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Old 03-27-2013, 07:53 AM   #106
JimVonBaden
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Originally Posted by Gummee! View Post
I'm living proof of the opposite of that last sentence. Going from Manasshole to Rockville on a daily basis and sharing lanes when needed was the only thing getting me to work close to on time.

Its actually not bad here in the DC area. Lots of immigrants who are used to bikes sharing lanes 'in my country' so they don't bat an eye at it. Yes, you'll encounter the occasional redneck in a pickup that thinks he needs to be 'road police' but you can typically spot them well ahead of time.

99% of the people are brain-dead zombies thinking about anything BUT driving a car. You're past them before they realize you're even on the road with them.

Having said that, you can't just share 'CA Style' around here without attracting the wrong kind of attention from the po-po. Go a few cars, hop in a gap. Go a few cars, hop in a gap. Repeat as necessary.



M
Mike,

We have had this discussion before. I think a lot has to do with when and where. Nearly any hour of the day on 95 to and from Stafford and all the way to DC on 395 you would find a completely different story. I lived in Woodbridge for 9 years, and can't count the number of times drivers either though poor driving, or through agressive jerkiness, have nearly run me off the road. More than once they threatened me just for passing them, not even lane splitting. I can easily immagine their reaction if I split lanes during rush hour when traffic was at a near stand still.

Just think what it is like on a bicycle, and multiply that by 10 for a MC splitting on the freeway. I could filter in-town traffic some, but still there are issues.

I won't even get into the police issues!

Jim
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Old 03-27-2013, 08:11 AM   #107
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Originally Posted by JimVonBaden View Post
Mike,

We have had this discussion before. I think a lot has to do with when and where. Nearly any hour of the day on 95 to and from Stafford and all the way to DC on 395 you would find a completely different story. I lived in Woodbridge for 9 years, and can't count the number of times drivers either though poor driving, or through agressive jerkiness, have nearly run me off the road. More than once they threatened me just for passing them, not even lane splitting. I can easily immagine their reaction if I split lanes during rush hour when traffic was at a near stand still.

Just think what it is like on a bicycle, and multiply that by 10 for a MC splitting on the freeway. I could filter in-town traffic some, but still there are issues.

I won't even get into the police issues!

Jim
IME they don't know you're there till you're past em. No way for *most* of the people to screw with you.

If you're in stop and go traffic, its really tough for anyone to do anything abruptly. Just not enough room.

Even sharing lanes in CA the cars don't see you. Its up to you to ride assertively enough to be defensive. IOW there's spots that are safer to ride than others: riding next to a car with an open lane to your side(s)? Bad They'll dive into that space in a heartbeat if they think it'll get em ahead.
Riding between 2 cars side-by-side? Better.
Riding between the lanes in a gap with 4 cars around you? OK

Like anything else, it gets easier with practice.

M
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Old 03-27-2013, 08:14 AM   #108
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Meet you in the new helmet law thread in 3... 2......
I'm actually against the mandatory helmet use, but I'm AGTATT by choice, so the helmet laws are irrelevant to me personally. I would like to support a legislation which I could benefit from. I guess that splitting and filtering is not important for "bikers" who are happy to be seen idling at traffic lights on their shiny Harleys.
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Old 03-27-2013, 08:51 AM   #109
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Originally Posted by Gummee! View Post

Its no one's job to be 'road police' or to 'teach someone a lesson.'

M
But making up your own rules is ok?

Most folks will consider both types of behavior unacceptable. Were a small minority with a bad image and reputation, I fail to see the wisdom of sending contradictory messages.

Most danger is perceived not actual,
When riding your bicycle, you dont like it when someone makes a pass you perceive as dangerous and illegal, labeling them as "idiots", yet you feel its ok to make an illegal lane splitting pass that is perceived as dangerous.

Whats that make you in their opinion?

Just saying,
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Old 03-27-2013, 11:40 AM   #110
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But making up your own rules is ok?

Most folks will consider both types of behavior unacceptable. Were a small minority with a bad image and reputation, I fail to see the wisdom of sending contradictory messages.

Most danger is perceived not actual,
When riding your bicycle, you dont like it when someone makes a pass you perceive as dangerous and illegal, labeling them as "idiots", yet you feel its ok to make an illegal lane splitting pass that is perceived as dangerous.

Whats that make you in their opinion?

Just saying,
I ride my bicycle in stopped traffic the same way I ride a MC. I'm either going up the side if there's enough room, or the middle if there's not. Typically there's more room in the middle than on the side of the road so that's where I end up. Safer up the middle too. No one's going to try and turn right into a driveway without looking from the left lane.

So, as I've pointed out in other threads: riding bicycles and riding MCs are essentially the same thing.

Lest you think I'm going balls-out, I'm not. Even in CA I'd be making forward progress at 5-10mph faster than traffic. I had to keep an eye on my mirrors 'cause there were people sharing lanes faster than I wanted to go. Up to and including the CHP!

M
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Old 03-27-2013, 11:49 AM   #111
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Originally Posted by Gummee! View Post
I ride my bicycle in stopped traffic the same way I ride a MC. I'm either going up the side if there's enough room, or the middle if there's not. Typically there's more room in the middle than on the side of the road so that's where I end up. Safer up the middle too. No one's going to try and turn right into a driveway without looking from the left lane.

