How important is 2 wheel drive

[DirtDabber]

Originally Posted by madeouttaglass

He needs five wheel drive.

Think of the places he could go.....

[Agent Wayward]

No one has mentioned the downside of the handling character on the 2WD Ural. The sidecar wheel lead is totally different than that of the RWD Ural, this gives, (to my mind) quite unpleasant handling on the vast majority of roads.

Also worth noting is that the 2WD Ural has no differential, so you cannot use the 2WD unless you are on a loose surface, if you do, transmission wind up will see you in the hedge.

I don't own a Ural, so have no vested interest in either.

[oppozit]

Let's put it this way, since the invention of sidecar wheel drive (2WD) in both the Soviet Union and Great Britain in 1928, how many 2WD outfits have been built? 100,000 to 150,000. How many outfits have been built? Probably well in excess of thirty million. Is it needed? For most people, apparently not.

[EvilClown]

Originally Posted by CBRider

...
What I am not sure of is how important 2 wheel drive is. I'll be riding a lot of small county roads, many will be dirt/gravel, but not real steep or rocky. Also I will occasionally head out to the Big Bend area. I think a reverse gear is important, but how about 2 wheel drive? Will I regret getting a hack with single drive?

Any input is appreciated...

Not very and no.

Momentum is your friend. With the conditions you describe, even that won't be necessary.

Pull the trigger and don't look back.

[windmill]

"Need" vs. useful.

My wife doesn't "need" a AWD car, but sometimes it is very useful getting to her patients homes in the winter, or when they live up in the hills on muddy dirt roads.
Before she had it, sometimes I had to get up early and put chains on her car, sometimes she stayed home, or sometimes she passed them on to others more capable vehicles.

99% of the time it isn't "needed", but that 1% can be a significant amount of time and effort saved if you have it, sometimes it can be very useful. All depends on when and where you ride.

[madeouttaglass]

I agree that you probably don't "need" it. There is also the resale to think about. From what I've seen on ebay closed auctions and the various Ural forums the used 2WDs bring the extra money back when they're sold. The same can be said for rear Vs. 4 wheel drive trucks in most places.

[YOUNZ]

All things considered, cost, complexity, reliability, frequency of use, universality, etc, it seems a well designed electric motor assist for reverse and sidecar power is the best compromise for on and off road. Emphasis on well designed!

[Mr. Cob]

Originally Posted by YOUNZ

All things considered, cost, complexity, reliability, frequency of use, universality, etc, it seems a well designed electric motor assist for reverse and sidecar power is the best compromise for on and off road. Emphasis on well designed!

Howdy YOUNZ,

Just my opinion and we all know what opinions are worth, compared to the SIMPLE mechanical reverse and two wheel drive already built into the Ural, I fail to understand how adding something like a electric reverse and two wheel drive would be practical.

Adding electrical components will only increase the chance of something going wrong when you need it most. Wires get cut or smashed, motors burn out, connections get dirty or corrode, you would have to have some sort of speed control, all these things would add complexity. Again like I said just my opinion.

One of the things I like most about the Ural is its over all SIMPLICITY, it just works and if it doesn't work its easy to fix.

[YOUNZ]

Originally Posted by YOUNZ

All things considered, cost, complexity, reliability, frequency of use, universality, etc, it seems a well designed electric motor assist for reverse and sidecar power is the best compromise for on and off road. Emphasis on well designed!

Perhaps, the electric motor driving the the front tire? A knobby!

[Sidecar Jockey]

I Have a 1 wheel drive 2003 Ural tourist. I drive it in the snow every change i get. I live in the Applacian mountains and the one wheel drive version has no trouble on twisty mountain roads covered with 3 inches of snow, as long as you have a good knobby pusher tire.

I have done many stream corssings, and driven on some muddy rutty roads without getting stuck. I have turned around to avoid huge swampy sink holes though, so some common sense will get you a long way.

With the exception of sand or really deep mud, you do not need 2 wheel drive.

Like has been previously said, there is no differential, so the sidecar wheel MUST slip when 2wd is engaged. The drive ratio of the sidecar wheel is LOWER than that of the rear wheel of the bike, so if the sidecar wheel can't slip you will either drive in a circle or blow out your tranny. I know Ural owners that had the latter happen...

If youre going to go mud bogging or ride through the desert, get 2wd. If not, save some money and get 1wd.

I have 'dual sport' style DOT tires on my Ural, but I have a very aggressive full knobby on my spare wheel. That way i can change to my serious off road tire if I plan on getting really muddy. BUT, you have to plan ahead and switch tires BEFORE you get stuck...

[YOUNZ]

Originally Posted by Mr. Cob

Howdy YOUNZ,

Just my opinion and we all know what opinions are worth, compared to the SIMPLE mechanical reverse and two wheel drive already built into the Ural, I fail to understand how adding something like a electric reverse and two wheel drive would be practical.

Adding electrical components will only increase the chance of something going wrong when you need it most. Wires get cut or smashed, motors burn out, connections get dirty or corrode, you would have to have some sort of speed control, all these things would add complexity. Again like I said just my opinion.

One of the things I like most about the Ural is its over all SIMPLICITY, it just works and if it doesn't work its easy to fix.

I was thinking, for those that don't own a 2 wheel drive/reverse Ural. That's why I mentioned Universality.

[madeouttaglass]

Originally Posted by Sidecar Jockey

I

Like has been previously said, there is no differential, so the sidecar wheel MUST slip when 2wd is engaged. The drive ratio of the sidecar wheel is LOWER than that of the rear wheel of the bike, so if the sidecar wheel can't slip you will either drive in a circle or blow out your tranny. I know Ural owners that had the latter happen...
.

