycle. The T-Max comes close as do the Piaggio and Aprilia 500's, but I'm not sure the latter 2 are really maxis. I'm hoping the new BMW's do the the trick but right now I'm still very happy with the Triumph.

I think most of the positives and negatives have been covered already. The only thing I'd emphasize again is that the standard scooter riding posture isn't always comfortable for long stints in the saddle. You need to make sure you're actually comfy on whatever scoot you decide on. It helps if there's room on the floorboards to move your feet fore and aft. It also helps to take a long test ride. Good luck!
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Old 11-20-2012, 01:53 PM   #96
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Heck, I rode motorcycles for years. I have been riding a scooter for a while now because of a bad back

I saw a motorcycle in the local shop I sure would like to have. Its a 2007 Honda Shadow Spirit with 3500 miles. The seat height is only 25 inches high. Surely I could get my leg over it..

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Old 11-21-2012, 06:47 PM   #97
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Originally Posted by doogiepooch View Post
Looking for a little advice or devil's advocate or encouragement....whatever you want to throw out. I'd be buying new, probably trading after the first of the year for a 13' 400 Burgman.

... Interstate, yes I know they'll do it all day long but I want to hear from some guys that use them for travel. I've read some stuff about some oil burn if you hold it at high interstate speeds for hours on end, anything to this? I'm certainly familiar with singles burning oil at constant high speeds but will it do 70-75 mph without burning? Guys that have dropped from a bike to a scooter.....do you miss a bike much or do all the positive of a scooter make up for it?
I'll pass on some quick thoughts...

Yes, you can ride at interstate speeds for hours on end. I completed a SS1000 last June on mine and felt it was extremely comfortable. Much like a barcalounger. :) While I've put 70,000 miles on a Burgman 400 in the past few years commuting north and south on I-5 in Seattle, I also take it for day long trips in the state. Those are 300-400 mile days. It does camping well, because you have 62 liters of storage space under the seat...and then you can load up a top box and the pillion.

If you're interested in cruising at "high" interstate speeds...like 15-20+ mph over the speed limit, you probably should look elsewhere. It'll do it, but you'd be better off with an ST1300...till you lose your license. ;)

The oil burning you've heard about is primarily with the 2006 and earlier model 400. Some did it, others didn't. But at sustained high speeds, they would suck oil back up through the air cleaner and burn a lot. The engine (as well as the rest of the bike) was totally redesigned for 2007, so that problem is pretty much been eliminated.

My "drop" from a bike to a scooter had about 20 year in between, so I can't really speak to that. But like everyone else, I like to look at bikes and think of what would it be like. I haven't found any bike better yet. Each bike will do something perhaps better, but the total package is a compromise with what I already have.
  • Fun factor. The 400 is simply a delight to toss into a curve. Even freeway onramps are a blast. Find a curvy road and while a sport bike will pass you, you'll have a ton of fun in those turns and do pretty well keeping up. Most cruisers will be left way behind.
  • Storage. The 400 has more than any other maxi-scooter in the world, and it is all usable. Use the bike on your daily commute and on the way home, stop at Costco. You...and anyone else around...will be surprised at what you can take home.
  • Power. It won't snap your neck with the acceleration, but you'll surprise yourself when you see just how fast you're going. That's both because of how fast it'll get to speeds to earn you a "performance award" and how deceptively well it handles at high speeds. The first time I got an experience like that was when I was trying to catch a group I'd been riding with. As I was closing in on them, I looked down and saw I was at 96 mph and still accelerating. I had no idea. It felt like 60 or 70.
  • Economy. The 400 drinks gas like a 250cc scooter. I don't know how they do it, but this bike gets mid-60s in the summer with low 70's on trips.
  • Maintenance. It's simple and easy on the pocketbook. The expensive items like the CVT belt last about 50% longer than the maintenance interval suggests. Valve adjustment is about double. Tires cost about $60 each and last about 15K. That's cheap for a motorcycle.
  • That fairing...is nice. You won't appreciate it nearly as much in the summer (with the exception of the bugs it stops), but in the winter it keeps a lot of the cold and wet from hitting you. And the floorboard keeps the feet dry and gives you different seating positions.
  • Riding position. I lean forward in a "sport touring" position and find my back doesn't hurt like some people's backs do. Plus, it distributes the weight more evenly, which helps a lot in handling. That sport-touring position is also one that is restful for long rides. I was coming home with a group of riders after going up to Artist Point at Mt. Baker. We had a Ducati rider join us several times on the way back. The reason he kept joining us was that he'd pass us ...and then have to stop a half hour later. The weight on his wrists was too painful for anything longer.
Unless you need ABS, I'd look seriously at used 400s. From 2007 and on, they are pretty much the same. ABS came in 2011. I don't think you'll find any difference at all between a 2011 and 2012 except a few thousand in depreciation. Many people buy them on a whim and never ride them past the break in mileage. So you could find yourself a good deal. BTW, try using a search engine called SearchTempest. It does a search of Craigslist ads for a range of miles around and puts the results on one page. It's how I found my current Burgman.

