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Old 02-16-2013, 09:52 PM   #61
Sylvia
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NikonsAndVStroms View Post


I already answered this.....it expands the situations where he can take photos/gives him more margin of error in his exposure.

He or anyone could get a compact, or aps-c camera and be able to take good photos but you get a FF for the reasons I mentioned above among others.

You just don't get it do you.
The question was for the OP.
I give up.
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Old 02-16-2013, 10:39 PM   #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sylvia View Post

You just don't get it do you.
The question was for the OP.
I give up.
I don't get it? He responded to a post you made to me so it made more sense to address that one than your initial response. Would you rather I quoted the other one and said roughly the same thing?

You asked why would someone who isn't a pro need X camera ability. I gave the reasons are they true or not

But here to make you happy:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sylvia View Post
Yes, yes, but what was it you are trying to say?
He is not making a living from this. He is not selling images, and anyone who has to ask "what oil do I need" must surely miss the point, let alone those telling him the lubeinessesnce of each brand.

Now honestly, all this dxo measuring is just dick swinging bullshit. It is a valid measurement of a sensor, and nothing else. When you by a camera you buy into a system. The 2 biggest, honda and yamaha are just as good as each other. One year a new model might leapfrog a tad. Let him have his Canon.

Now _cy_ where's that pic.
He asked specifically about the other options and the pros and cons, from the OP:

Quote:
Originally Posted by runpasthefence View Post
...or into getting something else. Whichever you prefer.

I've been going back and forth on this for a while now.
The D600, D800, 6D, and 5D Mark III are all pretty great. I'm convinced I can't really go wrong with any...which makes deciding more difficult.



I'm leaning toward the 6D for the following reasons.

- Price: vs. the Mark III there's about a $1000 difference between the cheapest options (refurb mark III, retail 6D)
- high ISO performance
- Size/weight: small differences, but lighter nonetheless
- Built-in wifi & GPS: I like the idea of not having to keep track of an IR remote, and I dig geotagging
- Never owned Canon, want to give it a shot

A little about what I typically shoot:
- Landscape/night
- Dogs, so kinda wildlife
- Still life
- Interested in getting into astrophotography

So, should I just pull the trigger? Am I stupid for not just spending the money on a Mark III? Have I been brainwashed out of owning a superior Nikon?

What says advrider?
So yes saying the pros and cons does make sense. If one does X better than Y it is a reason to possibly get it especially if you plan to keep the camera for awhile. I have shot at one time an Olympus E-420, Fuji S5 Pro and Nikon D700, each are very different tools with pros and cons which change to a point the way you shoot. Between the FF bodies there are not the huge differences as there are across those SLR's and as the OP says there is no really wrong answer but I listed but there are differences which make some suited for certain types of photography more than others.

Saying your not a pro so it wont matter doesn't make sense, with that argument why not just tell him to go for an APS-C? Or a compact? What level of photography is specifically for "pros"? If the OP has a APS-C DSLR and wants to make the upgrade he likely knows why, and out of the things he listed other than the dogs the FF sensors will offer improvements. So why is it wrong to suggest which ones will do them the best and why are scientific results a bad way for determining this? Other than going to a store and taking test shots side by side they're the best thing people have to go on.

OP sorry bout this derailment.
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NikonsAndVStroms screwed with this post 02-16-2013 at 10:53 PM
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Old 02-16-2013, 10:53 PM   #63
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It doesn't matter.
Buy one or the other.
Take lots of pictures.
Spend some time at Kirk Tuck's blog.
http://visualsciencelab.blogspot.com/
Read through his articles about photography.
http://visualsciencelab.blogspot.com...tter-hunt.html
Take lots of pictures.
Good luck.
Take lots of pictures.
You're welcome.

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Old 02-16-2013, 11:14 PM   #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sylvia View Post
Tell me what advantages you will have using a 6D over a second hand 5dMII or any other camera?
Just off the top of your head mind you, not comparing endless spec sheets and dxo specs, what is it that says you want/need a 6D, or tell me why you don't.
I don't need much of anything. I happen to have the luxury of having enough disposable income to enjoy a hobby that I find peaceful and rewarding.

I can't make an accurate comparison between the 6D and the Mark II or many other cameras, for that matter, as I've never had the opportunity to own one. Hence, I've turned to a forum I frequent for discussion. After all, that tends to be the goal of a forum.
I also have failed to memorize any shortcomings the Mark II may have.
However, as the newest technology tends to be the most advanced, I feel pretty safe that I can assume the 6D's image sensor, autofocus system, size/weight, etc are marginally superior to a previous model. Forgive me, but I tend to lean toward modernity.

It should be noted that there is a bulleted list of reasons why the 6D appeals to me in my initial post in this thread.

