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Old 06-13-2013, 03:31 PM   #976
fifthcircle
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Flower Beer?

Anyone brewed with any of these?

Chamomile, Elderflower, Hibiscus or Heather Tips.

There is a local homebrew contest I may enter with these choices as a requirement. At a glance, I was thinking Elderflower. Hops to use is Willamette, and a mostly set grain bill (MO & Honey malts). 3oz of both hops and flowers is all I get, and that's why I was not going to do Heather. I think Heather could be used for the entire process instead of hops, but wouldn't I need more than 3oz?
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Old 06-13-2013, 07:30 PM   #977
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fifthcircle View Post
Anyone brewed with any of these?

Chamomile, Elderflower, Hibiscus or Heather Tips.

There is a local homebrew contest I may enter with these choices as a requirement. At a glance, I was thinking Elderflower. Hops to use is Willamette, and a mostly set grain bill (MO & Honey malts). 3oz of both hops and flowers is all I get, and that's why I was not going to do Heather. I think Heather could be used for the entire process instead of hops, but wouldn't I need more than 3oz?
I did not brew it but another fellow in my local home brew club brewed a saison with hibiscus. I am not normally a huge saison fan but the beer was pretty spectacular. Imagine the floral aromas you can get from some hops only lighter and much more delicate. You also got a flavor that was floral but not medicinal or vegital. Really balance well with the saison yeast and grain bill.
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Old 06-13-2013, 08:30 PM   #978
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Originally Posted by Skibikejunkie View Post
Also, I agree with you on a Bud after mowing the grass. It was really hot on Sunday when I got done brewing. I had a fridge full of homebrew as well as some IPAs my wife brought back from San Diego. I popped open a PBR. As for the snob thing, it's one thing not to drink Bud because you don't like it. I get that. I don't like Miller. It's another to not drink Bud because it's Bud. That's where I distinguish snob from nerd. Nerds know what they like and are passionate about it.
Interesting discussion on nerds vs snobs, hops, and such.

I haven't brewed in a while, but i developed a pretty good sense of taste for beer. What I mean by that is I can pick individual flavors, and tell you exactly what I like or don't like about a beer. I can't do it at all for wines. I've been to wine tasting/education events, and I can still only tast a few different things (sweet/dry, jammy/thin, etc).

On occasion, I'll drink a mega brew, but I really don't like AB products (Bud, Michelob,etc) I get a headache pretty fast from them (and Sierra Nevada as well).

I'll drink Miller if I have a mega brew.

Getting to my point now... AB only makes their own beers (Bud, Bud Light, Natty Light...). Coors only makes their own beers (Coors, Keystone...) but Miller will make any beer and put a label on it. MGD, Highlife, Lite, etc but also PBR, Hamms, Oly, Rainer, Colt 45, Micky's, Carlings Black Label, Henry Wienhart, Old Milwaukee, Schlitz, Country Club... If I had enough money, and wanted to, they would make, bottle and distribute OaklandStrom beer for me.

I don't know how the SAB/Coors merger has changed all this.

They use the same yeast and many of the same ingredients in their beers (in fact, many of those beers are simply different labels on the cans), So any of those beers taste better to me than any AB product. When I hear somebody say that they like Miller, but not Hamms, it makes me wonder - they share a lot of the same ingredients.
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Old 06-13-2013, 09:05 PM   #979
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Originally Posted by Jason F. View Post
I did not brew it but another fellow in my local home brew club brewed a saison with hibiscus. I am not normally a huge saison fan but the beer was pretty spectacular. Imagine the floral aromas you can get from some hops only lighter and much more delicate. You also got a flavor that was floral but not medicinal or vegital. Really balance well with the saison yeast and grain bill.
Any chance you can get a recipe? I would just like to see what he did with the flowers, mainly. End of boil, dry hop (flower?), or steep and add to 2ndary.

Cheers,
5th

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Old 06-14-2013, 09:57 AM   #980
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fifthcircle View Post
Anyone brewed with any of these?

Chamomile, Elderflower, Hibiscus or Heather Tips.

