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Old 04-20-2013, 03:33 AM   #136
phoenixdoglover
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The majority opinion on off road worthiness of the big ADV bikes, according to my copious reading and some direct experience:
Very Good
KTM 990 Adv

Good
Multistrada (not in sport mode)
Yamaha S10
BMW R1200GS
Stelvio NTX

Poor to Fair
Triumph Explorer
Multistrada in sport mode ;-)

????
KTM 1190....probably good
BMW new GS
Vstrom (DL1000)

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Old 04-20-2013, 05:38 AM   #137
stevie88
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Originally Posted by my3sons59 View Post
I, too, am interested in hearing from more Stelvio owners...particularly about the bike's vibration issues. Some say it's been hyped up and isn't that big of a deal, while others (mainly magazine reviewers) say it's an issue to be aware of and taken into consideration. I suppose I'll need to arrange for a test ride to see for myself. Other than what I've heard about the vibes, the bike looks awesome & seems to be a fine ride and worthy of serious consideration.
I've put 6200 trouble free miles on my 2013 Stelvio, including some longish 700+ mile days. The vibration is a non issue. I even removed the rubber pads from the foot pegs, it's not a problem. The US spec mirrors need to be replaced and the euro turn signL kit added, otherwise its about perfect right out of the box. The stock seat is outstanding too.
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Old 04-20-2013, 07:22 AM   #138
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Originally Posted by browneye View Post
I did ride a GS and liked it two-up on the freeway. Eighty is comfy and good passing ability. But it shifted clunky and felt heavy in the parking lot. I didn't like the way the engine torque tries to tip the bike. It just felt weird, like it was an airplane engine in a bike frame. I actually liked the tenere a little bettter, but the ecu off idle is horrible, and I doubt it would hold it's value or be as durable as a gs.
Speaking ONLY to this bit...

In My test rides of both a GS and the S10, the (rotational)torque of the GS was far more noticable, I thought it a bit un-nerving at slow speed yet kind of cool, in that the power was felt. handling at slow speed was MUCH more comfortable on the S10.
At freeway speeds both bikes go just fine, the GS was a bit quicker, but the S10 was more than adequate. Now having had the S10 for a year,with a 8000 mile roadtrip,LOADED, under my belt, i dont doubt its ability.

shifting of all the GS bikes, including the F650 i used to own, feels clunky to me. the S10 shifts smooth.

the off idle "stumble" on the S10 is a complaint from people, I didnt think it that bad, however, a 15 cent minifuse plugged into the clutch handle switch fixes that. I would like the ECU fuel map restictions to be undone, and there are options out there, however I personally question the need.
It pains me that yamaha hamstrung themselves here in the fueling/HP. Looking at some of the Euro S10 riders that have reflashed and tweaked their bikes a bit, it sounds like a 125HP is possible, rather than the 98 the US spec bikes produce.

The last little bit is what I really wanted to address...Resale? yeah GS will likely hold value better, but all bikes are depreciating assets, I dont generally buy things with resale in mind, i buy what WORKS best for Me and "bang for the buck" not to mention the GS was 5grand more from the get go, so there goes the resale difference.

Reliability? My money, literally is on the S10, I'm sure end of use cost of ownership of the S10 will be considerably less than Fräulein GS.
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Old 04-20-2013, 08:04 AM   #139
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[QUOTE]the off idle "stumble" on the S10 is a complaint from people, I didnt think it that bad, however, a 15 cent minifuse plugged into the clutch handle switch fixes that

Thanks for your post. Can you elaborate a bit more on this "off idle stumble" that people keep mentioning? And also about the minifuse fix? I totally unfamiliar with what you're referring to. Thx.
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Old 04-20-2013, 09:15 AM   #140
browneye
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[QUOTE=my3sons59;21229857]
Quote:
the off idle "stumble" on the S10 is a complaint from people, I didnt think it that bad, however, a 15 cent minifuse plugged into the clutch handle switch fixes that

Thanks for your post. Can you elaborate a bit more on this "off idle stumble" that people keep mentioning? And also about the minifuse fix? I totally unfamiliar with what you're referring to. Thx.