Quote:
What does this camera have that you need that you can't live without?
The ability to convert light into image and video data. I'm pretty pumped when the shit that comes out of the square thingy with the gold prongs is pretty.

Quote:
How does it fit with your current camera arsenal and what advantages does it bring?
This has been covered. Simply, it doesn't. Details can be found on page 1.

Quote:
That is the question, but can you answer it?
I think you're trying to help, but all of your posts reek elitist condescension.

I can recognize it, but the question is, can you?
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Old 02-16-2013, 11:21 PM   #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bobobob View Post
It doesn't matter.
Buy one or the other.
Take lots of pictures.
Spend some time at Kirk Tuck's blog.
http://visualsciencelab.blogspot.com/
Read through his articles about photography.
http://visualsciencelab.blogspot.com...tter-hunt.html
Take lots of pictures.
Good luck.
Take lots of pictures.
You're welcome.
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Old 02-16-2013, 11:36 PM   #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NikonsAndVStroms View Post
snip

OP sorry bout this derailment.
Departures are expected. I appreciate your input. You've been quite helpful.
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Old 02-17-2013, 01:50 AM   #67
Sylvia
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NikonsAndVStroms View Post
I don't get it? Tick

You asked why would someone who isn't a pro need X camera ability. I gave the reasons are they true or not

You gave YOUR opinion

The OP does not have an opinion, nor experience with snapping pics, hence his question.



OP sorry bout this derailment.
Don't apologise, we are getting some where.
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Old 02-17-2013, 01:51 AM   #68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bobobob View Post
It doesn't matter.
Buy one or the other.
Take lots of pictures.
Spend some time at Kirk Tuck's blog.
http://visualsciencelab.blogspot.com/
Read through his articles about photography.
http://visualsciencelab.blogspot.com...tter-hunt.html
Take lots of pictures.
Good luck.
Take lots of pictures.
You're welcome.
From the wilderness comes the voice of reason. Thank you.
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Old 02-17-2013, 02:01 AM   #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by runpasthefence View Post
I don't need much of anything. I happen to have the luxury of having enough disposable income to enjoy a hobby that I find peaceful and rewarding.
Excellent, you for-fill the criteria as amateur photographer. The hill is steep but very rewarding.

I can't make an accurate comparison between the 6D and the Mark II or many other cameras, for that matter, as I've never had the opportunity to own one. Hence, I've turned to a forum I frequent for discussion.
Forums are full of opinions, fanboi's and generally people with too much time on their hands.

After all, that tends to be the goal of a forum.
I also have failed to memorize any shortcomings the Mark II may have.
However, as the newest technology tends to be the most advanced, I feel pretty safe that I can assume the 6D's image sensor, autofocus system, size/weight, etc are marginally superior to a previous model. Forgive me, but I tend to lean toward modernity.

Thats Ok, you will never miss what you have never had. And there in lies the fundamental issue.

It should be noted that there is a bulleted list of reasons why the 6D appeals to me in my initial post in this thread.

Yes....

The ability to convert light into image and video data. I'm pretty pumped when the shit that comes out of the square thingy with the gold prongs is pretty.

yes...

This has been covered. Simply, it doesn't. Details can be found on page 1.

Thank you.

I think you're trying to help, but all of your posts reek elitist condescension.

Thats another issue with forums that never translates to well. Pity really.

I can recognize it, but the question is, can you?
Dear fence sprinter, its hard to put an old head on young shoulders, does this sound condescending to you? If not we are on the right track.
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Old 02-17-2013, 08:35 AM   #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sylvia View Post
Don't apologise, we are getting some where.
My opinion?

So if you have better high ISO performance it doesn't allow you to shoot in more situations?

If you have greater dynamic range it doesn't give you more room for error in your exposure?

How are those opinion

If you disagree I asked you already to explain, can you
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NikonsAndVStroms screwed with this post 02-17-2013 at 08:40 AM
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Old 02-17-2013, 10:01 AM   #71
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Two monks were sitting in the temple garden darkness arguing about the meaning of a Sutra.
They heard footsteps pause behind them but didn't glance up and continued arguing.
Later Master Satori approached silently, hit brother Nikon and brother Canon in the head with his fan and slipped away.

Next morning the two monks approached the master, told him what happened and asked what it meant.
'Bodhidharma visited you to transmit his wisdom but you were busy.'
'I wonder what wisdom the Bodhidharma had for us?' asked the monks.
'The golden moon spilling Sutra blossoms' laughed the Master and hit them again.

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Old 02-17-2013, 12:11 PM   #72
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Quote:
... nor experience with snapping pics, hence his question.
Waaaiiit a minute. Can I at least get credit for making to the front page?