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Old 11-22-2012, 08:34 AM   #98
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@ Daboo, well said.
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Old 11-22-2012, 05:01 PM   #99
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That's some excellent evidence. If you need to ride mixed roads, keep the KLR. If your riding is mostly on pavement, the Burg will treat you well. We all need to adapt the ride to the road. In this case, the Burg may be a good match.

I never felt like a sissy on a scooter. I still have great admiration for the SYM HD200. If I rode that machine correctly, I could leave most of the pack in the dust. It had 175 cc's. It returned 72 mpg. If a scooter is something you're comfortable with, be comfortable on a scooter. They are outstanding machines.
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Old 11-28-2012, 03:21 AM   #100
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If the cut-out between your knees is not so important and YOU want more in the way of a motorcycle, then this may suit you better:


Honda NC700D

Honda NC700 OC Forums
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Old 11-28-2012, 03:15 PM   #101
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If the cut-out between your knees is not so important and YOU want more in the way of a motorcycle, then this may suit you better:


Honda NC700D

Honda NC700 OC Forums
I agree. If and when that Integra comes to the U.S., I'll be standing in line for one.
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Old 11-28-2012, 03:25 PM   #102
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That certainly blurs the line between scooter and motorcycle. Too bad it's chain drive and not even an enclosed chain.

Quote:
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If the cut-out between your knees is not so important and YOU want more in the way of a motorcycle, then this may suit you better:


Honda NC700D

Honda NC700 OC Forums
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Old 11-29-2012, 12:54 AM   #103
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That certainly blurs the line between scooter and motorcycle. Too bad it's chain drive and not even an enclosed chain.
My opinion is that Honda has been spending the last six-seven years making some terrible mistakes in marketing- or, rather on deciding what to finish and bring to market.

BMW are just introducing a sporty and a tourer types in the 650cc engine size maxi-scooter category.

Just SIX years ago, Honda showed their concept that has never materialized-





1600 x 1200 pixel picture of left side E4-01 rear hub --- its a shaftie!

1600 x 1200 pixel picture of E4-01 dash - it has an Airbab & integrated GPS!


Under seat space for two jet-style helmets

17" wheels and a 903cc inline triple liquid-cooled engine.

Instead of THIS they marketed the DN-01, to be followed by that chain-driven Integra with 51HP (or 47HP) 670 cc a 270˚ crankshaft V-Twin engine and its 15 litres (0.53 cu ft) of under-seat storage.
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Old 11-29-2012, 06:22 AM   #104
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That certainly blurs the line between scooter and motorcycle. Too bad it's chain drive and not even an enclosed chain.
Thanks for pointing out the lack of an "enclosed chain". I've lost interest in the Integra until they update to an oil enclosed chain, belt or shaft drive. In this day and age, an open chain on a scooter seems absurd.
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Old 11-29-2012, 06:49 AM   #105
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When I compare the Burgman or the Integra or any other maxi scooter to my old Silverwing Interstate (motorcycle) I just don't see a big advantage to the new designs that would justify the cost of an upgrade. Weather protection to the legs and feet are better on the maxi scoots but that difference could be minimized with fairing lowers on the old SWing. Weight, horsepower, storage capacity, fuel capacity are all similar. The SWing has shaft drive, large wheels with tubeless tires, air adjustable shocks, and easy (and low) maintenance since the engine is out in the open. EFI is nice but IMO they haven't made any huge advancements in technology in the last 30 years.
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