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Old 08-05-2013, 03:15 AM   #31
Night Falcon
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The Last Post - no really

The peculiar thing about falling off when riding with a group is you feel like a bit of a heal no matter the circumstances. Ironically this feeling of self loathing is made worse when you've hit the deck hard and find yourself in some degree of pain - you know the sort of pain which makes it hard to hide the fact you've had a good whacking - the shame of it

Now I'm no psychologist, but I reckon some of the reason is we'd rather help out others than have to be helped out ourselves - I'm guessing the more you view yourself as a hard-core real bloke the worse this feeling would be and more you would try and conceal it Naturally I was crying like a girly girl.

So after biting the dust and lying on the road with a large bruise in my ego and even larger bruising to various parts of my anatomy, thinking, well at least nobodies around to see me...I hear the distant sound of a KLR closing in on the scene of devastation. Frantically trying to at least get to my feet, maybe even right my bike so no one would be the wiser, I look over to my fallen stead and imagine it saying "well that's another fine mess you've got us into" and realise my left leg wont respond to the very clear signals from my somewhat confused brain instructing it to stand.

Seconds later that unmistakeable sound of stones being tossed in blender gets louder and louder as Mark arrives on the KLR. Drat! I've been discovered; perhaps if I lie still he wont notice me- "don't worry the KTM looks fine" he shouts reassuringly....

If you've read this far your probably thinking "Night Falcon must have got a good head knock as well" but there is a point to this waffle....If I hadn't fallen off this thread might never have happened, possibly or possibly not? You see there was a reasonable chance that at least 1 of the last four riders which included our esteemed organisers, Rosie and Clint, DR Girl and of course Mark S, might also have succumbed to the icy land mine...in which case I would have felt like a real rotter if I'd left the scene for the only real excuse of saving my ego from further denting. Personalising it makes all the difference to this discussion for me.

So In that regard I'm glad this thread - lame flames and all - was posted. I don't imagine anyone will change their views because of it but maybe some might think next time "maybe I'll hang around for a bit an see the next rider (probably a mate) doesn't suffer the same fate as me or even worse.

As you were.
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Night Falcon screwed with this post 08-05-2013 at 03:22 AM
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Old 08-05-2013, 01:27 PM   #32
Crisis management
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Marty,
thanks for the post, it certainly adds a different perspective to what originally seemd like a bit of a girly whinge (apologies to Rosie & others) and I quite understand the rationale for raising the issue now.

The problem with this is deciding what constitutes normal riding conditions and what constitutes an unusual danger and I have no idea how you resolve this.
A few examples from the MMMM: that morning I had helped up a rider who lost the front on a corner, simply a bit of bad luck, inattention or a sandy patch on the road. I gave absolutely no thought to warning others of this and even if he had landed badly and broken a collar bone I would not have seen this as anything other than a bit of bad luck.
Another rider I was travelling with hit a log with his foot, definately sprained something badly (couldn't weight bare) and possibly broke some bones. I know he didn't stop to warn everyone of the possible danger.
Later in the day I stopped for a couple of riders that had taken to investigating the local ditch, again there was no though of warning others.

I still maintain that the nature of adventure riding carries some risk and it is up to the individual to manage that risk and that also includes deciding for themselves what constitutes an unusual danger.

Hope you heal well and get back on the 690 soon.

Iain
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Old 08-05-2013, 05:45 PM   #33
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Eek

Guys I am a late arriver to this thread but here is my 2 cents worth.

Mark, with the hindsight ( always 20/20 ) of knowing that 4 people fell off on this corner then perhaps some of us should have warned others.

I was the second rider to arrive at Lake Waikarimoana and had come accross the fallen DR rider as I slid into this corner.

I did stop to see if the rider was ok and then carried on. At that stage i did not consider stopping to warn others of the ice on that corner as i had already come accross ice on other corners as well and at that time as far as i was aware only one rider had come to grief there.

We were warned to expect Ice / Rain / Snow or all of the above and it was -5 degrees at the Rangataiki tavern when we left that morning so this was not an un-reasonable assumption to me.

On other rides when i have come accross something that i considered really dangerous ( like stock on the road or slips ) i have stopped and warned other riders.

I guess on a mid winter MADNESS ride i did not consider ice as out of the ordinary and had no way of knowing that, that particular corner could or would claim four of our fellow mates.

With this hindsight now i would have stopped and warned others, even though i am all about personal responsibility.
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Old 08-06-2013, 03:02 AM   #34
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Old 08-06-2013, 03:43 AM   #35
Mark_S
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oscar View Post
It's not a matter of relying on others to keep you safe, it's a matter of taking responsibility for others to keep them safe.
Feck - you say in one sentence what I couldn't quite communicate in 3 or 4 posts.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Night Falcon View Post
Seconds later that unmistakeable sound of stones being tossed in blender gets louder and louder as Mark arrives on the KLR.
Next time I will use you for traction and leave your rotting corpse for the crows

Quote:
Originally Posted by Crisis management View Post
The problem with this is deciding what constitutes normal riding conditions and what constitutes an unusual danger and I have no idea how you resolve this.
Agreed - the answer will be different to a certain degree for everyone - as long as we are assessing those potential hazards for their impact on following riders and not just ourselves.

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Originally Posted by MOTOXNUT View Post
With this hindsight now i would have stopped and warned others, even though i am all about personal responsibility.
Thats the tricky part isn’t it. We were confronted by one rider down and lots of evidence that several others had been down - it was easy for us to see it was a bit of a problem corner. Not so easy when just one bike is down - was it an isolated incident? (particularly since that rider was probably honking along given he was ahead of you) or a problem area?

Still - at some point as more and more scrape marks accumulated on the road you would hope someone would notice and stop and do the "here be danger" thing

cheers

Mark
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Mark_S screwed with this post 08-06-2013 at 04:05 AM
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Old 08-06-2013, 11:50 PM   #36
Night Falcon
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Crisis management View Post
...hope you heal well and get back on the 690 soon.

Iain
thanks Ian. Limping less an less every day

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark_S View Post

Next time I will use you for traction and leave your rotting corpse for the crows
more likely magpies in that neck of the woods, but happy to help with your traction issues
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