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Old 01-16-2013, 02:52 PM   #1
R1100purist OP
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Question R1100GS Trans noises!



So don't worry all, I did a search first on 1995 R1100GS transmission, clutch noises and could not find my same problem.

So the bike has 34,000 miles on it and is a 1995 R1100GS, pretty standard issue.

My alternator threw a bearing but before I got it fixed last week is was always very loud drowned out most other noises. Now that it is fixed, I am able to hear another noise/situation. Okay so here it goes, what I experience is when I am rolling in any gear (except for neutral on the box) with clutch lever pulled in, I will hear a sorta rattling/knocking coming from either clutch land or the front of the trans. I have always had a clunky box with a lot of driveline lash, however this consistent almost rhythmic rattle has me thinking scary thoughts, as this is my only form of transportation and I can't afford to have her down for more than a few days.

When I slow down from say 40 mph, I hear the noise when I am slowing and braking as its rattling interval becomes slower in tempo. If however the box is in neutral and I am coasting or slightly braking with the clutch in, I don't hear this noise. Hmm? It only happens with clutch pulled in, in gear (any one) and decelerating. (at least that is when I can hear it)

One more thing, I did a trans oil change 3k miles ago and everything was crystal clear in the fluid coming out.

what is my deal?
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Old 01-16-2013, 06:12 PM   #2
Girthy Knobkers
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I can't help much but my '95 made a similar noise in similar situations from when I bought it at 17k until about 40k. Now it does not make any noises and nothing has gone wrong, 50k on the clock now... fingers crossed.
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Old 01-16-2013, 07:11 PM   #3
mouthfulloflake
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my 95 1100gs has made that noise since 80K until now at 96K miles.

ive read on here anything from engine rear crank bearing to trans input bearing.

basically, dont worry about that noise, is my opinion.
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Old 01-16-2013, 10:46 PM   #4
GeorgeinVA
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If the oil is clean do not worry about the noise. Keep changing the oil every 6k if you see chunks then start to worry. The pre M97 boxes have lots of issues, odd noises being one of them.
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Old 01-17-2013, 02:36 AM   #5
Trailing Jack
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Well, I hate to be a dark cloud but my '96 made a similar noise forever.
At about 89k it got much louder.
I started a thread here last year asking the same questions you're asking.

http://advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=727022

After hearing mostly what I wanted to hear, ("Just ride it...") I eventually had to check it out cause I knew it wasn't right.
Not being especially mechanically inclined, I took it to a trusted shop.

Input shaft bearing, which caused a bunch of other problems.
Your tranny like mine, is an M94 which I came to find out is one that no one wants to work on since they upgraded to an M97 in later models.

Ended up replacing the transmission (with a used M97) and the clutch. $$

Maybe my story is not yours, but it sounds similar.

edit: After re-reading your post, it seems your noise occurs with the clutch lever pulled in, right?
If you watched the video I posted, mine rattled with the lever out.

I will hope for the best for you, man.
My solution was expensive.

Trailing Jack screwed with this post 01-17-2013 at 03:00 AM
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Old 01-17-2013, 08:41 AM   #6
R1100purist OP
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Hey Trailing Jack,

No worries, I am here for all reasoned opinions and your's was nicely put.

I hear what you are saying though on the replacement...it may just have to happen, but I see that maybe we had different symptoms. Yes, mine is with the clutch pulled in, in gear, and coasting. No noise when stopped.

Anyway, I think I will just ride the animal, and hope for the best.

Thank you all! Mouthfuloflake, you have always been helpful too.

Owen



Quote:
Originally Posted by Trailing Jack View Post
Well, I hate to be a dark cloud but my '96 made a similar noise forever.
At about 89k it got much louder.
I started a thread here last year asking the same questions you're asking.

http://advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=727022

After hearing mostly what I wanted to hear, ("Just ride it...") I eventually had to check it out cause I knew it wasn't right.
Not being especially mechanically inclined, I took it to a trusted shop.

Input shaft bearing, which caused a bunch of other problems.
Your tranny like mine, is an M94 which I came to find out is one that no one wants to work on since they upgraded to an M97 in later models.

Ended up replacing the transmission (with a used M97) and the clutch. $$

Maybe my story is not yours, but it sounds similar.

edit: After re-reading your post, it seems your noise occurs with the clutch lever pulled in, right?
If you watched the video I posted, mine rattled with the lever out.

I will hope for the best for you, man.
My solution was expensive.
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Old 01-17-2013, 06:08 PM   #7
Uncledeadly
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You might find this interesting..... sounds like the same issue.

http://forums.msnoc.com/thread-52985-1-1.html

doesnt really have an ending though...lol.
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Old 01-18-2013, 01:49 PM   #8
R1100purist OP
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Hmm yeah!