Blue Mule makes really good points. For the biggest of them all I favor the tenere most as well.

In yamaha's infinite wisdom they decided the bike was too much to handle for us idiot riders so they de-tuned the motor in the first three gears at lower rpm. So when you let the clutch out and grab a handful it just leisurely motors along, there's no hit. I doubt you could scratch or pop a wheelie. Not that you need to. It's annoying at best, and can be removed with a fuse, but that also eliminates another feature which escapes me at the moment. The bike is very smooth and goes faster than the butt-dyno might indicate, it's very sorted, almost too much so which some complain as being mundane, too mild, lacking in excitement. It needs a can or something, it has that honda-lawnmower exhaust note.

As far as shifting, it's on par with the tiger, very smooth. My only complaint with the tiger box is if you don't downshift as you come to a stop it can be sticky to get shifted down. I find a lot of bikes are that way. As long as you keep the internals moving they shift easy. The ratios are also too close on the tiger, first is a bit high and 6th could be higher. Wizz-bang motor though.

If you really have interest in the tenere there's a couple of excellent threads here, and the tenere owners forum which goes into all the detail you could ever want on the model. It has quite a loyal following, the owners really like them.

Much as the guzzi is so unique and cool, the tenere is a much safer bet as far as dependability, rideabilty, capability, and keeping it on the road. JMHO. After all, it IS a Yamaha.
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Old 04-20-2013, 10:39 AM   #141
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My3Sons, check your PMs

I WANTED the GS...badly. i love that boxer engine...

I bought the S10... I feel i got the better bike.

all the other brands?...cant really speak to them as there are none to test in My area...and thus NO support. thats a deal breaker for me right there.
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Old 04-20-2013, 10:40 AM   #142
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Multi!

Is NOT good off road!
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Old 04-20-2013, 01:14 PM   #143
c-m
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cloudhopper View Post
One thing to keep in mind though when comparing weights with especially to the GS is, that BMW was very keen on having "the lightest bike". So they went to great lenght to ensure that it is on paper and essentially reflects an unridable bike in an equipment state nobody orders. The moment you put center stand, ABS, ESA or even boxes on it and pour fuel into it, that advantage evaporates.

That a bit of nonsense as on the BWM website they list the weight of the bike fully fuelled and ready to ride, so that includes all fluids.

There is no mention of the accessories though of course.
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Old 04-20-2013, 07:35 PM   #144
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Thanks for your post. I've not ridden any of the bikes you mentioned, but based on all the reviews I've read, I'd say your summary is dead-on accurate.

Quote:
Originally Posted by phoenixdoglover View Post
The majority opinion on off road worthiness of the big ADV bikes, according to my copious reading and some direct experience:
Very Good
KTM 990 Adv

Good
Multistrada (not in sport mode)
Yamaha S10
BMW R1200GS
Stelvio NTX

Poor to Fair
Triumph Explorer
Multistrada in sport mode ;-)

????
KTM 1190....probably good
BMW new GS
Vstrom (DL1000)

Sent from my GT-S7562 using Tapatalk 2
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Old 04-20-2013, 07:49 PM   #145
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Thanks for your posts and for the helpful PM info. I'd like to test the Stelvio, but I'm in the same situation, as the only available brand in my area is the Yamaha...and dealer support, along with proven Yammy reliability, is very important to me.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Blue Mule View Post
My3Sons, check your PMs

I WANTED the GS...badly. i love that boxer engine...

I bought the S10... I feel i got the better bike.

all the other brands?...cant really speak to them as there are none to test in My area...and thus NO support. thats a deal breaker for me right there.
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Old 04-20-2013, 11:19 PM   #146
Ockrocket
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Quote:
Originally Posted by my3sons59 View Post
Thanks for your posts and for the helpful PM info. I'd like to test the Stelvio, but I'm in the same situation, as the only available brand in my area is the Yamaha...and dealer support, along with proven Yammy reliability, is very important to me.
Sounds like your answer in this post.........Yamaha.

