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Old 02-11-2014, 09:43 AM   #841
Lion BR
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Butters View Post
I have to disagree with this assessment. An individual's experience IS data. And while I commend you for trying to bring some objectivity to this long debated subject, your test essentially had a statistically insignificant sample size. And at best could only shed light on those particular tires. Clearly, different tire companies have different compounds and different processes. And even within one tire company, they have numerous different tires made with different compounds and I would imagine different processes.

Maybe no tire companies use mold release (even though a poster here works for a tire company and his company does);
Maybe only some companies do;
Maybe it isn't mold release but a tire preservative;
Maybe it is some form of chemical leaching out of the tire;
Maybe it is simply greasy hands putting tires on.

While I have seen nothing in this thread to prove all new tires are slippery from mold release, I have seen plenty of "data" to indicate some tires may be slippery for some reason when new.
My conclusion from reading this thread, including opinions from tire experts:
Independent of a myth or not on need for tire scuffing, only an idiot would ride a new STREET bike or a bike with a just installed new STREET tire, right out of the box like he/she stole it.
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Old 02-11-2014, 11:26 AM   #842
klaviator
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Butters View Post
I have to disagree with this assessment. An individual's experience IS data. And while I commend you for trying to bring some objectivity to this long debated subject, your test essentially had a statistically insignificant sample size. And at best could only shed light on those particular tires. Clearly, different tire companies have different compounds and different processes. And even within one tire company, they have numerous different tires made with different compounds and I would imagine different processes.

Maybe no tire companies use mold release (even though a poster here works for a tire company and his company does);
Maybe only some companies do;
Maybe it isn't mold release but a tire preservative;
Maybe it is some form of chemical leaching out of the tire;
Maybe it is simply greasy hands putting tires on.

While I have seen nothing in this thread to prove all new tires are slippery from mold release, I have seen plenty of "data" to indicate some tires may be slippery for some reason when new.
Stop trying to use common sense here. You'll kill the thread.

BTW, I just got a new tire put on my Aprilia. I didn't feel anything obviously slippery on it but it was only 35 degrees so I took it easy on the way home. New tire and cold temps did not inspire enough confidence to try to erase my chicken strips.
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Old 02-11-2014, 02:56 PM   #843
GSWayne
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Butters View Post
I have to disagree with this assessment. An individual's experience IS data. .
But it is subjective and unreliable data. What does "feels slippery" mean. Does it mean the same to you or me? Is it 10% more slippery or a factor of 2 or ??

Treadless:
Next time you get some new tires, give me a call and I'll bring over my scale and we can measure how slippery they are before and after your cleaning ritual. As enthusiastically as you ride that should be in just a few weeks
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Old 02-11-2014, 04:10 PM   #844
markk53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by anotherguy View Post
You big dummy. Check his profile,especially the part about occupation. How's that shoe taste?

Okay, my bad, He knows how car tires are laid up and made. Maybe they have it because of the finer cuts and the deeper tread along with more surface area to break loose, I don't know, but I guess my one question to him is how many motorcycle tires has B. F. Goodrich made?

