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Old 01-29-2013, 10:08 PM   #166
rpet
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G650X? They stopped making those 4 years ago...
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Old 01-29-2013, 10:37 PM   #167
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Originally Posted by Albie View Post
LOL, you just said where are all the 09's and 10's??? The answer, they aren't very many because of the cutback in manufacturing. In '09 it was '08 model WR's that Yamaha was dumping.
Exactly. My point though is that the cutback in manufacturing has had nothing to do with the increase in prices. the cutback was driven by the collapse of demand, the price increase has been driven by the exchange rate.

And FYI: Yamaha was still dumping '08 WR250R/Xs in 2010 as well....
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Old 01-29-2013, 11:40 PM   #168
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Originally Posted by Off the grid View Post
Don't fucking listen to me, look around the trails. Look at what riders are riding. I'm just pointing out facts. If that bothers you, it's on you, bro.
Do you ever get out and ride, dude? It seems lke you're always trolling threads like these looking for an opportunity to dump on Jap bikes and praise the holy euros. You joined in 2008 and you have over 7000 posts! Get out and ride once in a while, maybe 2 up with your brazilian wife... You might enjoy it. It will sure beat sitting in front of the computer screen..
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Old 01-30-2013, 12:38 AM   #169
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Originally Posted by amtz.zero View Post
Do you ever get out and ride, dude? It seems lke you're always trolling threads like these looking for an opportunity to dump on Jap bikes and praise the holy euros. You joined in 2008 and you have over 7000 posts! Get out and ride once in a while, maybe 2 up with your brazilian wife... You might enjoy it. It will sure beat sitting in front of the computer screen..
Pretty easy to demonize me as some couch-surfing loudmouth, right?

You would be wrong. Very wrong.

I'm out of the enduro game for the moment due to just purchasing a home. For now I'm content with local club ADV rides.

And for work every week.


I think it's comical how worked up people get over my posts. I'm not saying anything inflammatory or untrue. I write shit to dispel myths, period.

It's a fucking machine, people. It doesn't give a shit about you. Fuck, some of you taintsticks are worse than idiots who worship sports teams.

If you don't like what I have to say or are so immature or have such low frustration tolerance that you need to defend your precious motorcycle as if I attacked a family member, join the ignore club.

Or perhaps add something worthwhile to the conversation.
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Old 01-30-2013, 04:39 AM   #170
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So tell us your expertise riding in your own yard with your laptop and a burrito. Worshiping teams of sports I dont participate in no , but you worship a bike you dont even own. Out of the enduro game ? You were never in the enduro game. It is better to keep your mouth shut and look like a fool , than to open it and forever remove all doubt !

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Old 01-30-2013, 05:08 AM   #171
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Say what you want but he is right about both the current WR450F and what riders are choosing. Right out of the crate the WR450F needs modifications to run right. That is why every year the offroad magazines invariably do an article on how to make WR450F work. Google throttle stop and WR450F then get back to us. Out of the crate it is about as badass as a DR200.

Then at organized dual sport rides over the last ten years I have seen KTM's go from the rare exotic to the single most common machine. Sure there are still a lot of Japanese bikes. But that is from four companies compared to one and it still looks like a sea of orange. I see way more EXC's than any other single make and model of dual sport. That is just a fact in this area.

I am a product of King Kenny and Hurricane Hannah with a closet full of Yamagear. But that doesn't mean I am willing to sit on my hands and wait for blue unicorns to appear. After a certain point brand loyalty is just stupid. If somebody starts selling better dual sports than KTM I will be on those. Until then orange it is.
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Old 01-30-2013, 05:14 AM   #172
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Im not anti KTM , Im anti windbag.
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Old 01-30-2013, 05:42 AM   #173
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Everyone should know that the Euro brands are tops in the dirt, most of the bikes I see in the woods are orange.
And the others are guys who cant afford a ktm.

Still, for a cheap rugged mild dual sport, the Japanese could do a lot better, just by building the right size motor with a sensible transmission, or even keeping what they had and updating it.
All the 250's are fine, except the XT250 maybe, but the lack of mid size bikes kills them.

What with all the Japanese dealers around (less then there used to be) they sell more bikes over all, which ends up having more cheap used Japanese bikes on the market, and they may be a better buy then a used abused and raced KTM.

We want choices, not just the fastest bike in the dirt.
We want something that can do 70 mph for an hour without exploding or needing an oil change, but is good in thick sand, that can loft the front wheel over something, that is going to start and run most of the time with little else then oil changes, that you can get used cheap, and that does not weigh 400 pounds or more.

The guys that want to go really fast will always pick a Euro brand, the ones that want to get there and back without any fuss might pick something else. Those people now have one choice, an old design DRZ and a pocket full of sprockets.
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Old 01-30-2013, 06:30 AM   #174
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mtntrails View Post
You guys are "missing the boat" in a big way...

The market is (and has been for years) screaming out for a proper, modern, mid-size (300cc - 450cc) dual-sport - a more potent version of the excellent Yamaha WR250R & Honda CRF250L - Correction. A tiny percent of an already tiny segment of the motorcycle market.

