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Old 01-06-2013, 06:35 PM   #15271
DaFoole
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WARRIORPRINCEJJ View Post
Whew! Thanks AC! I was startin' to have Euro-bike flashbacks.


In fact, I was already diggin' thru the brand-new service manual, that my Brother gave me for Christmas. And, I have the mechanical aptitude of a potato. So, that's when shit starts gettin' real interesting, in my garage.

.

That there is a great sig line....
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Old 01-07-2013, 03:08 AM   #15272
Old Git Ray
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Originally Posted by Old Git Ray View Post
Small problem with that...I think.

I am getting mine done next month but it is from an ECU-Unleashed satellite dealer in the UK. http://www.raceengineering.info/

So my flash will probably be US spec. On top of that, having spoken to them, they are a bit unhappy with the results obtained when they flashed an S10, so they are looking at removing the O2 sensors and rejigging it. Apparently one bike ran well enough but then started generating fault codes. The bike may have been modified in other ways too (exhaust/filter etc). The off idle fueling was the problem IIRC.
I was phoning international so I did not go into detail but I arrived back in the UK yesterday so I will get better details when I go and see them in the New Year. Fortunately they are only 30mins drive from me. It is likely that I will lend them my bike to do some testing with.

I will up date when I know some more.
I handed my bike over to the engineer on Saturday. He will likely keep it for a month while he designs and manufactures a work around for the O2 sensors. Apparently what happens (and this is a UK bike with a different ECU and we have different fuel here) is that with the US ECU Unleashed flash, the ECU kind of figures out that there is a difference on the O2 sensor to what it normally receives and compensates for it. It remembers that compensation and then compensates again...and again etc, until the engine fault light comes on.
Apparently this happens with a lot of ECUs but on most bikes (i.e.older) the problem is not progressive and he also states that often, production racers have the same engine light come on and ignore it (he tunes race bikes for a living).

What he is doing is designing an electronic unit to interface between the O2 sensor plug/socket. He showed me one for another bike, it is a small circuit board in a box with a plug and socket extending from it. Unfortunately the S10 needs 2. On a lot of other bikes, (i.e. the TDM850,) the O2 sensor can just be disconnected, but the S10 gets the hump if this is done.

This is what he has got so far.... It probably (understandably) mirrors the ECU Unleashed one.


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Old 01-07-2013, 03:29 AM   #15273
twinrider
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Old Git Ray View Post
I handed my bike over to the engineer on Saturday. He will likely keep it for a month while he designs and manufactures a work around for the O2 sensors. Apparently what happens (and this is a UK bike with a different ECU and we have different fuel here) is that with the US ECU Unleashed flash, the ECU kind of figures out that there is a difference on the O2 sensor to what it normally receives and compensates for it. It remembers that compensation and then compensates again...and again etc, until the engine fault light comes on.
Apparently this happens with a lot of ECUs but on most bikes (i.e.older) the problem is not progressive and he also states that often, production racers have the same engine light come on and ignore it (he tunes race bikes for a living).

What he is doing is designing an electronic unit to interface between the O2 sensor plug/socket. He showed me one for another bike, it is a small circuit board in a box with a plug and socket extending from it. Unfortunately the S10 needs 2. On a lot of other bikes, (i.e. the TDM850,) the O2 sensor can just be disconnected, but the S10 gets the hump if this is done.

This is what he has got so far.... It probably (understandably) mirrors the ECU Unleashed one.
Interesting and raises the question of how Diapason and OTR manage to successfully reflash EU-spec ECUs without needing the interfaces. Has he checked into that?
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Old 01-07-2013, 04:48 AM   #15274
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Originally Posted by twinrider View Post
Interesting and raises the question of how Diapason and OTR manage to successfully reflash EU-spec ECUs without needing the interfaces. Has he checked into that?
I have no idea if he has, but I would feel it unlikely as they are competing companies and are unlikely to discuss what are essentially, company secrets.
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Old 01-07-2013, 05:08 AM   #15275
twinrider
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Originally Posted by Old Git Ray View Post
I have no idea if he has, but I would feel it unlikely as they are competing companies and are unlikely to discuss what are essentially, company secrets.
I was thinking more along the lines of him scrutinizing an ECU that has been flashed by the competition as he should be able see what changes they've made. In any case, I'm about as far from an expert as you can get but it seems like he is rebuilding the wheel with added complications. Just a bit surprising considering he has the resources of ECU Unleashed at hand.

Still interested in the outcome though...
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Old 01-07-2013, 06:13 AM   #15276
Tim
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Originally Posted by Old Git Ray View Post
(and this is a UK bike with a different ECU and we have different fuel here)
That's interesting Ray, I didn't know that. I suppose that that may be why I haven't noticed the famous "off idle stumble" that many others have complained about. (Either that or I'm too ham-fisted to notice!)
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Old 01-07-2013, 06:31 AM   #15277
Old Git Ray
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Originally Posted by Tim View Post
That's interesting Ray, I didn't know that. I suppose that that may be why I haven't noticed the famous "off idle stumble" that many others have complained about. (Either that or I'm too ham-fisted to notice!)
The ECUs are different but.... UK bikes have a matched ignition key with the ECU whereas US bikes do not (I believe they have conventional, un-chipped keys) so the differences may just be for the ignition key aspect but in all honesty I do not know.