Quote:
Thats Ok, you will never miss what you have never had. And there in lies the fundamental issue.
That seems to be the sentiment that I am at odds with here. I'm surprised by the number of replies I've received that argue for an inferior product. "Why buy a 6D when you could just buy an older X brand or a DX or APS-C, etc etc."
It seems to be rooted in the belief that someone who doesn't shoot for profit shouldn't own a camera with pro or near pro features. This is rooted in a lot of supposition about lack of skill and/or knowledge.

Let's assume I am a clueless amateur. Can one not learn? Must an amateur use a D3100 or a rebel series camera before moving on? Would he not be better served by making a larger initial investment rather than buying something he'll not be entirely happy with as his skills improve?
If this were Road Warriors and were a n00b rider looking for advice on my first bike: RC8R, 1199, S1000rr, etc - I'd expect a similar, yet warranted, response. However, my well being isn't likely threatened by this purchase.

So, why can't I have nice things? Huh? HUH?!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sylvia View Post
Dear fence sprinter, its hard to put an old head on young shoulders, does this sound condescending to you? If not we are on the right track.
Not particularly. I'm just not so sure I want an old head. Though, I'm sure that's quite a typical response of the one with the young shoulders...

NsandVs gets it, honestly. We're at odds because "the OP has a APS-C (had a DX, but whatevs) DSLR and wants to make the upgrade he likely knows why." Most of your contribution has ignored the initial topic and has supposed that I have neither the knowledge (nor the ability to learn) or skill to take advantage of the features of a high-end body.
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Old 02-17-2013, 02:11 PM   #73
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NikonsAndVStroms View Post
My opinion?

So if you have better high ISO performance it doesn't allow you to shoot in more situations? Depends what glass is attached, and the rest of the situation, doesn't it.

If you have greater dynamic range it doesn't give you more room for error in your exposure? If you have no idea what your doing, yes.

How are those opinion

If you disagree I asked you already to explain, can you
You love the spec sheet eh Nikons.
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Old 02-17-2013, 02:11 PM   #74
Sylvia
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bobobob View Post
Two monks were sitting in the temple garden darkness arguing about the meaning of a Sutra.
They heard footsteps pause behind them but didn't glance up and continued arguing.
Later Master Satori approached silently, hit brother Nikon and brother Canon in the head with his fan and slipped away.

Next morning the two monks approached the master, told him what happened and asked what it meant.
'Bodhidharma visited you to transmit his wisdom but you were busy.'
'I wonder what wisdom the Bodhidharma had for us?' asked the monks.
'The golden moon spilling Sutra blossoms' laughed the Master and hit them again.

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Old 02-17-2013, 02:25 PM   #75
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Quote:
Originally Posted by runpasthefence View Post
Waaaiiit a minute. Can I at least get credit for making to the front page?
Congratulations


That seems to be the sentiment that I am at odds with here. I'm surprised by the number of replies I've received that argue for an inferior product. "Why buy a 6D when you could just buy an older X brand or a DX or APS-C, etc etc."
It seems to be rooted in the belief that someone who doesn't shoot for profit shouldn't own a camera with pro or near pro features. This is rooted in a lot of supposition about lack of skill and/or knowledge.

You have not been listening, have you.
Where have I said don't buy anything, new or old.
"That supposition is founded in "talk me out of a "x" thing"

Let's assume I am a clueless amateur. Can one not learn? Yes. Must an amateur use a D3100 or a rebel series camera before moving on? "]If he or she wants to I see no issue. Would he not be better served by making a larger initial investment rather than buying something he'll not be entirely happy with as his skills improve? "]I seen some go on to be real shooters, so yes it is possible, but not manditory.
If this were Road Warriors and were a n00b rider looking for advice on my first bike: RC8R, 1199, S1000rr, etc - I'd expect a similar, yet warranted, response. However, my well being isn't likely threatened by this purchase.

So, why can't I have nice things? Huh? HUH?!
I have never said you cannot


Not particularly. I'm just not so sure I want an old head. Though, I'm sure that's quite a typical response of the one with the young shoulders...

NsandVs gets it, honestly. We're at odds because "the OP has a APS-C (had a DX, but whatevs) DSLR and wants to make the upgrade he likely knows why." Most of your contribution has ignored the initial topic and has supposed that I have neither the knowledge (nor the ability to learn) or skill to take advantage of the features of a high-end body.
I re-submit my first post for your consideration.

You have been brain washed. The camera / system will not make you better images, especially based on what you typically shoot. But you knew that, right.?
Go take some pics, post em up here, tell us what you don't like and what you need to achieve. Then you will get some value, in comments.

Quoting IXO and other performance specifications is a complete waste of time imho.

carry on.
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