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Old 09-02-2013, 05:02 AM   #121
vfr700
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SCQTT View Post
One of the many reasons I do not dig cops.

The professional courtesy thing is a little out of control.

Your job, your choice.

I wonder if a dentist gets free tits for his wife at the plastic surgeon?
Discretion, you don't have to be a cop to receive some. I'm not sure what a little out of control means exactly, write a ticket, don't write one, that's their discretion. If you don't think professional courtesy is extended in most industries, you're wrong. In reference to your not digging cops, I hope you apply that emotion consistently, when you're a victim of a crime, get in a wreck, need to serve an order of protection, etc, and don't call for their help.
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Old 09-02-2013, 05:41 AM   #122
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Originally Posted by vfr700 View Post
Discretion, you don't have to be a cop to receive some. I'm not sure what a little out of control means exactly, write a ticket, don't write one, that's their discretion. If you don't think professional courtesy is extended in most industries, you're wrong. In reference to your not digging cops, I hope you apply that emotion consistently, when you're a victim of a crime, get in a wreck, need to serve an order of protection, etc, and don't call for their help.
If I'm in a wreck, I call the police. That's the law. If I'm the victim of the crime, I generally only call the police if it's likely that the situation will escalate, so that, if the time comes that I need to deal with an issue myself, such as needing to act in self defense, it will be on record that I've had issues. The intent in calling them is only so that I don't have problems with them in the future. When I've called them in the past, they have a habit of being wholly unhelpful, and have a tendency to treat crime victims like criminals.
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Old 09-03-2013, 11:20 AM   #123
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Originally Posted by vfr700 View Post
Discretion, you don't have to be a cop to receive some. I'm not sure what a little out of control means exactly, write a ticket, don't write one, that's their discretion. If you don't think professional courtesy is extended in most industries, you're wrong. In reference to your not digging cops, I hope you apply that emotion consistently, when you're a victim of a crime, get in a wreck, need to serve an order of protection, etc, and don't call for their help.
Do you really believe that if someone is not a bona fide votary of the law enforcement profession that he has no right to their duty bound protection? How can you make such an tremendous logical leap? I certainly hope you are not indeed a law enforcement officer.

While, I assume that SCQTT is a citizen and pays his taxes (irrelevant really), I am certain that he is a person and as such deserves equal protection under the law. Cop worship is not a requirement. As for professional courtesy, you are right that it is traditionally extended to a degree in most industries. OTH, seldom does that courtesy include permission to break the law. While, I may agree that law officers should get a little leniency on the most minor of traffic infractions (mostly due to the impact minor infractions can have their careers), the cavalier attitude that "I simply badge em and am on my way" is a "little out of control," IMHO. And this is not even the tip of the iceberg, DUI and domestic violence leniency and/or coverup is reportedly common in addition to other things.
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Old 09-04-2013, 06:22 AM   #124
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Originally Posted by glasswave View Post
While, I may agree that law officers should get a little leniency on the most minor of traffic infractions (mostly due to the impact minor infractions can have their careers), the cavalier attitude that "I simply badge em and am on my way" is a "little out of control," IMHO. And this is not even the tip of the iceberg, DUI and domestic violence leniency and/or coverup is reportedly common in addition to other things.
I'm a professional, Class A driver. Any minor infraction can have massive consequences for me, much more sever than most of the cops out there. In spite of this, there are whole sections of various police departments who's job it is to pay specific attention to people like me.

I think the police should have less leniency given to them. If you would enforce the law, then you must live by it. I'm of the opinion that any breaking of the law by police officers should have significantly more severe punishments, not less.
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Old 09-04-2013, 07:03 AM   #125
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the previous two post say it all. exactly right.
in mn. we recently had a state trooper get a DUI, while on duty! while at a training seminar and it got pleaded down to reckless. that's bullshit. the penalty for anyone in the public trust should be double.
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Old 09-04-2013, 07:50 AM   #126
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the penalty for anyone in the public trust should be double.
I'm not sure how that's defensible. They volunteer to work a physically demanding job where everyone they meet lies to them on a daily basis, they risk being shot at, etc. etc., so they should be held and punished to a higher standard? Call me crazy, but I'm ok with there being a few perks for being a public safety officer, as long as they're not abused.

But that's hardly the point of this thread. This was on, how to avoid a ticket should you meet a LEO in the performance of their duty. Being polite, admitting fault up front, keeping your hands in plain view, keeping your bike and yourself legal, and generally assuming he/she is a human being who merits a level of respect and decency - that's really pretty simple, and doesn't cost a damn thing. And in my experience (talking to off-duty cops, getting off with a warning after being pulled over a few times on my bike going 30+mph) it goes a long way. Most cops will tell you they cut motorcycles some slack. We're the underdog out there, we don't go running people off the road or killing other drivers, and they recognize we sometimes just gotta punch it. Why would we as motorcyclists not do the same for them, seems like a great deal for both sides. Basically, if you're one of those people who likes to mouth off to cops, quit pissing in the pool. You're fucking it up for the rest of us.
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Old 09-04-2013, 09:29 AM   #127
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Cops are people, they come in all sizes and attitudes, just like motorcycle riders that post on the Internet.

Having a good attitude towards them may not keep you from a ticket but it will increase the chances. Things that increase the chance of a ticket are the cops assignment. In Cal. the CHP primary duty is traffic enforcement. Some cities have Cops that are assigned to traffic. That's their job.

The nature of the violation makes a difference. Here everyone speeds. If you are making unsafe passes or weaving in and out of traffic, you will probably get a ticket.

