ADVrider

Go Back   ADVrider > Riding > The perfect line and other riding myths
User Name
Password
Register Inmates Photos Site Rules Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 10-19-2013, 12:47 AM   #91
Katoom72
Studly Adventurer
 
Katoom72's Avatar
 
Joined: Jun 2012
Location: Belgium
Oddometer: 830
I dont get it...jumping triples is safer then ride around town?
__________________
Now:
'03 KTM 250sx -- '05 KTM Adventure 950
Before:
'00 KTM 250sx -- '03 KTM 450sx -- '03 Yamaha R6 -- '08 KTM SuperDuke R --- '13 KTM 690 enduro R
Katoom72 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-19-2013, 06:46 AM   #92
Earth Rider
Beastly Adventurer
 
Joined: Sep 2013
Oddometer: 1,863
I didn't know you needed to jump triples to ride dirt.
Earth Rider is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-19-2013, 08:30 AM   #93
joexr
Beastly Adventurer
 
Joined: Jan 2011
Location: S.E.
Oddometer: 3,773
Cool2

Quote:
Originally Posted by Earth Rider View Post
I didn't know you needed to jump triples to ride dirt.
You don't , but you should try it.
joexr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-19-2013, 09:51 AM   #94
mtnbikeboy
Gnarly Adventurer
 
Joined: Jan 2011
Location: Longview, TX
Oddometer: 111
I did not grow up riding and have been riding street for 3 years (I am 34). I have ridden mountain bikes since high school without injury (only rec riding).

I went through 3 cars in HS. Only 1 accident was multivehicle. Had I had a motorcycle then, I probably would have seriously injured myself. My parents didn't push me one way or the other.

When I have kids of my own, I want to take them riding with me, and have dirt bikes if they're interested.

To those who wonder at why street seems to be a bigger deal, here is my .02.
While riding off road and specifically recreational trail riding, almost all injuries will be a result of your own poor decisions or skill. On the street, no matter how good of a rider you are, there's always the chance of someone else's poor decision giving you a bad day. I feel everyone's been talking around this point without stating it directly. If the kids have been racing, then they also know to watch for others' mistakes and may have greater situational awareness.
mtnbikeboy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-19-2013, 11:55 AM   #95
Wraith Rider
Beastly Adventurer
 
Wraith Rider's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2012
Location: Germany
Oddometer: 1,118
@mtnbikeboy
When I was younger, I had two relevant motorcycle crashes (and countless harmless on streets and field paths) and two car crashes.

One car crash was completely my fault (single vehicle) because I didn't gave attention to what I was doing, one car crash (single vehicle again) I wasn't able to handle the car on winterly streets and if it was a bit less fortunate timing it would have been a frontal crash with another car that very likely could have killed at least me (no seat belt).
One bike crash was on snow covered streets, the other was because I was too young and tried to overtake where I shouldn't.

So it wasn't someone else's poor decisions that bit me. And my worst injury was a twisted ankle - something that could as well have happened in the dirt.

What I want to say: I wasn't hell of a good rider nor did I have much luck getting away with that lack of skill and still I not only survived but wasn't noteworthy hurt. Only difference if I had been dirt riding would have been that I would have gone down more often and most likely would have had more twisted ankles.
__________________
"Why not stay in disguise all the time? You know, look like everyone else."
"Because we shouldn't have to."
Wraith Rider is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-19-2013, 07:25 PM   #96
Kommando
Grumpy Young Man
 
Kommando's Avatar
 
Joined: Nov 2006
Location: Spacecoaster FL
Oddometer: 6,720
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wraith Rider View Post
There's reason to be concerned about going out of the door at all. But street riding is not that scarry. Only the needed skills differ slightly from the dirt riding skills. Navigating traffic instead of terrain for example.
Trees, rocks, cliffs, etc. don't generally swerve into one's path, whether accidentally, distractedly, or purposely. Trees, dirt, sand, and many other offroad obstacles also have a bit more give to them than vehicles, curbs, buildings, walls, dividers, guard-rails, etc. The offroad obstacles also can't typically gang up and run you over if the first one didn't finish the job. The inertia involved in offroad crashes is probably considerably less, on average.

Closing speed on dirt is generally simply how fast the rider is going, and most dirt riders that gear up wear considerably more/better impact-dispersing gear than most street riders wear when they "gear up". I get strange looks wearing chest or back protection on the street. I get strange looks from wearing armored pants for riding pavement, or even armored full-finger gloves. Even many dirt riders give in to the peer pressure when riding pavement, and don't gear up to the same extent that they do on dirt.