There is a local homebrew contest I may enter with these choices as a requirement. At a glance, I was thinking Elderflower. Hops to use is Willamette, and a mostly set grain bill (MO & Honey malts). 3oz of both hops and flowers is all I get, and that's why I was not going to do Heather. I think Heather could be used for the entire process instead of hops, but wouldn't I need more than 3oz?
I've never brewed with herbs, but I think elderflower is a good choice. There's an elderflower liqueur that my wife likes to use in cocktails. It's delicious and adds a delicate but perceptible flavor to the drink. Seems like elderflower would carry over well to beer, especially with Willamette and honey malt.

What yeast are you going to use? I think yeast choice and fermentation is where this contest is going to be won or lost.
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Old 06-14-2013, 11:11 AM   #981
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Two choices for yeast:
WLP001 CA Ale Yeast (or any Chico variant), OR WYeast 3726 Farmhouse Ale.

Never used 3726... might go with that one.

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Old 06-14-2013, 05:03 PM   #982
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Originally Posted by fifthcircle View Post
Two choices for yeast:
WLP001 CA Ale Yeast (or any Chico variant), OR WYeast 3726 Farmhouse Ale.

Never used 3726... might go with that one.

Sent from my fat thumbs on a small touch screen.
3726 should be a good strain. I've used 3724 before, took forever to finish (7 weeks and lots of heat) but I hear 3726 has similar flavor profiles without the long wait.
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Old 06-14-2013, 05:47 PM   #983
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3726 should be a good strain. I've used 3724 before, took forever to finish (7 weeks and lots of heat) but I hear 3726 has similar flavor profiles without the long wait.
I made it in the lottery, so now I actually do have to brew this!

They just changes the yeast....3726 is seasonal, and homebrewers can't get it right now. The brewery uses it, but they don't have it in homebrew pitching sizes.

SO, I can use "any French/Belgian saison yeast, appropriate for lower gravities, that doesn't contain lacto or brett."

I was looking at 3724. It's really warm here at the moment, so I could have it in the garage, in water to mellow the temp swings, and it would be in the 80's. Not really wanting to bother with rigging up heating for this... I may just go with 3711, since Wyeast says it ferments in the 70's well. Perfect for me.

Gotta choose a flower....
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Old 06-14-2013, 06:58 PM   #984
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fifthcircle View Post
I made it in the lottery, so now I actually do have to brew this!

They just changes the yeast....3726 is seasonal, and homebrewers can't get it right now. The brewery uses it, but they don't have it in homebrew pitching sizes.

SO, I can use "any French/Belgian saison yeast, appropriate for lower gravities, that doesn't contain lacto or brett."

I was looking at 3724. It's really warm here at the moment, so I could have it in the garage, in water to mellow the temp swings, and it would be in the 80's. Not really wanting to bother with rigging up heating for this... I may just go with 3711, since Wyeast says it ferments in the 70's well. Perfect for me.

Gotta choose a flower....
Do the 3711, if you do the 3724 there's a really good chance you'll have to pitch 3711 to get it to finish anyway . You could try Safbrew T-58, I hear that does good in Belgians. WLP670 is the White Labs Farmhouse, WLP565 is their Saison.
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Old 06-14-2013, 07:20 PM   #985
Jason F.
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Originally Posted by fifthcircle View Post
Any chance you can get a recipe? I would just like to see what he did with the flowers, mainly. End of boil, dry hop (flower?), or steep and add to 2ndary.

Cheers,
5th

Sent from my fat thumbs on a small touch screen.
I sent him a message yesterday but have not heard back from him yet.
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Old 06-16-2013, 07:53 PM   #986
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Originally Posted by fifthcircle View Post
Any chance you can get a recipe? I would just like to see what he did with the flowers, mainly. End of boil, dry hop (flower?), or steep and add to 2ndary.

Cheers,
5th

Sent from my fat thumbs on a small touch screen.
From my friend.

