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Old 04-12-2013, 02:55 PM   #46
Sporting Wood OP
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Everything is shipped and on its way! France, California, Czech, Greece, Australia, East Canada West Canada, etc... etc...

International shipping has really been an education! All ya'll should have tracking in your emails. If not, pm me.
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Old 04-12-2013, 07:28 PM   #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by avocadofarmer View Post
I'm going to jet for 2k elevation, stock exhaust. 175/178 mains, 60 idle air, 42 pilot.
You're in unknown territory here by sticking with stock exhausts. Stock jetting, while fat and rich below 4000 rpms becomes lean as a bone once the motor starts making stride. If it didn't, the catalysts in those stock pipes would burn like the surface of the sun!

While you certainly can rich it up a bit, its unknown how big a jet you can go before you start to encounter melting plastic and the possibility of a burnt valve!

If it was me...and it has been... I'd blow a few bucks on a nice set of pipes or in the least do some surgery on the stockers. Its possible to cut the welds on the exit side and extract the cats, then weld them back up. Cheapest and a good way out imho unless you're willing to toss on a set of FMF's or Akras ( have Akras)
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Old 04-12-2013, 08:33 PM   #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by preppypyro View Post
Hopefully Im not overstepping anything here, but to everyone that ordered one of these kits, what are you guys doing for jetting? Going with H2W or?

Looking for a little guidance as I would like to talk to someone and order some jets so I can install everything at the same time, then demolish some tires!
I am jetting for 500 - 3000 feet

Already have a mixed jet kit from H2W that is part H2W and FactoryPro. Running FMF's with non-SAS

I am going up on mains probably 168 /170 and i am running 45 pilots. Bike will be ridden as a sport SM and not an ADV
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Old 04-12-2013, 09:54 PM   #49
gefr
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Jets shop

Quote:
Originally Posted by vwboomer View Post
stupid question but where are you getting your jets?
http://www.pjmotorsports.com/keihin-...ml#main%20jets
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Old 04-14-2013, 05:58 AM   #50
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I installed a filter and tuned a friends bike yesterday.

It had Akras on it, no quiet tip. A 70 idle air jet, 45 slows and tiny mains(148 & 152) had been added along with a Uni pre filter dealio. I 'think' the needles were stock but couldn't tell for sure. They had been moved to the 3rd clip.

I set it up with 172 mains. Guessed that the richer bottom end would compensate somewhat and wanted to keep it from gasping at elevation...plus I didn't have a set of 175's. Adjusted the floats to 4mm from 3mm. Also didn't have any 50 idle air jets to set the slow mixture back to stock, so I got creative. Swapped air cut offs to 90's from 80's and put in 40's in place of 50 idle air jets. Total air is the same but it seems to backfire a bit when the throttle gets closed. . That'll get swapped back once some 50 air jets get ordered!

The bike ran like a raped ape, not rich or lean anywhere in its range. It remains to be seen how it runs at elevation (roughly 1000' here). I've always had a hard time getting the 45's to work on the mountain.

Also, when I installed the filter on this bike I noticed what could be a potential issue. I can't say for sure as I've put these on several bikes with no fit problems, they've always been tight. There's also lots of folks who've made their own with the same grommets who've not ever reported a fit issue. This bike is the first early production version (2003) and has been through a lot... rebuilt several times.
When I went to put the velocity stacks on, they didn't tighten down enough. The plate was a tiny bit loose. The bottoms of the stacks were warped and it had a BMC filter in there which seemed a but thicker than normal, maybe its stretched the plastic mounts. Regardless, I shoved in another gasket under the filter plate to make it work.
If any of you encounter a similar issue, let me know. While I think its an isolated problem, I can't say for sure. All the filter plates up till yesterday fit nice and tight... I can rush out a filler gaskets and include them with subsequent kits if this is a problem.
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Old 04-14-2013, 08:52 AM   #51
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Sorry I got confused in different terminology here.

Your setup is: #172 mains, #40 Idle Air Jets, #90 Low Jets, 3rd needle notch, 4mm floats, is that correct?
Cheers.
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Old 04-14-2013, 12:43 PM   #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gefr View Post
Your setup is: #172 mains, #40 Idle Air Jets, #90 Low Jets, 3rd needle notch, 4mm floats, is that correct?
Cheers.

This is more an experiment than my setting. I am simply sharing what I'm doing.

I have my bike jetted for economy and functionality at high elevation. Its a very conservative/lean setup but seems to work well everywhere.
Stock air jets
FP needle @ 2
42 slow jets
178 main jets
4mm floats
Screws @2

Another bike we tuned yesterday, since I didn't have the necessary jets to set up like my bike...and since the owner wanted more power at the possible expense of some economy and altitude flexibility. It was setup as follows and listed as much so we can remember what we did as much as I'd like opinions.
90 idle air cut off
40 idle air (this was only done because we didn't have a set of 50 idle air jets! Someone had previously installed 70's. I wanted to get total slow jet air close to stock 80+50=130 and I had 90's and 40's. There is absolutely no need to do this, at all!)
Needle @ 3 ( may have been a FP needle?)
45 slow jets
172 mains
4mm floats
Screws @1.5

I was surprised it ran out as well as it did. Only complaint is it backfires a little much when the throttle is cut (probably due to the air jet sillyness). Gobs of power everywhere.
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Old 04-14-2013, 03:40 PM   #53
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Sorry again. The idle air cutoff is the same with idle air jets
the slow air jets are the same with low jets?


