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Old 03-16-2013, 02:56 AM   #16
stefan.
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Can I borrow the thread as well? :)
I'm currently looking at buying either the 660LM or the 350LM, but can't decide which one..

The 660 only can store 20 routes, but can it hold more than that if you have an memory card in it? ie storing them on the card?

The 350 doesn't come with a DVD with the maps? As I've understood it, you can still connect it and transfer the maps to the computer, but that doesn't seem smooth to do that every time. Is there another way? Or do you have to buy something?

Thanks!
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Old 03-16-2013, 09:00 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mudcat View Post
Is that 20 routes total or 20 one thousand point routes?
Don't know. The only info I have is from the chart at the link I posted above. I think adding stuff to a data card might expand the number for both units, as stefan asks, but I haven't put anything on a card yet other than maps.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mudcat View Post
My Zumo 220 does a lot more then my 450 but it doesn’t do anything as well IMO. Auto routing was the big one; I could not trust the 220. Luckily I was able to fix the 450 thanks to the Digitizer thread here. I was really missing the 450

I like being able to see my tracks, I do get off the map occasionally but only once have I needed to use them. And of course, sometimes I save my tracks as routes. But that’s rare; I am really not a fan of dedicated routes.

I like auto routing, I pick the roads as I go and the GPS unit just lets me know if I can get to my target by the road I have chosen. I find riding like that a lot of fun. It’s more work though then just making up a route and downloading into the GPS unit.
The 350 does offer 3 routing "modes" - automobile, motorcycle, direct. I don't really know the specific differences between the car and moto modes, or if those would satisfy you in how they route or not. You would probably have to play with one for a while to see. I always make my routes on the PC then push them to the unit, with the exception of finding gas or food on the road. The 350 does have the handy feature of allowing you to search for something like gas, then incorporate it into the route you are following without blowing away the rest of the route except for the last destination. I do not think the Montana can do that, and I don't know about the 660. It is a VERY handy feature, though, especially if you put some work into the route you are following.

As for tracks, the 350 will let you backtrack over your current track that you just made and will show that on the screen so you can do it. Helpful, I suppose in limited circumstances, but not as good as just being able to have tracks visible. The 350 does record tracks, so you can grab them off the unit and manipulate them, but you can't see them on the unit again unless you do some kind of jiggery-pokery that I have yet to figure out. I hope they change that in an update, but am not holding my breath. If you need to see tracks, the 350, as it stands today, is not for you.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mudcat View Post
If I had to buy a new GPS today, it would probably be a Montana but I am not looking forward to it
I bought a Montana on a black Friday sale for short money, and I really like it, but it seems like I need to run both the Montana AND the 350 to get all the features I like.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mudcat View Post
I wasn’t criticizing the 350 really, though I don’t want one, I was reacting to what the guys at GPS city said about it.
Hope I didn't come across as anything but explanatory. We don't seem to have many 350 owners here, so as people consider it, I like to chime in with what little bits of knowledge I have about mine when people ask.

Stefan, regarding maps, when you register the new unit you will end up hooking it up and running software and map updates. There is an option within that so that the maps are located on both your PC and the 350. Not as good as having a DVD, but it seems to work ok, and I am thinking that if this PC goes belly up that Garmin will let me download maps to the new one.
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Old 03-16-2013, 10:23 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Emoto View Post
The 350 does have the handy feature of allowing you to search for something like gas, then incorporate it into the route you are following without blowing away the rest of the route except for the last destination. I do not think the Montana can do that, and I don't know about the 660. It is a VERY handy feature, though, especially if you put some work into the route you are following.
According to the thread here
http://advrider.com/forums/showthrea...=793908&page=6
the Montana should be able to do the same.
Anyone who know about the 660?
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Old 03-16-2013, 11:21 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stefan. View Post
According to the thread here
http://advrider.com/forums/showthrea...=793908&page=6
the Montana should be able to do the same.
Anyone who know about the 660?
There were some fairly recent posts in the giant Montana thread about this very thing, and if I understood it correctly, something happens to the other waypoints if the route was not transferred to the unit as a "direct" route, but I am now unsure. I should go back and make sure I understood that correctly...
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Emoto screwed with this post 03-16-2013 at 11:34 AM
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Old 04-21-2013, 08:00 PM   #20
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$100 rebate on a Zumo 350LM (expires 30 June 2013))

I've posted this elsewhere.