Riding dirt well also develops the skills that help handle a bike when situations, including traction, go to crap. A skilled dirt rider doesn't have to as-consciously think about controlling the bike.

This does not mean that a dirt rider should just start riding street without developing some street skills though. The dirt skills are PART of an excellent base to build from. On street, I think that STRATEGY plays more a part of safely navigating traffic if the bike-handling skills have already been developed in dirt. A dirt-skilled rider can focus more of their brain function and attention on strategy, rather than having to ALSO focus on controlling the bike when it's at the limit, or possibly even beyond. For similar reasons, track days/schools can be good too, but the skills developed there would probably not translate as well as dirt skills to everyday traffic situations, with the lower speeds and possibly-wide variations in traction encountered on public roads.
__________________
Some are guard dogs of the flock. Some herders, search/rescue, or companions. We Devildogs are those, and also retrievers. Hell is our blazing dogpark, our frigid swimming hole. The fallen are our tennis balls. We don't leave the fallen behind, even if the master has to bring them home for us. Semper Fi, my friends.
Kommando is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-19-2013, 07:35 PM   #97
xymotic
Beastly Adventurer
 
xymotic's Avatar
 
Joined: Jun 2008
Location: Federal Way, WA
Oddometer: 8,366
Quote:
Originally Posted by dom1104 View Post
I am not going to buy my kids a street bike ever, but they will have an assortment of dirt bikes.

After they are out of the house, they can do what they want.

But 16 year olds can barely drive a car, let alone a bike.
Yeah, it's a tough question if you're being honest about it. I'd say it depends on the kid. I'm 44 RE-started riging about 6 years ago.

I think I have OK judgement most of the time, but man I'm a hooligan on a bike. There's NO WAY I would have survived in my teens or twenties.

If you start them young and teach the diff between a track and street, then MAYBE. If you Forbid it, odds are about 100% they'll get one when they move out @ 21 or whatever so that's not a good plan either.

I think you just gotta be honest and talk to them about it in depth.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by Just_Sean
Oh for ***k's sake Aaron. Please link us to my fascist, racist or homophobic posts.
"Anyone who doesn't take truth seriously in small matters cannot be trusted in large ones either."
Albert Einstein


Baja trip to the tip
6:10 to Yuma
trials and tribulations in the Mojave
Baja Blitz Yard sale
View Current Location via Spot Tracker
xymotic is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-19-2013, 09:43 PM   #98
xymotic
Beastly Adventurer
 
xymotic's Avatar
 
Joined: Jun 2008
Location: Federal Way, WA
Oddometer: 8,366
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kommando View Post
Trees, rocks, cliffs, etc. don't generally swerve into one's path, whether accidentally, distractedly, or purposely.
I disagree with this. My last broken bone was because that tree jumped out in front of me for no good reason. I had to punch it with my fist just to teach it a lesson.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by Just_Sean
Oh for ***k's sake Aaron. Please link us to my fascist, racist or homophobic posts.
"Anyone who doesn't take truth seriously in small matters cannot be trusted in large ones either."
Albert Einstein


Baja trip to the tip
6:10 to Yuma
trials and tribulations in the Mojave
Baja Blitz Yard sale
View Current Location via Spot Tracker
xymotic is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-20-2013, 05:52 AM   #99
Earth Rider
Beastly Adventurer
 
Joined: Sep 2013
Oddometer: 1,863
Anyone ever hit a deer while riding dirt? Just curious. I almost got mowed down by one on my mountain bike once.
Earth Rider is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-20-2013, 06:05 PM   #100
Kommando
Grumpy Young Man
 
Kommando's Avatar
 
Joined: Nov 2006
Location: Spacecoaster FL
Oddometer: 6,720
Quote:
Originally Posted by Earth Rider View Post
Anyone ever hit a deer while riding dirt? Just curious. I almost got mowed down by one on my mountain bike once.
I've never even had a close call with a deer on pavement, and I lived a large part of my life in forest-rat-infested Illinois.

