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Old 11-28-2012, 10:56 AM   #71476
Mongle
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Feelers View Post
Shouldn't we be seeing around 40 or so ft-lbs for the torque as well?
No

HP and Torque are mathmatical.

HP= Torque x rpm / 5252
Torque= 5252 x HP /rpm

A DR making 40 ft lbs of torque at say 6000 rpm would have almost 47 HP...which would be nice...but probably not possible in stock form.

edit: 5252 is a constant number in the math...if you look at a dyno chart HP and Torque ALWAYS cross at 5252 rpm...if it doesn't something is wrong.

Mongle screwed with this post 11-28-2012 at 11:02 AM
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Old 11-28-2012, 11:14 AM   #71477
Rusty Rocket
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Quote:
Originally Posted by acesandeights View Post
Yep, I'll need a new rear spring. Doesn't Cogent just rebuild your shock using Racetech components (maybe I'm way off)? I wonder why people use him if they can buy the Racetech shock shaft assy, or do the Gold Valve for even less? Not knocking Cogent, but I just don't understand what he does that Racetech doesn't offer as an assembly, or as a Gold Valve kit? Why would sending it to Cogent be better than the shock shaft assembly? Maybe Cogent isn't using Racetech components/Gold Valve?
Cogent puts his own parts in the shock and you end up with a knob on the bottom of the shaft that has 30 clicks of rebound damping adjustment. Cogent also offers a hard anodize coating for a few bucks more that I believe is a good idea if the shock is of a certain age, if you know what I mean.

see the red knob in the photo: not there with a RaceTech mod. you live with the damping as it comes. Cogent is adjustable.

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Old 11-28-2012, 11:15 AM   #71478
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Quote:
Originally Posted by acesandeights View Post
Yep, I'll need a new rear spring. Doesn't Cogent just rebuild your shock using Racetech components (maybe I'm way off)? I wonder why people use him if they can buy the Racetech shock shaft assy, or do the Gold Valve for even less? Not knocking Cogent, but I just don't understand what he does that Racetech doesn't offer as an assembly, or as a Gold Valve kit? Why would sending it to Cogent be better than the shock shaft assembly? Maybe Cogent isn't using Racetech components/Gold Valve?
They add rebound damping.

Reusing our stock shock body keeps the remote oil resevoir, additional oil capacity adds to cooler running and longer service life. I have 27,xxx miles on my Cogent.

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Originally Posted by Threewheelbonnie View Post
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Old 11-28-2012, 11:20 AM   #71479
Rusty Rocket
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mongle View Post
No

HP and Torque are mathmatical.

HP= Torque x rpm / 5252
Torque= 5252 x HP /rpm

A DR making 40 ft lbs of torque at say 6000 rpm would have almost 47 HP...which would be nice...but probably not possible in stock form.

edit: 5252 is a constant number in the math...if you look at a dyno chart HP and Torque ALWAYS cross at 5252 rpm...if it doesn't something is wrong.
Horsepower can be misleading. 2 engines making equal foot-lbs of torque will have different horsepowers if they are acheiving them at different RPM's. The engine making the same torque at the higher RPM will have a higher horsepower. Say a 125 makes 40 ft-lbs torque @ 10,000 rpm and a 650 makes 40 ft-lbs at 6500, the 125 will have more HP> I'd rather have my torque from a lower revving engine so it lasts longer



The old saying (If I remember it correctly) Power, light-weight, reliability; choose any two.
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Old 11-28-2012, 11:41 AM   #71480
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Per Racetech and Procycle's site the Racetech has that same knob, with rebound adjustment.
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Old 11-28-2012, 11:49 AM   #71481
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rex Nemo View Post
Yep, the dyno is old and crotchety, and the 02 and C02 numbers are highly suspect (in-pipe sensor may be at fault).
The failure mode of the type of O2 sensor used in the Andros gas bench is that it begins to read higher than normal. I suppose that if left uncorrected indefinitely, perhaps it could read as high as ambient. The software should throw a flag if the sensor is bad (unless it was spanned when it was no longer new). You can take the sensor out and check the voltage across the terminals. It should read 9-13mV, with much below 9mV meaning the sensor is bad.

HC is also quite low, perhaps unrealistically so. Unfortunately it is the infrared part of the bench that reads CO2, HC and CO. I therefore suspect that the CO readings are inaccurate as well.

A leak on the vacuum side of the pump would produce high O2 and low HC & CO2 (perhaps the drain valve in the first water trap is open). What doesn't seem to jive is that a leak on the vacuum side should also produce low CO, but the CO is in fact too high. That either shoots my theory to hell, or indicates that the CO is in fact much, much higher than the reading (!).
Quote:
Would that affect the hp or torque ratings?
These readings do indirectly affect the HP and torque readings. If the CO is in fact inaccurate, and is in reality through the roof, then torque and HP would improve based on the jetting being corrected (it should improve a bit even if the CO was accurate).
Quote:
If so, back to the drawing board.
To get a proper apples to apples sense of which of the parts work better, the combinations must be compared to one another when jetted correctly (I noticed that you don't have a CO trace for both runs, so you'd not be able to compare even if the data were not suspect). I would therefore fix whatever was wrong with the EGA and start over.