Either the Ten660 or the Super 10.

Yamaha make good quality bikes at reasonable prices, reliable with no real issues- plenty of after market stuff and forum support as well.
Plus any bike shop will work on them, BMW's and other Euro stuff generally sees them running for cover.

I own a Wee-Strom, great bike two up or solo and manageable on dirt or fire trails, super reliable and great value for money.

The other bike in my garage is a '94 Kawasaki KLE500, also a great bike but not really two up capable for the long haul.

So you can see I'm not biased towards Yamaha [though I've owned a few, along with Honda bikes as well].

The Yamaha option just makes sense for your situation.
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Old 04-21-2013, 12:58 AM   #147
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Originally Posted by c-m View Post
That a bit of nonsense as on the BWM website they list the weight of the bike fully fuelled and ready to ride, so that includes all fluids.

There is no mention of the accessories though of course.
Well of course it says that on their website.

And of course we believe everything that is written on the BMW website.
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Old 04-21-2013, 07:13 AM   #148
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Originally Posted by my3sons59 View Post
Thanks for your post. I've not ridden any of the bikes you mentioned, but based on all the reviews I've read, I'd say your summary is dead-on accurate.
d00d, you need to get out more.

I test ride new bikes as a hobby, just hoping I'll find something I'll like enough to trade in my GS. Since my own focus is more sport bike oriented I love the Multistrada, but not enough to buy one new.

For YOUR stated interests, any of the bikes mentioned in this thread would be completely competent. Ride them and get the one you LIKE.
Nobody has ever ridden a review or spec sheet.
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Old 04-21-2013, 12:02 PM   #149
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If you lived where I live, you'd drive 2 hours to test ride the Yamaha and 6 hours+ for all the others. There are a couple of closer Yam dealers, but they don't have an S10 and probably won't be getting one...said they haven't had any/many calls or inquiries for it. Just haven't had the opportunity to do any test rides yet, but definitely will before buying.

BTW, what has been your experience with the GS:
* How long have you owned it?
* Is it as reliable as you thought it would be?
* What about cost of ownership?
* Does it require frequent trips to the dealer?

Any other info on the GS would be appreciated. To me, the GS/GSAs are enigmas. On the one hand, they've won every adventure bike award known to man and are consistently held up as the "gold standard". On the other hand, they're notorious for their FD failures along with other reliability issues. Those two "strikes" along with other serious concerns, like high cost of ownership, lack of dealer support in my area, etc., makes the BMW a strike-out and a no-go for me.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JustKip View Post
d00d, you need to get out more.

I test ride new bikes as a hobby, just hoping I'll find something I'll like enough to trade in my GS. Since my own focus is more sport bike oriented I love the Multistrada, but not enough to buy one new.

For YOUR stated interests, any of the bikes mentioned in this thread would be completely competent. Ride them and get the one you LIKE.
Nobody has ever ridden a review or spec sheet.
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Old 04-21-2013, 12:09 PM   #150
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I agree with you that the S10 is looking like a serioius consideration. Question: if you were going on a 500 mile solo trip, would you tend to take the Wee or the KLE? Why?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ockrocket View Post
Sounds like your answer in this post.........Yamaha.

Either the Ten660 or the Super 10.

Yamaha make good quality bikes at reasonable prices, reliable with no real issues- plenty of after market stuff and forum support as well.
Plus any bike shop will work on them, BMW's and other Euro stuff generally sees them running for cover.

I own a Wee-Strom, great bike two up or solo and manageable on dirt or fire trails, super reliable and great value for money.

The other bike in my garage is a '94 Kawasaki KLE500, also a great bike but not really two up capable for the long haul.

So you can see I'm not biased towards Yamaha [though I've owned a few, along with Honda bikes as well].

The Yamaha option just makes sense for your situation.
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