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Old 06-08-2013, 10:13 PM   #556
_cy_ OP
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Originally Posted by plodalong View Post
I worked in a calibration centre for a few years calibrating electronic test equipment and aircraft tooling. In those years I can't recall failing a digital muiltimeter on dc ranges, ac calibration is a different story. Although I havn't checked it's calibration recently I doubt my is muiltimeter more than 10mv out.
thanks for dropping in ... accuracy nut here ... really like having NIST-Traceable Calibration standards in my lab. weight set used by State to calibrate scales. Wallace & Tiernan precision dial manometer, Snap-on electronic torque calibrator, pin & block calibration sets, etc, etc.

pretty safe to say most instruments that make into a calibration lab are fairly high grade. cost to calibrate exceeds value of typical $15 meter.

basic calibration checks can be done easily for free .. take a 3v primary lithium cell into any HVAC store that sells Fluke meters. measure 3v cell against new Fluke 87V or what ever store has available. primary lithium cells put out very stable voltage.

here I've set MC1000 muti function calibrator to output 3.258V DC


Fluke 189 measures 3.258v DC, confirming accuracy

_cy_ screwed with this post 06-09-2013 at 06:49 AM
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Old 06-08-2013, 11:35 PM   #557
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I used this clamp on muiltimeter to test out the starting current of the battery when I fitted it. Measured max current and minimum voltage at that time. 270 amps at 8.6 volts. Impressed the hell out of me.


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Old 06-09-2013, 01:22 AM   #558
_cy_ OP
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nice Kaise clamp meter! what was air temp?

modern fuel injected bikes cranking times are short compared to older carb models like test mule R80G/S. at 20f starter would pulling 250+ amp continuous with Shorai LFX36 supplying amps
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Old 06-09-2013, 01:42 AM   #559
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Can't remember exactly what the temp was, but not hot or cold so probably around 20c (70f)
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Old 06-09-2013, 06:33 AM   #560
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Can't remember exactly what the temp was, but not hot or cold so probably around 20c (70f)
reason why temperature was requested is LiFePo4 batteries perform quite differently at colder temps. at 14f loses 1/2 it's AH capacities. peak numbers while impressive are not as important as what LiFePO4 battery can deliver continuously under load.

all lithium batteries share trait of low internal resistance which results in high discharge rates disproportional to size of battery. leading to outrageous amp hour equivalent to lead acid capacity claims (PB/EQ).

All 12v LiFePO4 batteries uses four cells in series. if cylindrical 26650 A123 type batteries are used. capacity for each series are 2.3AH for old style or 2.5AH for new. then further series are added in parallel to increase AH capacities. LiFePO4 batteries using 8 cells = 4.6AH actual

here's a video done by Joel W who's one of the sharpest techs on ADV. illustrates how a Shorai LFX18 successfully performs multiple short duration cranks, while sustaining a brutal discharge load in between cranks. but Shorai LFX18 will not survive even a single 200amp continuous load test.

so if one is starting a modern bike in good tune at warm temps always taking off from a garage. AH capacities needed to support that bike are smaller than someone riding their adventure motorcycle in cold temps far from any support.

one of the most common reason resulting in LiFePO4 failures in our motorcycles is under sizing LiFePO4 batteries. resulting from not understanding importance of factoring in how and under what conditions that motorcycle will be used.


_cy_ screwed with this post 06-09-2013 at 06:59 AM
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Old 06-09-2013, 10:05 AM   #561
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So I'm no good at batteries and this thread is way over my head. I have a Yuasa YTX-16BS battery. It says STD on the top but after further reading and internet searching I'm now pretty confident that's it's an AGM batter. I've tried charging a couple time on the STD setting and the charge won't take. Now that I know that the setting should be AGM will it still work? Have I destroyed the battery since I used the wrong setting? Here is the top...

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Old 06-09-2013, 10:31 AM   #562
_cy_ OP
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So I'm no good at batteries and this thread is way over my head. I have a Yuasa YTX-16BS battery. It says STD on the top but after further reading and internet searching I'm now pretty confident that's it's an AGM batter. I've tried charging a couple time on the STD setting and the charge won't take. Now that I know that the setting should be AGM will it still work? Have I destroyed the battery since I used the wrong setting? Here is the top...
need more info ... what type charger .. how old is the battery? it might of died due to old age ... you've got exposed wires? did battery get drained dead? on what bike?

what's your charging system putting out at mid RPM measured at battery?
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Old 06-09-2013, 12:04 PM   #563
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need more info ... what type charger .. how old is the battery? it might of died due to old age ... you've got exposed wires? did battery get drained dead? on what bike?

what's your charging system putting out at mid RPM measured at battery?
brand new battery (less than 4 months old). brand new charger, Charge It 12V Auto Battery charger. I was using the 2 amp rate. Wires are exposed because I disconnected everything to try and find the problem. They don't sit like that when the bike is moving.
I was told I should see a minimum of 14.75 or better volts at 4500 RPM's
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Old 06-09-2013, 04:01 PM   #564
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brand new battery (less than 4 months old). brand new charger, Charge It 12V Auto Battery charger. I was using the 2 amp rate. Wires are exposed because I disconnected everything to try and find the problem. They don't sit like that when the bike is moving.
I was told I should see a minimum of 14.75 or better volts at 4500 RPM's
normal charging voltage is 13.8v to 14.2v at mid rpm .. not familiar with battery charger above. please provide a link. make sure you don't have parasitic drain ... that will kill battery in a hurry. PB batteries that get drained to dead may not come back. warranty that battery while it's still fairly new.