Really? I'd be interested to see their Urals. Every one I've ever seen (including my own) has a driveshaft straight off the rear end to the axle stub on the sidecar. I'd like to know where their gear reduction is hidden.

[Sidecar Jockey]

Originally Posted by madeouttaglass

Really? I'd be interested to see their Urals. Every one I've ever seen (including my own) has a driveshaft straight off the rear end to the axle stub on the sidecar. I'd like to know where their gear reduction is hidden.

When I said 'no differential' I really meant 'no limited slip'. It obviously has a differential, but both wheels are locked together all the time, therefore one wheel MUST BE SLIPPING (losing traction) ALL THE TIME to avoid driving in a circle or blowing the tranny/differential. This is NOT bad, it just means you need to be on really slippery stuff before engaging the 2wd. For example, it would not use it on 'normal' dirt roads...


I'll be happy to show you where the reduction is hidden:


The part of the rear differential outlined in red is NOT on the 1 wheel drive differential. This is where the gear reduction occurs, simply by having a different number of teeth on the bevel gear that drives the sidecar wheel than on the bevel gear the drives the bike's rear wheel.


To be more specific, the circled gear is what causes the reduction. The gears pictured above are inside the case circled in the first photo. The circled gear drives off of the pictured ring gear in the Ural's differential, and indexes into the sidecar's drive shaft. It has absolutely NOTHING to do with the gearing of the bike's wheel.

In theory, you could have a custom one of these made, with more teeth, to make a 1:1 drive ratio of the bike wheel to sidecar wheel, but I have never seen this done. I imagine it is because it would be impossible to turn your rig with both wheels driving and gripping on pavement...

I'm NOT bashing 2wd. If I had the extra money at the time that I bought my Ural, I would have bought 2wd. I didnt have the extra cash at the time, so I bought 1wd. I'm just saying that I'm very happy with my bike, and do not think that I would NEED to use 2wd if I had it.

[Mr. Cob]

Originally Posted by Sidecar Jockey

I Have a 1 wheel drive 2003 Ural tourist. I drive it in the snow every change i get. I live in the Applacian mountains and the one wheel drive version has no trouble on twisty mountain roads covered with 3 inches of snow, as long as you have a good knobby pusher tire.

I have done many stream corssings, and driven on some muddy rutty roads without getting stuck. I have turned around to avoid huge swampy sink holes though, so some common sense will get you a long way.

With the exception of sand or really deep mud, you do not need 2 wheel drive.

Like has been previously said, there is no differential, so the sidecar wheel MUST slip when 2wd is engaged. The drive ratio of the sidecar wheel is LOWER than that of the rear wheel of the bike, so if the sidecar wheel can't slip you will either drive in a circle or blow out your tranny. I know Ural owners that had the latter happen...

If youre going to go mud bogging or ride through the desert, get 2wd. If not, save some money and get 1wd.

I have 'dual sport' style DOT tires on my Ural, but I have a very aggressive full knobby on my spare wheel. That way i can change to my serious off road tire if I plan on getting really muddy. BUT, you have to plan ahead and switch tires BEFORE you get stuck...

Howdy Sidecar Jockey,

I have no idea what Ural your talking about when you make this statement,

Quoting from your post.
The drive ratio of the sidecar wheel is LOWER than that of the rear wheel of the bike, so if the sidecar wheel can't slip you will either drive in a circle or blow out your tranny. I know Ural owners that had the latter happen...
End of Quote.

On the late model two wheel drive Ural's, WITHOUT a differential, the pusher wheel and the sidecar wheel, WHEN two wheel drive is engaged DRIVE and ROTATE at the SAME SPEED.


I think you are confused in this issue, but then again I could be full of $hite but I doubt it.

[Mr. Cob]

Originally Posted by Sidecar Jockey

When I said 'no differential' I really meant 'no limited slip'. It obviously has a differential, but both wheels are locked together all the time, therefore one wheel MUST BE SLIPPING (losing traction) ALL THE TIME to avoid driving in a circle or blowing the tranny/differential. This is NOT bad, it just means you need to be on really slippery stuff before engaging the 2wd. For example, it would not use it on 'normal' dirt roads...


I'll be happy to show you where the reduction is hidden:


The part of the rear differential outlined in red is NOT on the 1 wheel drive differential. This is where the gear reduction occurs, simply by having a different number of teeth on the bevel gear that drives the sidecar wheel than on the bevel gear the drives the bike's rear wheel.


To be more specific, the circled gear is what causes the reduction. The gears pictured above are inside the case circled in the first photo. The circled gear drives off of the pictured ring gear in the Ural's differential, and indexes into the sidecar's drive shaft. It has absolutely NOTHING to do with the gearing of the bike's wheel.

In theory, you could have a custom one of these made, with more teeth, to make a 1:1 drive ratio of the bike wheel to sidecar wheel, but I have never seen this done. I imagine it is because it would be impossible to turn your rig with both wheels driving and gripping on pavement...

I'm NOT bashing 2wd. If I had the extra money at the time that I bought my Ural, I would have bought 2wd. I didnt have the extra cash at the time, so I bought 1wd. I'm just saying that I'm very happy with my bike, and do not think that I would NEED to use 2wd if I had it.

The gears in the photo you posted are the ring and pinion gear in the final drive unit it itself, the gear you have circled in red is the pinion gear, it is driven by the drive-shaft coming from the transmission. In my opinion you don't have a clue what your talking about but like I said I may be totally full of$hite.