The the Dunlop rep and the tire engineer make motorcycle tires, not car tires. They said no release, I have to believe them over a car tire mechanic. I could call my brother who was a chemist at Goodrich in Akron a few decades ago and see what he knew of it since he did some of the chemistry relating to tires. But again, the guys at Dunlop who deal with them, one selling and one designing (we talked about my use of and experience with 60/40 tires and Dunlop not making them yet - they asked me) should know their product.
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Old 02-11-2014, 04:15 PM   #845
k-moe
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Quote:
Originally Posted by markk53 View Post
The the Dunlop rep and the tire engineer make motorcycle tires, not car tires. They said no release, I have to believe them over a car tire mechanic. I could call my brother who was a chemist at Goodrich in Akron a few decades ago and see what he knew of it since he did some of the chemistry relating to tires. But again, the guys at Dunlop who deal with them, one selling and one designing (we talked about my use of and experience with 60/40 tires and Dunlop not making them yet - they asked me) should know their product.
I'm dure that the Dunlop knows their product. As was pointed out much, much, earlier in the thread other tire manufacturers do recommend running in their tires gradually to remove any remaining release agent, or proectant.
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Old 02-11-2014, 07:29 PM   #846
GSWayne
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Quote:
Originally Posted by k-moe View Post
I'm dure that the Dunlop knows their product. As was pointed out much, much, earlier in the thread other tire manufacturers do recommend running in their tires gradually to remove any remaining release agent, or proectant.
None of the quotes from the tire manufacturers mentioned mold release or protectant, they just said to ride easy for awhile, they did not specify why, except for one that indicated it was to remove the smooth surface.
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Old 02-11-2014, 08:33 PM   #847
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GSWayne View Post
None of the quotes from the tire manufacturers mentioned mold release or protectant, they just said to ride easy for awhile, they did not specify why, except for one that indicated it was to remove the smooth surface.

I believe one poster stated that Shinko used mold release.

Oh yeah, and this was posted:




Quote:
Originally Posted by jmq3rd
But aside from that, regarding whether mold release is in use or not, it was true at the date of your precious article, at least with Michelin tires.

thread link: http://www.gixxer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=176572

Response from Michelin:
Quote:
Thank you for your email. We appreciate the opportunity to serve you.

Concerning your question, Michelin has a mold release agent on all
motorcycle tires. This will cause the tire to be slippery in the first
few
miles, but that goes away after the tire is scrubbed in. This normally
occurs in the first 25-50 miles or so. Until then, the rider should use
caution in riding the tire at accelerated speeds. Michelin always
recommends
obeying the speed limits and using care whenever riding.

If your questions have not been answered to your satisfaction, please
call
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Old 02-12-2014, 07:54 AM   #848
GSWayne
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jmq3rd View Post
I believe one poster stated that Shinko used mold release.

Oh yeah, and this was posted:
Interesting that Michelin uses mold release and it was Michelin tires I tested and did not find them to be slippery when new??
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Old 02-12-2014, 08:16 AM   #849
jmq3rd
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GSWayne View Post
Interesting that Michelin uses mold release and it was Michelin tires I tested and did not find them to be slippery when new??

Not really. I don't have a dog in this fight, but it seems pretty obvious that some manufacturers still use mold release chemicals.

I don't particulartly care if they mold release, if the tires are sprayed down with some kind of preservative at the warehouse, if they have armor all on them from the dealership, if chemicals have leached out of the rubber, if vegetable oil was spilled on them during shipment, if the surface is too smooth for optimal traction, if some moron got bead lube on the tread surface, or whatever else. Personal experience is that both cold tires and new tires MAY have reduced traction vs optimal.

I just poked my head in because so many "mythbusters" have tried to claim that there isn't a single tire manufacturer who uses mold release, even though there are clear examples in this thread of manufacturers who do use it. Even if they do use it, is the mold release what makes a new tire have less traction, or is it something else? Don't know, don't care.
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Old 02-12-2014, 08:46 AM   #850
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Here's what a quick three minutes search returned from Dunlop.
Quote:
11 - Run-in Period

Replacements for worn, differently patterned or constructed tires will not react the same. When new tires are fitted, they should not be subjected to maximum power, abrupt lean-over or hard cornering until a reasonable run-in distance of approximately 100 miles has been covered. This will permit the rider to become accustomed to the feel of the new tires or tire combination, find the edge and achieve optimum road grip for a range of speeds, acceleration and handling uses. Advise your customer to check and adjust inflation pressure to recommended levels after tires cool for at least three (3) hours following run-in. Remember, new tires will have a very different contact patch and lean-over edge. New tires, mixing a new tire with a worn tire and mixing different pattern combinations may adversely affect ride and handling and will require careful ride evaluation.
http://www.dunlopmotorcycle.com/info...d-maintenance/

Either way, mold release or not...riding balls to the wall isn't the best approach when using brand new tires.
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