http://garmin.blogs.com/promotions/2...in-rebate.html
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Old 06-24-2013, 05:41 PM   #21
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Eh? Waypoints / favorites / locations

Does anybody knows about the difference between zumo 350 and zumo 660 considering wthe limit of waypoints favorites and locations? (660 - 1000; 350 - 1)??
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Old 06-29-2013, 05:13 AM   #22
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Originally Posted by de santi View Post
Does anybody knows about the difference between zumo 350 and zumo 660 considering wthe limit of waypoints favorites and locations? (660 - 1000; 350 - 1)??
Look under the specs tab for each:

https://buy.garmin.com/en-US/US/on-t...rod107979.html

https://buy.garmin.com/en-US/US/on-t...rod117259.html

Both say:

Waypoints/favorites/locations 1000

What the 350 will do if you push a route to it that has too many points is it will break it into multiple routes, adding a number to the end of each route name to distinguish it. I do not know if the 660 does this, but I think it does not.
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Old 08-06-2013, 11:46 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Emoto View Post
Look under the specs tab for each:

https://buy.garmin.com/en-US/US/on-t...rod107979.html

https://buy.garmin.com/en-US/US/on-t...rod117259.html

Both say:

Waypoints/favorites/locations 1000

What the 350 will do if you push a route to it that has too many points is it will break it into multiple routes, adding a number to the end of each route name to distinguish it. I do not know if the 660 does this, but I think it does not.

If the above is true regarding the 350LM breaking the route into 30-waypoint chunks, then their specification that it holds 100 routes is B.S. If my route has 95 waypoints, the 350LM will break it into 4 separate routes when I upload it. The same route will be one route in the 660.

As to the other question above about keeping routes on the SD card, yes, you can put as many routes on the SD card as the card will hold. The unit itself can only hold 20 routes (in the internal memory), but you can delete those that are no longer needed and load new ones from the SD card.
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Old 08-07-2013, 12:53 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Emoto View Post
What the 350 will do if you push a route to it that has too many points is it will break it into multiple routes, adding a number to the end of each route name to distinguish it. I do not know if the 660 does this, but I think it does not.
The 660 can do 200 points in a route, so you have to build a really complex route to ever go over that limit. It really bugs me that Garmin does that shit like making the 350 only have a max of 30 or the Montana with a max of 50.
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Old 08-08-2013, 12:44 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Albie View Post
The 660 can do 200 points in a route, so you have to build a really complex route to ever go over that limit. It really bugs me that Garmin does that shit like making the 350 only have a max of 30 or the Montana with a max of 50.
But is the limit for all types of points, or only for waypoints?
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Old 08-25-2013, 11:25 PM   #26
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ZUMO 660 not so hot for off-road

Quote:
Originally Posted by Albie View Post
The 660 can do 200 points in a route, so you have to build a really complex route to ever go over that limit. It really bugs me that Garmin does that shit like making the 350 only have a max of 30 or the Montana with a max of 50.
200 points a complex route? Maybe on the street but nowhere near enough for off-road.

First off it's worth noting that I'm no GPS GURU like EMMBEEDEE, DRTBYK or Atlas Cached but I get around on BaseCamp pretty good. We have seven GPSs since we use them for testing our products: 60CSx, Oregon, Montana, Zumo 450 (I've had it for years on my H-D Road King), a Zumo 350 (total garbage) and a couple of Nuvi's (great for blue sky riding on the pavement).

I just finished working on two routing jobs: one for some friends who are riding TAT the wrong way (West to East) and the other on the loops for the upcoming KTM Adventure Rider rally in Steamboat Springs. In both cases the Zumo 660 was a PITA.

On the TAT routes, I had already reworked the tracks that I purchased from Sam Correro's to reverse the direction, break it into one day ride sections and add a bunch of POIs and waypoints. Putting it all on my Montana and Oregon along with a TOPO map of each TAT state was duck soup. Trying to get it onto to the 660 took hours and the finished product didn't have near the fidelity as the original tracks from the Montana and Oregon.

We help out the KTM folks for their annual Adventure Rider rally by loading the loop tracks, and where necessary routes, into the rider's GPS. This year they had a local Steamboat Springs Adventure Rider run some really cool loops and send the GPX files to me to clean up and setup for the different classes of GPS. It worked out like this:

Class 1) Montana and Oregon type that handle tracks well and have lots of capacity (Montana can handle tracks with up to 10,000 points per track)- eleven loops with up to 450 points.