Yeah, that totally sounds like what I have going on. I rode today and it seems like rolling under 3-4 miles an hour clutch in, while in gear, the noise will subside. Hmm...I wish there were more conclusions.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Uncledeadly View Post
You might find this interesting..... sounds like the same issue.

http://forums.msnoc.com/thread-52985-1-1.html

doesnt really have an ending though...lol.
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Old 01-19-2013, 09:35 PM   #9
MsLizVt
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Just trying to be helpful ...

R1100purist et al, hi!

What I'm about to share is based on personal experiences. It's simpler than digging into the transmission and looking for bad internal bearings.

As the clutch wears, the distance that the clutch lever runs free becomes less and less. At some point, even though the clutch never feels like it's slipping, the clutch will wear down to the point that the push rod and throw out bearing never disengage from the clutch, and will spin while you're riding. When that happens, the throwout bearing that is supposed to spin at idle or low RPM's for only during the moments of shifting, instead is spinning at the engine RPM for the entire time the bike is moving and in gear. Those little bearings aren't made to sustain that much use.

My belief is the clutch push rod and throw out bearing should stop spinning once you've released the clutch lever all the way. If they are spinning you'll hear a noise that can sound like a spinning dry bearing, or even something crunchy when one of those little ball bearings wears down to not much.

My first suggestion is to check the play on your clutch lever. The second suggestion is to take the rear wheel off, paralever off, pull the throw out bearing, check it and the push rod. These bearings are not very sophisticated and are pretty small, like the size of a skateboard wheel bearing.

My guess is the noise you're hearing when you are sitting with the clutch in, not moving, is that throwout bearing, dry, and with bad ball bearings. Again, this is based on my own experience. This all could be more internal issues like transmission bearings. But it's worth starting with the throw out bearing and loosening up the clutch lever.

Also, because the noise is already there, loosening the clutch lever might not change things when you have the clutch lever pulled in, because the bearing is already bad. However, loosening it most likely will get rid of any noise that you have while you're moving, with the clutch lever all the way out.

When replacing the throwout bearing, it's always good to look at the push rod too. You might want to plan on changing that at the same time if it's damaged.

If you would like to know more about what happens when one ignores these noises and keeps thinking "... they all do that ... " I can tell that story too.

Am I making sense?



Liz
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Old 01-23-2013, 06:24 PM   #10
Murkidi
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I have a r1100gs 1995 with a M94 gear box and I did by myself this , replace the conical roller bearrings and the rest of the open bearings with clean seal bearings


Here is the list of the bearings in case you need it:

all SKF
6205 2RS C3 Qty.2
6304 2RS C3 Qty.1
6204 2RS C3 Qty.1
6303 2RS C3 Qty.2


ol





New bearings in place


old bearings





don't forget to lubricate the shaft!!
manuel...
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Old 01-23-2013, 06:28 PM   #11
Murkidi
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you have 2 options:

1-conical bearings
2-or push rod and thought out bearing from the clutch as MsLizVt said

I did the push rod first and yhe noise continue so I end up taking the gear box down!!

manuel
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Old 02-04-2013, 11:49 AM   #12
MsLizVt
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Just wondering ...

R1100purist, hi !

How'd you make out so far?

Thanks!


Liz
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Old 02-04-2013, 02:36 PM   #13
R1100purist OP
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Hi all

Well I am keeping a close eye on the situation and I think the replacement bearing route may be the option for me, either that or sourcing an alternate used trans. The issue is that my bike is my only form of transportation and therefore I need it fully operational all the time. Or at least almost there...

The clutch pushrod throw out bearing makes much sense based on the leaky seal I have in that area. I think some GL5 was able to sneak out and contaminate the throw out bearing causing it to chatter. I don't know how "bad" this is other than the leaky pushrod seal situation and the extra wear from the pushrod spinning around (?) but I figure everything works well for now and I will monitor closely.

Anyway, when my financial/life situation improves I will do a strip down and see what happens.

Thanks all!



Quote:
Originally Posted by MsLizVt View Post
R1100purist, hi !

How'd you make out so far?

Thanks!


Liz
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Old 02-04-2013, 06:48 PM   #14
mouthfulloflake
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I hear you.

I procured a used M97, the plan now is to install my M94 input shaft into it, and put that franken transmission into my bike.

but the down time, that stops me cold.
honestly, Ill probably put it off until the bike is no longer rideable, and then fix it!
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Old 02-05-2013, 08:49 AM   #15
MsLizVt
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Quote:
Originally Posted by R1100purist View Post
Well I am keeping a close eye on the situation and I think the replacement bearing route may be the option for me, either that or sourcing an alternate used trans. The issue is that my bike is my only form of transportation and therefore I need it fully operational all the time. Or at least almost there...

The clutch pushrod throw out bearing makes much sense based on the leaky seal I have in that area. I think some GL5 was able to sneak out and contaminate the throw out bearing causing it to chatter. I don't know how "bad" this is other than the leaky pushrod seal situation and the extra wear from the pushrod spinning around (?) but I figure everything works well for now and I will monitor closely.

Anyway, when my financial/life situation improves I will do a strip down and see what happens.

Thanks all!
Cool! Thanks for the update.



Liz
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