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Old 04-04-2013, 05:46 AM   #121
az45
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Obviously ADVrider is mostly bikes guys, the three "complainers" in this thread
are NORRA car racers.
It seems that the bike guys treat it as a rally and the car guys treat it as a desert race.
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Old 04-04-2013, 07:26 AM   #122
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Reading over the rules I noticed the timing check ins at the beginning of the day and first stage are a little different from other rallies. The example given shows the check in window during the minute prior to your actual check in time, not the minute of your check in time. Is this correct and if so why the divergence from traditional rally scoring?

From the rule book:
7.2. The size of the check in window is:
1. For the start of each day: one minute.
2. For the arrival at the first racing stage of each day: one minute.


7.3. Examples:
At the very beginning of the rally, you have an assigned time, published beforehand, to leave the ceremonial start on a transit at 7:15:00. You need to present yourself at the start between 7:14:01 and 7:15:00 to receive your time card and begin your transit at 7:15:00.


Typically the check in window would be during the minute posted 7:15:00 to 7:15:59

Same for arriving at the first race stage. Start time of 7:15:00 plus transit time of say 1 hour would traditionally put you checking in from 8:15:00 to 8:15:59. Based on the example given in the rule book I'd question if this is correct.

Maybe Anders can clarify...
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Old 04-04-2013, 07:45 AM   #123
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[QUOTE=BC61;21106115]Reading over the rules I noticed the timing check ins at the beginning of the day and first stage are a little different from other rallies. The example given shows the check in window during the minute prior to your actual check in time, not the minute of your check in time. Is this correct and if so why the divergence from traditional rally scoring?

From the rule book:
7.2. The size of the check in window is:
1. For the start of each day: one minute.
2. For the arrival at the first racing stage of each day: one minute.

7.3. Examples:
At the very beginning of the rally, you have an assigned time, published beforehand, to leave the ceremonial start on a transit at 7:15:00. You need to present yourself at the start between 7:14:01 and 7:15:00 to receive your time card and begin your transit at 7:15:00.

Typically the check in window would be during the minute posted 7:15:00 to 7:15:59

Same for arriving at the first race stage. Start time of 7:15:00 plus transit time of say 1 hour would traditionally put you checking in from 8:15:00 to 8:15:59. Based on the example given in the rule book I'd question if this is correct.

Maybe Anders can clarify...[/QUOTE}

As I understand it: at the start of each DAY

The one minute is pre staging
Your clock starts at 7:15.00

At 7:15.01 you are LATE! and your clock is running. and you should go to the back of the line.

Let's HOPE they STAND by this ,last Year riders would just show up when ever they wanted and jump in line .

as for the start of Race Stages , if you show up early you get time penalties added to your card
, If your late you add the Late time to your card.
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Old 04-04-2013, 10:29 AM   #124
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It's different because there are not the usual separate Arrival and Start time controls that you are used to. There's only a, well, let's call it something else, a "GO! control". So you check in just before your minute, are released on your minute, and are scored from :00 on that minute till you're clocked at the finish.

Yep, it's different. It works, with the large amount of space and 30 minute check in window.

Now someone needs to pipe in and say "that's not REAL rally". *smirk*

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Old 04-04-2013, 10:39 AM   #125
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Baja Dad View Post
The one minute is pre staging
Your clock starts at 7:15.00

At 7:15.01 you are LATE! and your clock is running. and you should go to the back of the line.
No. You shouldn't go to the back of the line. If you're late to a start, you should go up and start. We don't want someone that's fast running over anyone in front of them. That doesn't make the race safer or more fun for either the on-time but slower people getting buzzed or the faster but late person fighting dust.

You'll get a penalty for missing your slot, that rule is new, but there's no "back of the line" rule or policy.

Quote:
as for the start of Race Stages , if you show up early you get time penalties added to your card, If your late you add the Late time to your card.
Just for clarity for those new to the race, not to your CARD. Nothing goes on your card except the times. Penalties will be found in the printed and online scoring results, but just because your card doesn't show any penalties doesn't mean you don't have any. Actually, there isn't even room on your card for writing down penalties.

Cheers,
Anders
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Old 04-04-2013, 11:01 AM   #126
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Anders Green View Post
It's different because there are not the usual separate Arrival and Start time controls that you are used to. There's only a, well, let's call it something else, a "GO! control". So you check in just before your minute, are released on your minute, and are scored from :00 on that minute till you're clocked at the finish.