The grain/hop bill was borrowed from the mad fermentationists "hoppy french saison." I substituted wlp566 for the wyeast3711 used in that recipe. I used a dried hibiscus that is sold as a tea by Rishi. I eyeballed a decent amount into a coffee filter and poured vodka over it to briefly sanitize before dumping it straight into primary, before adding all the wort to ferment. so the hibiscus was in there for the entire duration of fermentation, but was never added during the boil. hope that is helpful!
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Old 06-16-2013, 08:02 PM   #987
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That's great info. Thanks!!!

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Old 06-16-2013, 11:27 PM   #988
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Originally Posted by Skibikejunkie View Post
Sounds like your yeast isn't finished before you put it in the bottle, so in addition to the priming sugar, it's also consuming some of the residual sugar that should have fermented out in primary. How long are you letting it sit in primary before bottling? Are you hitting your target final gravity? Do you control temperatures? I ferment in a temp-controlled chest freezer, so I always raise the temperature at the end of primary to make sure the yeast has completely finished its job before kegging.

I tend to go one week in primary, and one week in secondary, racked into a glass carboy. Final gravity is on or close to target, and the beer always sits in the back room of my basement (not on the floor, and generally in the dark unless I have to add salt to the water softener). That room year-round stays at almost exactly 65 degrees.
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Old 06-16-2013, 11:37 PM   #989
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Originally Posted by OaklandStrom View Post
Interesting discussion on nerds vs snobs, hops, and such.

I haven't brewed in a while, but i developed a pretty good sense of taste for beer. What I mean by that is I can pick individual flavors, and tell you exactly what I like or don't like about a beer. I can't do it at all for wines. I've been to wine tasting/education events, and I can still only tast a few different things (sweet/dry, jammy/thin, etc).

On occasion, I'll drink a mega brew, but I really don't like AB products (Bud, Michelob,etc) I get a headache pretty fast from them (and Sierra Nevada as well).

I'll drink Miller if I have a mega brew.

Getting to my point now... AB only makes their own beers (Bud, Bud Light, Natty Light...). Coors only makes their own beers (Coors, Keystone...) but Miller will make any beer and put a label on it. MGD, Highlife, Lite, etc but also PBR, Hamms, Oly, Rainer, Colt 45, Micky's, Carlings Black Label, Henry Wienhart, Old Milwaukee, Schlitz, Country Club... If I had enough money, and wanted to, they would make, bottle and distribute OaklandStrom beer for me.

I don't know how the SAB/Coors merger has changed all this.

They use the same yeast and many of the same ingredients in their beers (in fact, many of those beers are simply different labels on the cans), So any of those beers taste better to me than any AB product. When I hear somebody say that they like Miller, but not Hamms, it makes me wonder - they share a lot of the same ingredients.
Well, it's contract brewing, and yeah, Miller does a lot of that. So do a lot of smaller regional breweries like City Brewing in LaCrosse, WI (the old Heileman brewery). Most of the contract beers are labels owned by Pabst. Pabst owns pretty much every old cheap-ass label that your grandfather probably drank, but they don't actually own any breweries anymore.

I'd agree that some are obviously the same. PBR Light (which isn't very common, but I can get it in Wisconsin) I'm about 99% positive is the same as Special Export Light, but PBR and Special Export are not the same. (I used to love Special Export, but when when it stopped being brewed out of LaCrosse exclusively, it got pretty bad.) Hamms is about as awful a beer as exists today. It used to be a pretty common macro around here (Minnesota) because it originated in St. Paul, but now it's more or less undrinkable crap (and I'll drink most anything.)

And I agree that Sierra Nevada also gives me a headache. I drank a TON of the stuff because I use that type of bottle (short neck, no embossing) for bottling, but now I've gone to Boulevard if I need more bottles. No sense in buying empty bottles if I can get them with beer in them and re-use!
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Old 06-17-2013, 01:32 AM   #990
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I tend to go one week in primary, and one week in secondary, racked into a glass carboy. Final gravity is on or close to target, and the beer always sits in the back room of my basement (not on the floor, and generally in the dark unless I have to add salt to the water softener). That room year-round stays at almost exactly 65 degrees.
Is every bottle consistently foamy if it sits, or is it an intermittent thing?
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