Class 2) 60CSx type that handle tracks well but have limited storage capacity - 22 loops, each of the above 11 split into two, out and back. The loops were split to get each part under 200 points and still have enough points so riders wouldn't run into problems where the trail split at a fork or intersection.

Class 3) Zumos including 660/665, split loops converted to routes, each with fewer than 200 points. BTW, adding maps to the Zumo is a major pain since you can only have one map loaded at a time. The Montana can handle up to 20 not exceeding 4000 map segments.

I wish I could attach a screenshot of the KTM loops for this year's rally but I don't have KTM's permission to do so. I'll edit this post after the rally to add the screenshot.

Bottom line IMHO if you ride mostly pavement with a little off-road, the Zumo 660/65 is OK but not great.
If you do serious adventure riding get a Montana.

Cheers,
-Shov
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Old 08-25-2013, 11:33 PM   #27
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Montana with 50 points per track? Not so

Quote:
Originally Posted by Albie View Post
The 660 can do 200 points in a route, so you have to build a really complex route to ever go over that limit. It really bugs me that Garmin does that shit like making the 350 only have a max of 30 or the Montana with a max of 50.
Sorry you have your numbers wrong.

The Zumo 350 is limited to 25 points (useless).

And... from the Montana wiki - "GPX files, 4000 total waypoints, 200 routes and 200 tracks (maximum 10,000 points per track)".
That's a few more than the 50 you claim.
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Old 08-26-2013, 06:04 AM   #28
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I am going to pipe up with an experience-based opinion that differs form the last couple of posts.

The Zumo 350 is a good Street Rider's GPS. It is neither "useless" nor "garbage" for the street rider. I have planned numerous complex street routes in BaseCamp, and followed them successfully on the 350. The 350 offers advanced detour functions, and the ability to search for, find, and insert into the current route, things like fuel or lodging, etc. More useful street navigation features that the Montana does not have can be found under the specifications tab here: https://buy.garmin.com/en-US/US/on-t...rod107979.html

What the 350 is NOT, is an offroad Adventure GPS, or a GPS for following tracks. It is not the tool for that.

The Montana is, hands down, the best Adventure GPS, and is IMO the best choice for those who require multiple map sets and need to see/follow tracks. I also have a Montana, and it does those things really well, however for the pure street rider, it is not quite as good as the Zumo 350. I run them side by side, so have seen firsthand how they differ.
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Old 08-26-2013, 07:09 AM   #29
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Zumo 350 vs.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Emoto View Post
The Zumo 350 is a good Street Rider's GPS. It is neither "useless" nor "garbage" for the street rider. I have planned numerous complex street routes in BaseCamp, and followed them successfully on the 350. The 350 offers advanced detour functions, and the ability to search for, find, and insert into the current route, things like fuel or lodging, etc. More useful street navigation features that the Montana does not have can be found under the specifications tab here: https://buy.garmin.com/en-US/US/on-t...rod107979.html

What the 350 is NOT, is an offroad Adventure GPS, or a GPS for following tracks. It is not the tool for that.

The Montana is, hands down, the best Adventure GPS, and is IMO the best choice for those who require multiple map sets and need to see/follow tracks. I also have a Montana, and it does those things really well, however for the pure street rider, it is not quite as good as the Zumo 350. I run them side by side, so have seen firsthand how they differ.
So the Zumo 350 is OK if you have two GPS, a $600 Montana and a $700 Zumo 350. We are both fortunate to have both the Montana the Zumo 350 but that's not an acceptable solution for the majority of Adventure riders.

I agree that the Zumo 350 is a good street rider's GPS, but so is my old Zumo 450. But for street, given the choice between a Zumo 660 and a Zumo 350 I'll take the 660 any day. Compare the specs. The 350 costs $50 more and trades off a few nice, but not necessary features for others. For example:

Traffic compatible: 660 yes, 350 only with automotive mount. Now that's handy for a motorcycle GPS
3-D buildings and landmarks view (froo-froo but you want to compare features): 660 yes, 350 no
Exit services: 660 no, 350 yes
Replaceable battery: 660 yes, 350 no
MP3 Player: 660 yes, 350 no
Audio Book Player: 660 yes, 350 no
Traffic Trends™: 660 no, 350 yes

A word about input power voltage. The Zumo 660 is a 12VDC device. It can be wired into the bike's power at any point and with some aftermarket stuff like our Baryl connector, allows the cradle to be quick detach.