Your bike has 2-1 and ITG foam filter? and Akra mufflers?
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Old 04-14-2013, 03:53 PM   #54
Sporting Wood OP
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gefr View Post
Sorry again. The idle air cutoff is the same with idle air jets
the slow air jets are the same with low jets?
No. The idle air jets ( idle air and idle air cut off), provide air that bleeds and atomizes into the slow fuel jet (or low jet) circuit. The only reason there are two idle air jets is for emissions (imho). The cut off jet cuts off airflow when the throttle is closed, drastically reducing fuel through the circuit when its not needed.

Its best to stick with factory air jets with this filter imho. These tend to function as course adjustments to set the taper and range of the slow jet circuit. Its pretty good where it is...though I will grant there is a good reason to bump idle air slightly when the bigger 45 slow jet is used. More fuel means greater need for air, all things being equal.
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Old 04-15-2013, 01:33 AM   #55
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Terminology

Your bike's settings with ITG air filter and Akras:

Stock air jets = Idle Air Jets #50
FP needle @ 2
42 slow jets = stock low jets #42
178 main jets
4mm floats
Screws @2 = Idle Mixture Screws
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Fuel filters Fuel pump
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Clutch master cylinder resleeving
Out of office 25 till 4th August

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Old 04-15-2013, 03:41 AM   #56
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Too damn many jets on these things. I'm used to rejetting my 300's

This summer I am planning on going on a trip to CO from WI. Serious elevation changes there, so hopefully one of the setups posted here will work for both, as I don't want to have to change jetting again.
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Old 04-15-2013, 04:39 AM   #57
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I am lost in jetting space!

Lets find a baseline which works well starting from STOCK (I am not shouting!) settings so we carb beginners will not get confused with all those terms.

As I understand, going from stock to ITG, we need to change:

1) floats from 3mm to 4mm (is that leaner?)
2) Lift needles from 2nd to 3rd
3) Up mains to whatever (170 to 180), depending on elevation and exhaust.

Right?
Are the FP needles a must?
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Old 04-15-2013, 05:24 AM   #58
Sporting Wood OP
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vwboomer View Post
Too damn many jets on these things. I'm used to rejetting my 300's

This summer I am planning on going on a trip to CO from WI. Serious elevation changes there, so hopefully one of the setups posted here will work for both, as I don't want to have to change jetting again.
Those settings directly above that Gefr is quoting spent some time at 14,000' this past summer. Its a bit on the conservative side, there's more power to be found with more fuel in the low end, but it will work from sea level all the way to the clouds. I may would knock mains down a size for Colorado, 175's or maybe 172's.
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Old 04-15-2013, 05:57 AM   #59
Sporting Wood OP
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gefr View Post
Your bike's settings with ITG air filter and Akras:

Stock air jets = Idle Air Jets #50
FP needle @ 2
42 slow jets = stock low jets #42
178 main jets
4mm floats
Screws @2 = Idle Mixture Screws
Yep.

This is a good setup for touring.
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Old 04-15-2013, 07:15 AM   #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mousitsas View Post
I am lost in jetting space!

Lets find a baseline which works well starting from STOCK (I am not shouting!) settings so we carb beginners will not get confused with all those terms.

As I understand, going from stock to ITG, we need to change:

1) floats from 3mm to 4mm (is that leaner?)
2) Lift needles from 2nd to 3rd
3) Up mains to whatever (170 to 180), depending on elevation and exhaust.

Right?
Are the FP needles a must?
FP needles are not a must...though I really like them.

I would first determine what sort of riding I'm planning on doing and where, how high. Different sorts of riding call for different sorts of jetting. I'm touring and crossing all levels of elevation so I have a rather conservative setup that's somewhat lean at sea level but can work very high up too, though it begins to get a tad rich. It returns excellent mileage and also provides lots of hp.

Within a specific elevation range, one may better setup for either power or economy. I've had mine setup with the 45 pilots and it had far more willingness to loft the front wheel. Mileage wasn't as good and when I climbed up into the mountains, it would bog down far too rich.

Fwiw, the most important thing I have gleaned from messing with these carbs is that the float needs to be set leaner than the factories 3mm. This is an absolute critical adjustment, and a rather fiddly one to get correct. The float height baselines the entire carb. I set it to 4mm regardless of what sort of jetting setup I'm after.

The next consideration is which pilot jet. 42 or 45. 45= more HP at lower elevations, slightly less mpg and a bit less friendly at high elevations. 42 is weaker though more flexible.

I consider mains next. What runs out at wfo with the float and slows set. This isn't the typical order of jetting a carb such as this but I find it works. With this filter, we expect to be in a range between 172 and 182, depending on elevation and pipe.

Needle position is entirely about transitioning from the slow circuit to the mains. What works well on one bike may not on the next. If the bike feels a bit lazy spooling up through 4000 rpms, then it may benefit from a higher needle. If it bogs down when you twist the throttle at transition, it may be too high. Typically its at 2 or 3 with these bikes. Note though, that there is a fair amount of bleed through while the needle is closed and this affects the low circuit a bit. Raising the needle typically results in enriching the bottom so it sometimes is necessary to compensate with the fuel screws.

I baseline the screws at 2 turns out with 42 pilots, and 1.5 turns with 45 pilots. Fine adjust from there. Without Satan's airbox out of the way, they can be accessed with the right tank off...which makes adjustment far easier. I will turn up idle to 2000+ rpm and pull the rear plug wire...turning the bike into a thumper.. Then adjust the screw at roughly 2000 until it runs best. Count the turns out and transfer to the rear carb.

This is the way I approach it, and I'm no means a master of Keihen's domain. Jetting varies so much between riders and places that its fairly tough to nail down a prescribed setup. Endeavor to get it close...

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