normally a 2 amp PB charger will not hurt an AGM if not left on for extended periods. don't exceed 14.8v when charging AGM.

charge battery out of bike to full .. then allow to rest overnight. AGM should be 12.8v range fully charged. if your bike cranks over with battery 12.8v resting voltage. your battery is fine.

go back a few pages ... there's a Yuasa 900 milliamp charger that's excellent for not much $$$
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Old 06-09-2013, 05:27 PM   #565
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Originally Posted by _cy_ View Post
normal charging voltage is 13.8v to 14.2v at mid rpm .. not familiar with battery charger above. please provide a link. make sure you don't have parasitic drain ... that will kill battery in a hurry. PB batteries that get drained to dead may not come back. warranty that battery while it's still fairly new.

normally a 2 amp PB charger will not hurt an AGM if not left on for extended periods. don't exceed 14.8v when charging AGM.

charge battery out of bike to full .. then allow to rest overnight. AGM should be 12.8v range fully charged. if your bike cranks over with battery 12.8v resting voltage. your battery is fine.

go back a few pages ... there's a Yuasa 900 milliamp charger that's excellent for not much $$$
here is the charger I'm using (i got it from napa).
http://cloreinfo.com/2011/02/charge-...tery-chargers/

i've got everything working fine with a walmart battery for now. i should be able to get to a dealer on friday. thanks for your help.
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Old 06-09-2013, 06:14 PM   #566
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Originally Posted by fbj913 View Post
here is the charger I'm using (i got it from napa).
http://cloreinfo.com/2011/02/charge-...tery-chargers/

i've got everything working fine with a walmart battery for now. i should be able to get to a dealer on friday. thanks for your help.
"YTX16-BS Motocross 12v 230 CCA AGM Power Sport & Motorcycle Battery"

your Yuasa battery is an AGM and charger in link spec's AGM. so being the wrong combo is not your problem.

sure hope your charging system is still putting out ... unlikely but it's certainly possible for a new battery to fail.

let us know what dealer comes up with ...
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Old 06-29-2013, 12:36 AM   #567
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After my YTX died of inactivity I replaced it with an earthx ETX24C. The bike starts easier with the new battery but the bike has developed a fault and I am not sure what caused it. Ever since the upgrade my 2008 1200GSA with under 10000 kilometers on the dial is giving me the non flashing ABS red light. The start up check finishes normaly but after a minute or two in the ride the red light comes on and stays. No other warning light. Any ideas of if the new battery has caused my ABS system to fail?
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Old 06-29-2013, 05:28 AM   #568
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After my YTX died of inactivity I replaced it with an earthx ETX24C. The bike starts easier with the new battery but the bike has developed a fault and I am not sure what caused it. Ever since the upgrade my 2008 1200GSA with under 10000 kilometers on the dial is giving me the non flashing ABS red light. The start up check finishes normaly but after a minute or two in the ride the red light comes on and stays. No other warning light. Any ideas of if the new battery has caused my ABS system to fail?
unlikely any LiFePO4 battery is causing problems with your ABS. normal charging voltages for all systems that support PB is 13.8v to 14.2v.

normal range LiFePO4 batteries operate at about 13.8v to 12.85v (20%) range with some 90% of effective power happening at 13.3v to 12.85v (20%) or a very flat discharge curve.

it's not uncommon for a 2008 1200GSA to experience ABS failure even with very low miles.


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Old 06-29-2013, 06:59 AM   #569
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BMW, nor any other motorcycle manufacturer, recommends putting a lithium battery in their bikes. ABS is only one of the many reasons stated. But why would you want to listen to BMW, they only made the bike. Not a good idea to do whatever you want and then try to figure out why your bike is screwed up later... Unless you have an Internet forum :-)
Maybe you can return the battery ?
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Old 06-29-2013, 07:07 AM   #570
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BMW, nor any other motorcycle manufacturer, recommends putting a lithium battery in their bikes. ABS is only one of the many reasons stated. But why would you want to listen to BMW, they only made the bike. Not a good idea to do whatever you want and then try to figure out why your bike is screwed up later... Unless you have an Internet forum :-)
Maybe you can return the battery ?
currently no motorcycle mfg has outfitted their bikes with LiFePO4 battery as stock equipment. predictions are that's going to change and probably in the near future.

Porsche currently offers a LiFePO4 battery as OEM equipment ... costs is $1,200+

ALL charging systems that support lead acid batteries has to operate within a set parameter. Modern electronics are designed to operate within those constraints.

LiFePo4 battery voltages neatly fall within those parameters. one of the main barriers to LiFePO4 adoption is costs ... installing a properly sized LiFePO4 with enough amp hour capacity to operate at lower temps costs $$$$...

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