Down here, I worry more about feral pigs, loose dogs, cottonmouths, turkey vultures, gators, and meth-heads. I only really see deer around here after the sun starts dropping. I got within about 50yds of a panther about a month ago, riding on a trail alongside a canal right as the sun was going down. I really wouldn't want to run into one of those on the trail. I wouldn't want to run into a bear or any of those other dangerous critters either.
__________________
Some are guard dogs of the flock. Some herders, search/rescue, or companions. We Devildogs are those, and also retrievers. Hell is our blazing dogpark, our frigid swimming hole. The fallen are our tennis balls. We don't leave the fallen behind, even if the master has to bring them home for us. Semper Fi, my friends.
Kommando is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-21-2013, 10:55 AM   #101
corndog67
Banned
 
Joined: Jan 2006
Location: Santa Maria, CA
Oddometer: 1,281
In my opinion, nothing helps develop riding skills on the street, more than becoming a proficient dirt rider. The only street riders that seem to disagree with this, are the ones that have never ridden on dirt. One of the most important skills you develop in the dirt, is getting a feel for traction, learning what the tires are doing. If you can make it through se adobe snot mud that has no traction whatsoever of road, pretty much you can handle anything on the street. Whether its traction in turns, or starting and stopping on side slopes, or taking off and braking, it all translates over to the street.
corndog67 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-21-2013, 12:33 PM   #102
cliffy109
Beastly Adventurer
 
cliffy109's Avatar
 
Joined: May 2009
Location: Spotsylvania, VA
Oddometer: 1,588
As a father of three, I can say that the idea of any of them riding on the street scares me a good bit and terrifies my wife. My youngest is an avid dirt bike rider and the most likely to want to ride on the street when he is old enough (4 years from now). I'm not sure we will allow it until he has a lot of time behind the wheel. If my wife has anything to say about it, a bike will be out of the question and we will have to deal with the hypocrisy of my daily riding.

I think a few years of solid and responsible time in a car will help him learn the rules of the road as well as teach him to understand how things happen in the real world before we let him unaccompanied on 2 wheels.
cliffy109 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-21-2013, 12:35 PM   #103
Süsser Tod
Studly Adventurer
 
Süsser Tod's Avatar
 
Joined: Dec 2010
Location: Mexico City, Mexico
Oddometer: 879
Don't know if it has been said, but if my kids were to start riding, I'd rather guide them than have them learn the hard way or from squidly friends. It's just like sex, I will talk to them instead of having them learn stupid nonsense from their friends. Saying it's bad and that they should refrain from doing it is not going to help.

I know for a fact that when I started riding I was clueless, and all I got from my parents was "you're going to die!". It would had been much safer if I had someone to guide me through the process, I actually learnt through internet forums. I started riding with a cheap Chinese helmet and no other gear, it wasn't until I found internet forums that I learnt about helmet certifications and proper gear.

It actually doesn't matter if you ride or not, if they get bit by the motorcycle bug they will ride wether you allow it or not. My brother doesn't ride and doesn't want anything to do with motorcycles, on the other hand, I don't even own a car! Of my riding buddies, none have parents that ride or that ever rode, we just got bit by the riding bug.
Süsser Tod is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-21-2013, 01:24 PM   #104
SxyRdr
Gnarly Adventurer
 
Joined: Mar 2012
Location: Bealeton, VA
Oddometer: 336
Reading through all of these, I guess I must be the most horribly negligent mommy in the world.



Oh well...

16 y/o rode my CBR1000RR to school the other day since he took it to get inspected for me. He rode his dad's R12RT to school this morning because he doesn't have a Gerbings plug on his V-Strom yet.
__________________
Helen
Mom of Donovan,
a GNCC and VCHSS racer
SxyRdr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-21-2013, 05:10 PM   #105
justafurnaceman
Studly Adventurer
 
justafurnaceman's Avatar
 
Joined: May 2013
Location: Hanging out in VA for the time being...
Oddometer: 801
Quote:
Originally Posted by SxyRdr View Post
Reading through all of these, I guess I must be the most horribly negligent mommy in the world.



Oh well...

16 y/o rode my CBR1000RR to school the other day since he took it to get inspected for me. He rode his dad's R12RT to school this morning because he doesn't have a Gerbings plug on his V-Strom yet.
Absolutely horrible!!!

Can this concern be compared to other things that we get nervous about when it signifies handing over responsibility for their safety directly to them. Handling sharp knives, guns/hunting, joining the military,... going off to college.... any of those types of activities.

Many have already talked about educating our children and recognizing their strengths and weaknesses in helping to determine whether or not they're ready for the responsibility. It does make me feel good that there are some really good parents out there taking care of their kids.
__________________
STILL ALIVE UNTIL I'M DEAD
justafurnaceman is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Share

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

.
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump


Times are GMT -7.   It's 09:35 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.5
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ADVrider 2011-2014