Most people who start the conversation about how they know their rights, probably are going to be argumentative and don't know anything. Yes they may be able to search your bike: http://supreme.justia.com/cases/fede.../132/case.html, so don't carry your dope in the same place as your registration and yes you will probably get a ticket.

Clam up if you want, but the cop is going to take that as an attitude problem. They already have enough to give you a ticket, so your admission of guilt is immaterial. Its a ticket and you aren't Perry Mason.

On a speeding ticket, the universal first question is, "do you know how fast you were going" A loaded question, seeking an admission of guilt. I like the non committal answer of "fast enough to get your attention" with a smile.

I have been stopped twice on the bike. I looked for a wide spot, pull over, turn off the bike, kickstand down, remove my helmet so he can see my bald head, remove my gloves, keep my hands where he can see them and wait for further instructions.

I figure he wants me to do something else, he can tell me.
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Old 09-04-2013, 09:40 AM   #128
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Originally Posted by stucknarut View Post
I'm not sure how that's defensible.
its just as defensible as capitol penalties are if you murder a LEO
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Old 09-04-2013, 11:25 AM   #129
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Originally Posted by Derbobs View Post
When reading stories like that, where normal people behave like prisoners of war just because they talk to police, i am very happy to live in europe.
Don't worry, I don't do that shit. Helmet off, smile, and a "how are you today sir?" has always worked for me.
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Old 09-04-2013, 11:33 AM   #130
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Two things to remember:

1. The cop is not the final say so in a legal issue.....go see the judge, they have the final say.

2. Don't mess with anyone carrying a gun!!!!
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Old 09-04-2013, 11:53 AM   #131
farmerstu
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Originally Posted by stucknarut View Post
I'm not sure how that's defensible. They volunteer to work a physically demanding job where everyone they meet lies to them on a daily basis, they risk being shot at, etc. etc., so they should be held and punished to a higher standard? Call me crazy, but I'm ok with there being a few perks for being a public safety officer, as long as they're not abused.

But that's hardly the point of this thread. This was on, how to avoid a ticket should you meet a LEO in the performance of their duty. Being polite, admitting fault up front, keeping your hands in plain view, keeping your bike and yourself legal, and generally assuming he/she is a human being who merits a level of respect and decency - that's really pretty simple, and doesn't cost a damn thing. And in my experience (talking to off-duty cops, getting off with a warning after being pulled over a few times on my bike going 30+mph) it goes a long way. Most cops will tell you they cut motorcycles some slack. We're the underdog out there, we don't go running people off the road or killing other drivers, and they recognize we sometimes just gotta punch it. Why would we as motorcyclists not do the same for them, seems like a great deal for both sides. Basically, if you're one of those people who likes to mouth off to cops, quit pissing in the pool. You're fucking it up for the rest of us.
I'm defintaly not saying cops are bad. like anyone else they come in all types. but there is a lot wrong with what you post says.
1. they volunteer. that's right no one forces them to do the job.
2.lying to a leo is a crime. a leo lying to you is legal.
3.physically demanding? is that why almost every cop i see is overweight? many grossly so.
4. I will absolutely agree it's a tough job. but a lot of jobs are tough,both mentally and physically, dealing with drunks and domestics is no fun. however it isn't as dangerous as they would have you believe.
" It isn’t among the top ten most dangerous professions, falling well behind logging, fishing, driving a cab, trash collecting, farming, and truck driving. Moreover, about half of police killed on the job are killed in traffic accidents, and most of those are not while in pursuit of a criminal or rushing to the scene of a crime."
I stand by my statement that if you chose to be a cop,or a judge or otherwise chose to serve the public trust you should be held to a higher standard.
p.s. flashing a badge to get out of a ticket should be grounds for automatic dismissal . the thin blue line attitude is my # problem with leo.
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Old 09-04-2013, 11:55 AM   #132
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Originally Posted by vfr700 View Post
To break the ice on initial contact try this, it always works for me:
"You only stopped me because I'm black" It takes a couple seconds for the slack jaw mouth breathing to stop, then they usually start laughing. At this point I badge them, and I'm on my way.
If you really are a cop...you've been lucky. Two of my co-workers have received speeding tickets....both were 12-15 over the limit when stopped.

Your badge isn't a get out of jail free card. One of these days maybe you'll have a change of view...more than likely when you sign for that ticket.
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Old 09-04-2013, 12:01 PM   #133
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Police come in many flavors, from the state police that even other cops don't like to homicide detectives who everyone loves. Just sayin'
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Old 09-04-2013, 03:05 PM   #134
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Originally Posted by Badge320 View Post
If you really are a cop...you've been lucky. Two of my co-workers have received speeding tickets....both were 12-15 over the limit when stopped.

Your badge isn't a get out of jail free card. One of these days maybe you'll have a change of view...more than likely when you sign for that ticket.
thanks, a p.o.v. i really respect.
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Old 09-04-2013, 04:20 PM   #135
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On a speeding ticket, the universal first question is, "do you know how fast you were going"
So...are these bad answers?
"So you don't know either?"
"If you don't know, why did you stop me?"


I agree about those who's job is it to enforce a law should be held to the highest standard when they violate the law.

A couple of years ago I was at a meeting where the local chief of police passed around a national flier about police officers killed in the line of duty that year. About half were terrible--officers killed because they were officers (and those who were seriously and permanently injured should have been included). And about half were bullshit. A cop who dies in an ordinary commuter wreck on the way to the station is tragic for the family, but nothing like being killed because of what they do. Ditto for the badged fool who shot himself at the pistol range. That is about equal to a roofer falling off a roof. Tragic for the family, but not something the rest of us should feel bad about. Or the two boneheaded motor cops who rode side by side and crashed each other--one died because he was boneheaded, not because he was an officer.
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