Regards,

Derek
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Old 11-28-2012, 12:27 PM   #71482
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Quote:
Originally Posted by acesandeights View Post
Per Racetech and Procycle's site the Racetech has that same knob, with rebound adjustment.
I learn something new every day.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Threewheelbonnie View Post
"BTW, I don't do style. It's a dirt bike, not some girlie dress-up thing." -
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Old 11-28-2012, 12:28 PM   #71483
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Quote:
Originally Posted by acesandeights View Post
Per Racetech and Procycle's site the Racetech has that same knob, with rebound adjustment.

Here's an informative thread on the Cogent shock for the DR650. http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=301968
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Old 11-28-2012, 12:41 PM   #71484
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Thanks vfr. I'm probably missing it, but what sets the Cogent apart from the Racetech shock shaft assembly, and is it just different, better, or both?
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Old 11-28-2012, 01:38 PM   #71485
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Quote:
Originally Posted by acesandeights View Post
Thanks vfr. I'm probably missing it, but what sets the Cogent apart from the Racetech shock shaft assembly, and is it just different, better, or both?


Not sure what the differences are other than the optional hard anodized coating. The Cogent was the only option I was aware of when I was looking to upgrade. There are a few more choices now. If you have access to nitrogen for the refill, the Race Tech option may save you a few bucks. I'm guessing the end result between the Cogent and the Race Tech assembly will be very similar.

Edit: Here's what sets them apart...


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Lil' Steve screwed with this post 11-28-2012 at 03:28 PM
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Old 11-28-2012, 04:54 PM   #71486
deathu
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rear rack with tool storage compartment?

I'm currently searching for a rear luggage rack that also has some sort of "built-in" tool storage space under it. Up to this point I didn't find anything for sale or even custom built.

My idea is to have little tool boxes built under the sides of this rack, basically between the rack and the exhaust side panel, and similarly on the left side. I will have the rack fabricated by a local welder guy, but it's always better to see what others have done before designing your own rack/accessories, as you can improve the design or simply borrow neat ideas.
So if anyone has built such a thing, or knows such a product, a few pictures would be more than welcome.
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Old 11-28-2012, 05:28 PM   #71487
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rpet View Post
Thank you! I will do bars and wheel first, and decide on the seat based on whether I get knee pain. .
Knee pain consideration is what is stopping me right now from giving my DR company in the garage with a new Multi Strada.




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Old 11-28-2012, 05:46 PM   #71488
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Adv Grifter View Post
Lots of guys run risers and Pro Taper bars. Good set up.

Most custom seat makers can build a "Tall" version, raising you up at least an inch, maybe two? Should help transitioning from seated to standing.

What is your thinking on the 18" wheel? It WILL raise the bike up quite a bit, depending on tire you use. Other than that, what is the advantage? Where will you source the wheel? Will the bearings (Hubb and wheel) hold up with an 18" wheel? Also, fewer 50/50 and street based dual sport tires available in 18". Your choice. If doing "all dirt" then the 18" makes more sense.

In the end, Ergos are quite subjective. Mess around, try different things, go riding, make adjustments as needed!



If you're a trail rider ... then your first concern should be suspension. But since you're only 155 lbs. (lucky bastard!! ) The stock DR spring rates are not too bad for you ... but still will be a bit "quishy" for aggressive riding. The DR's handling (both ON and OFF road) responds really nicely to suspension upgrades. Just for future thought and upgrades.
FMF
I'm not an FMF fan ... I know them well, have used their products on dirt bikes (and street) since the late 80's. My DR650 came with an FMF pipe ... the rivets started coming out at 4000 miles. I sold it. Also, it was TOO LOUD ... and needed constant repacking. FMF pipes fall apart. IMO? JUNK.

The current hot set up for the DR650 is the Titanium GSXR pipe. It's not as light as the FMF but is super high quality ... will last forever, NOT TOO LOUD. Flows pretty well too.

Thanks for the tips!

Suspension will definitely happen for the "final build" on this bike for next summer. I'm weighing the options there too.

18" is for more clearance, better dirt tire selection, more offroad-ability. I'm fine with the DS tires available in 18", and it seems that the 18" upgrade is simple to do, with a few different source options (DR350 wheel, new wheel from procycle, re-lace original hub).

I was lead to believe the GSXR pipes were getting harder to source, and the overall cost could be more, with the header required, but I will look more into that.

My question was more about what a header upgrade (regardless of muffler) is even getting me on a stock engine. I'm just skeptical of header upgrades, I guess. FMF is partially responsible for that... various "bombs" that give you .3 HP of "seat of the pants grunt." heh
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Old 11-28-2012, 06:58 PM   #71489
PPCLI-Jim
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deathu View Post
I'm currently searching for a rear luggage rack that also has some sort of "built-in" tool storage space under it. Up to this point I didn't find anything for sale or even custom built.

My idea is to have little tool boxes built under the sides of this rack, basically between the rack and the exhaust side panel, and similarly on the left side. I will have the rack fabricated by a local welder guy, but it's always better to see what others have done before designing your own rack/accessories, as you can improve the design or simply borrow neat ideas.
So if anyone has built such a thing, or knows such a product, a few pictures would be more than welcome.
the Rotopax company makes something like what you are asking about heres a link to all their products
http://www.rotopax.com/All-Packs/
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PPCLI-Jim screwed with this post 11-28-2012 at 07:00 PM Reason: found the link
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Old 11-28-2012, 07:01 PM   #71490
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Albie View Post
Looks good!!

Thanks Albie.

The seat feels much better for me and I am ready to put some time on the bike. I am sure I will like it a lot more than I do already. The KLR will be for sale (maybe) after I ride the DR some miles.
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