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Old 03-01-2013, 07:03 PM   #4351
chazbird
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Says British Antarctic Survey on the fuselage, but the reg begins with VP? Is that Chile? Is that common? Contacted out?
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Old 03-01-2013, 07:04 PM   #4352
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Or is that Boark Air flying under a separate reg?
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Old 03-01-2013, 08:35 PM   #4353
Hay Ewe
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VP-F = Falkland Islands

VP- for UK off shore and the -F for the Falkland Islands

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Old 03-01-2013, 09:12 PM   #4354
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Shot from my back yard this afternoon!


IMG_1355 by Renaissance Redneck Media, on Flickr


IMG_1345 by Renaissance Redneck Media, on Flickr


IMG_1258 by Renaissance Redneck Media, on Flickr
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Old 03-01-2013, 09:21 PM   #4355
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Saw one of these on final into Toronto this afternoon.

Man, they take up a lot of sky.


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Old 03-02-2013, 01:03 PM   #4356
EVLED
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lornce View Post
Saw one of these on final into Toronto this afternoon.

Man, they take up a lot of sky.


One took off ahead of me (passenger in a little ole 737) a few weeks ago. It lumbered off in front of us, didn't look that big as it flew away from us but then it turned and looked simply massive (by this time it was a fair way out and we were still taxing...
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Old 03-02-2013, 04:05 PM   #4357
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At about 3:50


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Old 03-02-2013, 05:09 PM   #4358
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That was close...

At 3:30, the oncoming aircraft is just visible, but covered by the datum line of the heads up display.

At 4:01, the airliner passes just in front; at 4:02 the evasive manouver begins.

Earlier, the controller asked the fighter pilot to check Mode C, wonder if his transponder had problems.

What was said between the pilots and the controller after the near miss...

NFE
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Old 03-02-2013, 05:25 PM   #4359
Hay Ewe
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lornce View Post

I saw a 747-400 parked along side an A380 at SIN a few months ago - that really showed how big it is.
But its ugly, very blunt nose and short and dumpy. 747 has much better lines

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Old 03-02-2013, 07:54 PM   #4360
scottcolbath
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Fly-In at KDRT.


That would be "DRT" as in a dirt airstrip out by the Hassayampa and Flat Iron Mountain, north of I-10.





I rode out to see some buddies (Anyone remember JimJib?), who were on an off-road riding weekend. This was their stop for the night. The dude with the plane is an old riding buddy of Jim's. Since he didn't have a bike ready to ride, he decided to take the plane.





S.C.
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Old 03-03-2013, 05:31 PM   #4361
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The airliner contrail is visible for a good 7-8 seconds prior to point of closest approach. This illustrates a real known problem with Head Up Displays (HUD's), basically you have a natural tendency to gaze at the display, not ahead and beyond. Airliners, the (few) ones with HUD's, do not use them in cruise flight, only for low visibility approaches. Military aircraft (as this one is, I suspect a low performance fighter trainer) use a HUD for low vis approaches but principally for target selection/aiming, and back up primary flight information when in tactical modes. This isn't to say the pilot was asleep at the stick, and it also makes one wonder why the passing airliner TCAS did not give a RA (resolution advisory) to turn well before this encounter. There seems to be some confusion about the aircrafts transponder altitude reporting too, and other issues with ATC. I.E. They seemed to know where he was, before and after the sector handoff. They supposedly should have known about the airliner, too. (Before the handoff the controller asked him to expedite to FL360, which is always a clue to be aware for traffic). The military plane was cleared to FL360, but later, with the second controller, he was told to immediately descend to FL320, after the encounter. Not knowing Italian I can't tell if he reported this near collision. Perhaps the previous controller did not forward the cleared to FL360 to the next controller and the second controller thought he was at FL320, even though he reported in at FL360. That, coupled with the apparent altitude reporting problems may have coupled to make a high threat environment it came to be.

End of novel.
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Old 03-03-2013, 07:06 PM   #4362
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chazbird View Post
The airliner contrail is visible for a good 7-8 seconds prior to point of closest approach. This illustrates a real known problem with Head Up Displays (HUD's), basically you have a natural tendency to gaze at the display, not ahead and beyond. Airliners, the (few) ones with HUD's, do not use them in cruise flight, only for low visibility approaches. Military aircraft (as this one is, I suspect a low performance fighter trainer) use a HUD for low vis approaches but principally for target selection/aiming, and back up primary flight information when in tactical modes. This isn't to say the pilot was asleep at the stick, and it also makes one wonder why the passing airliner TCAS did not give a RA (resolution advisory) to turn well before this encounter. There seems to be some confusion about the aircrafts transponder altitude reporting too, and other issues with ATC. I.E. They seemed to know where he was, before and after the sector handoff. They supposedly should have known about the airliner, too. (Before the handoff the controller asked him to expedite to FL360, which is always a clue to be aware for traffic). The military plane was cleared to FL360, but later, with the second controller, he was told to immediately descend to FL320, after the encounter. Not knowing Italian I can't tell if he reported this near collision. Perhaps the previous controller did not forward the cleared to FL360 to the next controller and the second controller thought he was at FL320, even though he reported in at FL360. That, coupled with the apparent altitude reporting problems may have coupled to make a high threat environment it came to be.

End of novel.

If the fighter was really hauling, the closure could have been too fast for TCAS to resolve a solution.

Or, perhaps the fighter's transponder was not sending or accurately reporting Mode C (pressure altitude).
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Old 03-03-2013, 08:36 PM   #4363
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The Hud indicates about 240-250 KIAS, which at FL360 is around 450 true, probably about what the airliner was doing as well, which is within TCAS closure resolution.

At least 3-4 problems:

1. Pilot scan (at least 10 seconds visible with the contrail). This may be an artifact of the HUD, limiting the ability or inclination to keep scanning, especially under positive control airspace, i.e. ATC being responsible for separation. Pilot turned away when aircraft trajectory was a miss, but probably a (good) reflex.

2. Some sort of mode C altitude issue.

3. Confusion or misinformation between the controllers with the hand-off. If the mode C was out and the controller sensed this but believed he was told from the handoff controller the aircraft was at FL320 (and/or getting a strip for that altitude) he would not have been in a hurry to fix this since his traffic (the airliner) was at FL360.

4. No TCAS with the airliner? It doesn't appear they were turning away from the conflict traffic.

That's how many accidents occur, a cascade of issues "snowballing". (Newer term latent errors filtering through the swiss cheese safety net, when all the holes align...
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Old 03-05-2013, 04:44 AM   #4364
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My new ride

Taylorcraft BC-12D. Light sport. I haven't flown it yet but taxi tells me Mechanical brakes suck.......C90-12F and no electrics.......

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Old 03-06-2013, 05:40 PM   #4365
Beamer Pilot
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New ride

Beamer Bob,
What a feeling right...I put a deposit on my new wings two days ago not my first one, had a few before.
I'll post pics following delivery on April 4th. Don't want to jinx it...
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