You make a valid point about the "ham-fisted" thing. If you ride these bikes hard you will not notice it. It is only when ridden slow that the problem manifests itself. Last month I rode slowly with some Harleys and it cut out a couple of times. The other problem (for me anyway) is when riding 2 up. The gentle throttle use, especially in town/traffic is lumpy.

Anyway, where the hell in Guernsey can you ride hard ????
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Old 01-07-2013, 06:36 AM   #15278
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Originally Posted by twinrider View Post
......it seems like he is rebuilding the wheel with added complications.....................
That thought crossed my mind until I saw his setup, we will see.
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Old 01-07-2013, 07:27 AM   #15279
simmons1
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I find the O2 sensor info interesting. I have a US bike with an ECUnleashed flash. My O2 sensors are in a box out in my shed. AF1 racing told me that after the flash they were not used and that the software was tweaked so there would be no error codes after removing them. I have ridden thousands of miles with them removed. I know that Jaxon has removed his also. YMMV
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Old 01-07-2013, 07:56 AM   #15280
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Originally Posted by Tim View Post
That's interesting Ray, I didn't know that. I suppose that that may be why I haven't noticed the famous "off idle stumble" that many others have complained about. (Either that or I'm too ham-fisted to notice!)
I felt the same way, till I did the clutch mod. Boy was that an eye-opener.
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Old 01-07-2013, 03:48 PM   #15281
Tim
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Originally Posted by Old Git Ray View Post
Anyway, where the hell in Guernsey can you ride hard ????
France and Spain!!
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Old 01-07-2013, 07:05 PM   #15282
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Like Simmons said... No need for the 02 any longer with the ECUnleashed.. I might have missed something, is ECUnleashed saying that the 02 have to stay installed ? no they don't.... Ive read in the past that on a R6 you can take the 02 out of a stock bike and it does something similar to our clutch mod switch.. It goes into a different mode. I have posted this before on the Tenere forum. We just did a flash for a customer in Brazil with no problem. I have also checked with ECUleashed US to ask them about a South African bike that is in Japan now.. ECUnleashed said there will be no issue with that flash... With all the units we have worked on, Ive never had one not work.. The customer can leave the 02 hooked up, but there is no need and you can take them out..... I have all this stuff done on my bike and it ROCKS !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Old 01-07-2013, 07:15 PM   #15283
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************************************************** **************************
Small problem with that...I think.

I am getting mine done next month but it is from an ECU-Unleashed satellite dealer in the UK.
So my flash will probably be US spec. On top of that, having spoken to them, they are a bit unhappy with the results obtained when they flashed an S10, so they are looking at removing the O2 sensors and rejigging it. Apparently one bike ran well enough but then started generating fault codes. The bike may have been modified in other ways too (exhaust/filter etc). The off idle fueling was the problem IIRC.
I was phoning international so I did not go into detail but I arrived back in the UK yesterday so I will get better details when I go and see them in the New Year. Fortunately they are only 30mins drive from me. It is likely that I will lend them my bike to do some testing with.

I will up date when I know some more.
************************************************** ***************************



Again, Ive posted tons of info on this over on the Tenere site. :):) I have found that the flash by it self is way better than stock. But no one will take full advantage of the flash unless you have control over the fuel. I have tested it many times. The only easy way to see big results is with something like a PCV on top of the flash. I have done many back to back to back to back test... I have seen the results.. I have a post that is about five paragraphs long with info about this on the Tenere forum. The Tenere is very fuel sensitive to get the idle just right and to eliminate 100% of the (extra- don't want) vibes that so many people have.. We can tune all that out with a PCV.
Even with the PCV you don't need the 02 unless your running auto tune. Then you will need one bung in the back to read both cylinders or you can get the AT with the two 02 sensors. Again, with the flash you don't need the factory 02 any longer. Ive installed many of these kits on customers ST with awesome results. If anyone has any questions Ill be happy to help pass along what I have learned working on the Super Tenere...
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Old 01-07-2013, 10:36 PM   #15284
Dallara
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Wicked Cool Tool Box...

~


Not trying to change the subject, Gents... But I don't think I've seen this mentioned over here.

Anybody interested in a rather trick little all-aluminum storage/tool box that takes advantage of some otherwise wasted space on most Super Tenere's?

















It's pretty cool looking little rig, and made by an outfit in Spain. Currently there are two models, one that fit with the OEM, Touratech and a some other brand side cases, and a second one that works with SW-Motech/Trax mounts.

There is an entire thread over on the *other* forum... The dedicated Super Tenere forum... but I'm reticent to post a link because I hear it's a no-no to do that here.

One thing I can do is post a link to the outfit that sells them here in the USA - http://www.advmotorrad.com/ - and you can find 'em easily there. The contact fellow there is Jason, and he's been great to work with so far. I just got my notification that my tool box just shipped, so I thought I would pass along the info here. Hopefully I can post some pics of mine on the bike once I get it mounted up.

Just FYI...


Dallara





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Old 01-07-2013, 11:20 PM   #15285
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Mine ships Tuesday. Looking forward to the additional storage space. Hopefully it arrives full of gold nuggets :)
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