Anders
Ok, I get it for the start of the day. Same for the start of the first special? Take beginning transit start time, add transit time, check in during the previous minute?
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Old 04-04-2013, 12:04 PM   #127
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For all the specials except the first one of each day you have a 30 minute window to enter. When you do go to enter, the one minute prior to check-in and then "go" at the top of the minute applies. I just doesn't really matter which minute it is as long as you're within the 30 minutes.
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Old 04-04-2013, 12:35 PM   #128
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BC61 View Post
Ok, I get it for the start of the day. Same for the start of the first special? Take beginning transit start time, add transit time, check in during the previous minute?
Yes.

Let's do a simple example:

You're scheduled to leave town at 8am and there's a 60 minute transit. (THESE NUMBERS ARE MADE UP FOR THIS EXAMPLE AND ARE NOT THE ACTUAL SCHEDULE.)

If you leave town at 8:00 am and are looking at a 60 minute transit, you're going to be racing at 9:00am at the first stage, so naturally you're going to have to get your paperwork/time card/everything squared away BEFORE 9:00am. So you check in at 8:59:xx to start racing at 9:00:00.

For the entire rally, when you start a stage is also scored as the time you arrived to start that stage. So take note, you could finish the transit with 5 minutes left in your 30 minute window. "Ahh, great, I made it in time, I'm 20 feet from the start." you think to yourself. If you screw around for 12 minutes, roll up, start... you'll be scored as 7 minutes late.

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Old 04-04-2013, 02:25 PM   #129
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Anders, are you saying the target and max time concept doesn't exist anymore?
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Old 04-04-2013, 03:02 PM   #130
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Anders Green View Post
No. You shouldn't go to the back of the line. If you're late to a start, you should go up and start. We don't want someone that's fast running over anyone in front of them. That doesn't make the race safer or more fun for either the on-time but slower people getting buzzed or the faster but late person fighting dust.

You'll get a penalty for missing your slot, that rule is new, but there's no "back of the line" rule or policy.


Just for clarity for those new to the race, not to your CARD. Nothing goes on your card except the times. Penalties will be found in the printed and online scoring results, but just because your card doesn't show any penalties doesn't mean you don't have any. Actually, there isn't even room on your card for writing down penalties.

Cheers,
Anders

Yes They should go to the BACK of the LINE!!!
who cares about DUST !!! Dont show up late!!
and Fast racers passing slower ones happens ALL DAY LONG!

What is the Penalty for showing up late on the start slot time??
10 min????
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Baja Dad screwed with this post 04-04-2013 at 03:23 PM
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Old 04-04-2013, 07:47 PM   #131
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Define "checked in"? I assume that means when they actually comunicate with you, check your road book ect.

I've always been in sight if the start prior to my start time, then rolled up within the 30 minute window(transit time + 30 minutes). Is it different this year?
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Old 04-04-2013, 09:08 PM   #132
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Quote:
Originally Posted by roadracer View Post
Anders, are you saying the target and max time concept doesn't exist anymore?
Nope, I'm not saying that at all.

Anders
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Old 04-04-2013, 09:10 PM   #133
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So it sounds like you can donk around a bit if you have to, in sight of or in the start control area, but dont hand them your card till youre ready to go. Is that like it? Or is it - dont let them see you?
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Old 04-04-2013, 09:13 PM   #134
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Yes They should go to the BACK of the LINE!!!
I understand that "go to the back of the line" is your opinion of what the rules should be.

I'm simply stating that "go to the back of the line" is not in the rules currently, was not in the rules in the past, and is not the expected behavior.

If you want to start talking about what the rules should be in the future, June, a month after the rally, is the best time to start that.

Cheers!
Anders
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Old 04-04-2013, 09:17 PM   #135
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Laugh

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stagehand View Post
So it sounds like you can donk around a bit if you have to, in sight of or in the start control area, but dont hand them your card till youre ready to go. Is that like it? Or is it - dont let them see you?
It is nothing like the "don't let them see you" checks one experiences in an enduro. You're allowed to be at the start within sight of everyone. You're allowed to use your 30 minute window to do repairs or relieve yourself.

Most likely you guys have been poring over the rules of what you're allowed to do to your bike all winter. The other part, it's probably time to start reading that. *grin* It's a good time to LINK TO THE RULES OF THE RALLY.



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