So, as I've pointed out in other threads: riding bicycles and riding MCs are essentially the same thing.

Lest you think I'm going balls-out, I'm not. Even in CA I'd be making forward progress at 5-10mph faster than traffic. I had to keep an eye on my mirrors 'cause there were people sharing lanes faster than I wanted to go. Up to and including the CHP!

M
Wasn't criticizing or judging, just playing devils advocate, when we choose to step outside the "rules", a lot of folks won't view it favorably. Perspective.
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Old 03-27-2013, 11:58 AM   #112
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Originally Posted by windmill View Post
Wasn't criticizing or judging, just playing devils advocate, when we choose to step outside the "rules", a lot of folks won't view it favorably. Perspective.
I agree. It may be hypocritical, but I'll draw a line between 'illegal' and 'unsafe.' If the biggest nanny-state out there allows it, how unsafe can it be?!

...and I'm prepared with my best 'gee officer. I did it all the time in CA. I was *wondering* why no one was sharing lanes here' line.

I doubt it'll work, but ya never know.

Even in CA most people are driving brain-dead. They don't see you there either. Gotta be careful.

M
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Old 03-27-2013, 05:35 PM   #113
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Originally Posted by Gummee! View Post
I agree. It may be hypocritical, but I'll draw a line between 'illegal' and 'unsafe.' If the biggest nanny-state out there allows it, how unsafe can it be?!

...and I'm prepared with my best 'gee officer. I did it all the time in CA. I was *wondering* why no one was sharing lanes here' line.

I doubt it'll work, but ya never know.

Even in CA most people are driving brain-dead. They don't see you there either. Gotta be careful.

M
It gives any assbag that disagrees with your passing to cause youa shit storm of trouble by kicking their door open. Essplain that to your insurance company.
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Old 03-27-2013, 05:54 PM   #114
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It gives any assbag that disagrees with your passing to cause youa shit storm of trouble by kicking their door open. Essplain that to your insurance company.
Get a lot of that down there in Dixie, do ya?
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Old 03-27-2013, 05:59 PM   #115
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It gives any assbag that disagrees with your passing to cause youa shit storm of trouble by kicking their door open. Essplain that to your insurance company.
Ya know. As many times as I've heard about someone dooring a rider (either moto- or pedal-) I've never seen it personally

M
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Old 03-27-2013, 06:27 PM   #116
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I just saw this thread and admit I didn't read every post so I apologize if this has been addressed:

Why is it legal for bicycles to lane split and not motorcycles? Where I live, if a bicycle is on the street, the rider has to follow the road laws (very few do however). Is it just a matter of bicycles being more PC than motorcycles.
Virtually everywhere I go in Canada and the US, I see bicycles lane splitting, going up the shoulder, not stopping for stop signs, blah, blah, blah. Yet to see one pulled over because of it.

Rod
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Old 03-27-2013, 08:47 PM   #117
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I just saw this thread and admit I didn't read every post so I apologize if this has been addressed:

Why is it legal for bicycles to lane split and not motorcycles? Where I live, if a bicycle is on the street, the rider has to follow the road laws (very few do however). Is it just a matter of bicycles being more PC than motorcycles.
Virtually everywhere I go in Canada and the US, I see bicycles lane splitting, going up the shoulder, not stopping for stop signs, blah, blah, blah. Yet to see one pulled over because of it.

Rod
Because bicyclists are great and everyone else is swine.......
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Old 03-27-2013, 09:27 PM   #118
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Originally Posted by drrod1 View Post
I just saw this thread and admit I didn't read every post so I apologize if this has been addressed:

Why is it legal for bicycles to lane split and not motorcycles? Where I live, if a bicycle is on the street, the rider has to follow the road laws (very few do however). Is it just a matter of bicycles being more PC than motorcycles.
Virtually everywhere I go in Canada and the US, I see bicycles lane splitting, going up the shoulder, not stopping for stop signs, blah, blah, blah. Yet to see one pulled over because of it.

Rod
Technically a bicycle is supposed to follow the same rules as any other vehicle, but in an incident, its unlikely anybody but the cyclist will be hurt.

Darwin takes care of stupid cyclists by default, no need for law enforcement.
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Old 03-27-2013, 09:41 PM   #119
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I agree. It may be hypocritical, but I'll draw a line between 'illegal' and 'unsafe.' If the biggest nanny-state out there allows it, how unsafe can it be?!
Where legal, I don't think "safety" is an issue beyond the judgment of the individual rider. The problem is to non riders who see someone splitting where illegal, they won't see any difference between 'illegal" and "unsafe".

The only reason I question doing it illegally is the long term effects it may have on all riders. Like with cyclists ,a few people are looking for any excuse to cause us misery on the street or in the law books.
Why ask for trouble?
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Old 03-28-2013, 05:55 AM   #120
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It gives any assbag that disagrees with your passing to cause youa shit storm of trouble by kicking their door open. Essplain that to your insurance company.

The problem with opening a door on a motorcyclist: You're stuck in traffic, and it's unlikely you'll KILL the motorcyclist. Which means, the rider will probably beat the everloving shit out of you.
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