The Zumo 350 is 5VDC (the regulator is in the power cable back by the battery). If the regulator dies you are screwed. Also, the cable carries more than twice the current of a 12VDC powered device for a given power consumption. The Zumo 350 draws about 2A at 5VDC.
We purchased our 350 to see what power options we might be able to offer and found that we could splice a standard USB Type A plug onto the power cable and plug it into a USB power port but it had to be a high power port (2.2A or more). While this worked and is how we run our 350 it's wasteful as we throw away the Garmin regulator.

As for the Zumo 350 being able to "search for, find, and insert into the current route, things like fuel or lodging, etc.", you can easily configure the Montana to do that. I have a fuel icon set up that allows me to locate and navigate to a fuel stop with ease. Which brings up another major advantage of the Montana, it is highly configurable.

So again, as you indicate the Zumo 350 is a good street GPS but IMHO the Zumo 660 is better. The Montana is more versatile than either and the best solution for dual sport or adventure riders.
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Old 08-26-2013, 08:43 AM   #30
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>So the Zumo 350 is OK if you have two GPS, a $600 Montana and a $700 Zumo 350.

Not what I said. My point was that I have operated them side by side, so I can see the relative strengths and weaknesses.


> We are both fortunate to have both the Montana the Zumo 350 but that's not an acceptable solution for the majority of Adventure riders.

You'll note that I pointed out that the Zumo 350 is NOT a good "Adventure" GPS. I think it is a fine street GPS.

> I agree that the Zumo 350 is a good street rider's GPS, but so is my old Zumo 450. But for street, given the choice between a Zumo 660 and a Zumo 350 I'll take the 660 any day.

Perhaps you would. What I took issue with were the terms "garbage" and "useless".


> Compare the specs. The 350 costs $50 more and trades off a few nice, but not necessary features for others. For example:

> Traffic compatible: 660 yes, 350 only with automotive mount. Now that's handy for a motorcycle GPS

Everyone I know with traffic says it is useless.

3-D buildings and landmarks view (froo-froo but you want to compare features): 660 yes, 350 no
Exit services: 660 no, 350 yes

This is handy for the road rider. It is not just exit services but offers the (user selected) ability to display a layer on the map showing various services like gas. Mean you can see what is around without running a search.

Replaceable battery: 660 yes, 350 no
MP3 Player: 660 yes, 350 no
Audio Book Player: 660 yes, 350 no
Traffic Trends™: 660 no, 350 yes

A word about input power voltage. The Zumo 660 is a 12VDC device. It can be wired into the bike's power at any point and with some aftermarket stuff like our Baryl connector, allows the cradle to be quick detach.

The Zumo 350 is 5VDC (the regulator is in the power cable back by the battery). If the regulator dies you are screwed. Also, the cable carries more than twice the current of a 12VDC powered device for a given power consumption. The Zumo 350 draws about 2A at 5VDC.
We purchased our 350 to see what power options we might be able to offer and found that we could splice a standard USB Type A plug onto the power cable and plug it into a USB power port but it had to be a high power port (2.2A or more). While this worked and is how we run our 350 it's wasteful as we throw away the Garmin regulator.

Does anyone really care?

> As for the Zumo 350 being able to "search for, find, and insert into the current route, things like fuel or lodging, etc.", you can easily configure the Montana to do that. I have a fuel icon set up that allows me to locate and navigate to a fuel stop with ease. Which brings up another major advantage of the Montana, it is highly configurable.

Actually, no, you cannot do this without first stopping navigating the existing route you are following. The 350 lets you keep your route going and find and add these things to it. Fewer keystrokes and dancing around and choosing which point in the route to start up again in on the Zumo.

So again, as you indicate the Zumo 350 is a good street GPS but IMHO the Zumo 660 is better. The Montana is more versatile than either and the best solution for dual sport or adventure riders.

I have not used the 660, so I won't argue with you whether it is better or not as a street GPS. I don't care about things like an MP3 player, etc.. However, the advanced detour feature on the 350 seems much better in terms of allowing the rider to choose how and how much to detour around. I have found that to be a very useful feature when navigating a saved route and encountering a bridge out or gated road, etc.

The Montana is unquestionably far more configurable, and that is one of the reasons I like it. If Garmin would add more of the street navigation features to it that the Zumos have, I would be able to call it almost perfect for all purposes.
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