35 - 45 RWHP - Why ? Most people looking for dual sports tend to favor reliability and mpg over hp. It can be done but the costs go up as does fuel consumption. For those that "need" that kind of power ? Well that is why we have an aftermarket.
Fuel Injection - Agree but there are bikes out there that fit this bill just not above 249cc unless you go Euro.
6-speed Tranny - Not necessary if they would just get the gearing right but a 6th does make that easier especially on smaller bikes.
Target Weight at or Under 300lbs - Again at what cost ? A mass market bike has to be versatile (carry loads, luggage, passenger,etc) and it has to make it through many different emission tests in multiple markets. It also has to last a long time and usually that means a bit more weight. The aftermarket is there if weight is such a big concern.
3000-4000 Mile Oil Change Intervals - There are bikes that fit this bill as well.
15k + Mile Valve Adjustment Intervals - This is a big one for me too but experience tells me that if you maintain a bike properly and don't ride your DS/ADV bike like you are trying to beat someone to the next timed checkpoint then it will last way longer than the recommended valve adj schedule. Case in point I did my first valve adjustment on my KLX300r at 40 thousand miles.
Modern, Fully Adjustable Suspension - It's available if you are willing to pay for it.
A Subframe Capable of Carrying Luggage & Camping Gear - But you want a weight under 300lbs.......
An Electrical System Capable of Running Heated Gear, GPS, etc. - Agree but again you are adding a bit of weight.
Build it for Unquestionable Reliability & Durability - Completely doable but again at what cost?
$5000 - $9000 MSRP (depending on displacement & specs) - Not going to happen with all the other things you are asking for. The big four are trying to make a profit, they aren't a charity.

ADVRider, ThumperTalk, HorizonsUnlimited, et al are filled with threads and posts lamenting this huge "hole" in the marketplace. When will the "Big 4" step up and build this bike? - They don't need to. They know that KTM/ Husky / Berg already have this market covered and the Euro brands draw in Euro brand type $$. Most buyers of the non-boutique brands aren't looking to drop $10k plus on a dual sport and the Japs can clearly see this. The ones that are buying Japanese bikes over $10k tend to be more into touring and buy bikes like the Tenere
Whoever is the first out of the gate will have a blockbuster hit on their hands - Only if they can figure out a way to sell brand new used bikes. - the rest will hopefully follow.

Don't forget to build a SM version too! - Dead on the sales floor doesn't exactly make a company want to build something.
I would love to own a 450cc version of a WR250r that has all of your above features but I (along with many others) am not looking to drop $10k on a bike that I am still going to have to farkle the piss out of in order for it to be right. That sentiment is magnified by the fact that I can get a 250 that does most of what you have asked all the while getting awesome mpg and being at the low end of your hypothetical MSRP. I would rather drop that extra $$ on a road trip.

Long story short: Don't hold your breath that they will build the bike you seek. The best you can do is figure out where it is that you are willing to compromise and buy the bike that fits your needs.
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Old 01-30-2013, 11:20 AM   #175
Off the grid
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Originally Posted by joexr View Post
Im not anti KTM , Im anti windbag.
I'm not going to prove my riding heritage to you, scooter. But I guarantee I've ridden many more miles of much more technical terrain in the North-East where I lived for 41 years than you have in Florida

Again, if your vagina gets sandy because I'm stating the truth, put me on ignore. Because clearly you don't have the mental capacity to determine that I'm not insulting your family member.

Or you could add to the conversation. Because as Grreatdog said, I'm not wrong.

Quote:
Originally Posted by NJ-Brett View Post
Everyone should know that the Euro brands are tops in the dirt, most of the bikes I see in the woods are orange.
And the others are guys who cant afford a ktm.

The guys that want to go really fast will always pick a Euro brand, the ones that want to get there and back without any fuss might pick something else. Those people now have one choice, an old design DRZ and a pocket full of sprockets.
But see this is where you are mislead. My riding buddies and I are not fast. Not by a long shot. And we are not rich. But like you, we got tired of heavy, slow bikes in Pine Barrens sugar sand.

So that's why you see so many people riding them. Everyone I know, old men included. Short people, tall people. 99% of them are not racers, and will never race their bike. They don't give a shit about going fast. They just want to lope along in the woods, (try to) loft a wheelie, lay some roost with friends.

Don't let fear rule your decisions.
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Old 01-30-2013, 11:32 AM   #176
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I live in Florida , Im not from Florida WINDBAG.
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Old 01-30-2013, 11:37 AM   #177
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Now, now boys. When Yamaha finally releases the WR450R we all know everything will finally be right with the world. Or, at least, it will be right after removing the throttle stop, reprogramming the ECU, pulling the airbox plugs and removing the exhaust restrictor.
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Old 01-30-2013, 11:41 AM   #178
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Some of the KTMs have throttle stops also. Everything can use a good pipe. Mapping is merely FI speak for tuning.
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Old 01-30-2013, 11:48 AM   #179
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Originally Posted by Grreatdog View Post
Now, now boys. When Yamaha finally releases the WR450R we all know everything will finally be right with the world. Or, at least, it will be right after removing the throttle stop, reprogramming the ECU, pulling the airbox plugs and removing the exhaust restrictor.
And sawzall about 40 lbs off it
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Old 01-30-2013, 12:03 PM   #180
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Originally Posted by Off the grid View Post
......than you have in Florida

I'm from FL and I have to say that right there is a bit of dumb sentiment.
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