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Old 11-20-2013, 05:00 PM   #601
ebrabaek OP
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Quote:
Originally Posted by guzzimike View Post
I have a PC5/AT sitting in a box in my shed. I fitted it at the same time as the Arrow full exhaust, took it off after a short while and went back to stock ( not the exhaust, just the PC5) The fuel consumption was crap, and I did have it dyno'd by someone who knew what they where doing. I have no definitive figures but at around 120km/hr I used all 36 litres in the main and TT tank in just about 600km. It also didn't seem to make any difference to the way the bike ran.
I will venture out on a limb here, and say that it was installed incorrectly. Could be your dyno guy knows his dyno, but does know how to enable the AT in the PC-5 tool menu..... could be many things, and I am obviously speculating, but mine rocked a big difference with that same setup. Something was done incorrectly I think. My mileage went down 15-20 %, thus the system came off.
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Old 12-04-2013, 07:47 AM   #602
Gaspare
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Well, Erling: here I am!
Finally, I’ve carried out the dyno test with my GS…
First, the setup:
  • UNIFILTER foam air filter;
  • NGK Iridium spark plugs;
  • SAS unplugged (long since, so, possible ECU self adj already over);
  • Quat-D headers (Torque-type, referred to competitors);
  • Akrapovic silencer with open OEM Db-killer (that one without “parachute”);
  • Reflashed OEM ECU – actually my third release by a friend, so far only with dyno-butt feedback;
  • Rear tire: slick-worn Tourance, lended me from the dealer dump to not have knobby one.

First, I’d like to point out the target of my general setup and remapping in detail – or the wish to make a stronger torque delivery, eliminate all the flat spots, and smooth the odd throttle reply; stock peak power is already not that handy in combat mode, off or in tight roads... no sense to take care of.

The test was in 4th gear, with wideband λ installed directly into the headers seat, temporary removing the original – therefore no sniffers, with obvious advantages.
Moreover, the SAS was plied in order to be very sure about possible gate-valve leakage.





We’ve done three launches each % of throttle opening (linear leverage: verified) – so, respectively 40, 70 and 100%.





Now, the WOT power & torque graph.





Since I haven’t any previous test, I’ve asked to the dealer about a comparison…. He shown me several test reports, included a MY2013 performed for an Italian magazine – and all of them are almost equal in quality and quantity, with about 77,… HP & a bit less than 55 lbs.
I wouldn’t put him in an uncomfortable position, asking for one of them, so I digged into the net to find a test with the same bench (Dynojet), believable as per average stock curve, as below.




So, POWER:
BMW declare 83,7 HP (85 CV) @ 7500 rpm
Stock = 77,61 HP @ 8200 rpm
Mine = 80,17 HP @ 7800 rpm, or +3,3% @ 400 rpm lower

TORQUE
BMW declare 61 ft-lbs (83 Nm) @ 5750 rpm
From BMW 11/2007 Media Info Bulletin, with the same numbers of “Unstoppable” brochure, where the curves (with an infinite smoothing to fill holes) are the same of 650 GS!
Pity the curve is applicable only onto 800 GS, so double-bulls§it! …moreover, they haven’t confirmed the mistake about 800 torque value numbers, to be always able to demonstrate their good faith into mistakes.
Stop to fuel the argument, Gaspare….

Anyway, tested stock = 54,65 ft-lbs @ 5600 rpm
Mine = 59,58 ft-lbs @ 5650 rpm (+9%, about same rpm)
The 85% of torque is available since 3000 rpm, as per stock curve – but with more 3-5 lbs on the whole range.
Notice the torque curve is dropping before the stock when revving, that’s ‘cause of “torque” headers - with less HP than possible with others.
Then, the MY 2013 is weaker in torque matters… ;-)
The best is anyway the trend, with no holes compared to stock, as shown below Vs the taken reference (same smoothing algorithm).

Erling, hope You won’t mind if I compare your graph with my equivalent, too.





I’m not able to explain your knobby tire-slip and late rev limiter intervention, compared to mine.
Possible the very-worn-tire diameter effect is more than your slip?
Could be, but in this case there’s anyway no proportion with power readings IMHO.
Notice it’s the only graph with speed; others with rpm.
Then, to complete, the over-rich mixture obtained with my carburetor-tuned dyno-butt driven to an average +14% more fuel consumption… obviously, I’m going to correct the shot, reporting the 40-70 (the only passable one) - OWT launches Vs respective AFR, as shown below.











That’s all; on Friday the last true-trip of the year… Seafood in Genova, with a proper mountain crossing.

Gaspare screwed with this post 12-07-2013 at 08:13 AM
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Old 12-05-2013, 12:42 AM   #603
Gaspare
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Question for roger: from head porting thread... in case of disconnection of
λ sensor:

Quote:
Originally Posted by roger 04 rt
B. The BMSK starts running a Limp Home mode fueling pattern. As a result the injection times for any given point in the fueling table are varied by about 10%. This will lead to inaccurate values in Autotune.
During the test, we removed the BMSK/λ to place the bench sensor... then, we disconnected the BMSK/λ to not heat up uselessly.
This means the dyno readings (talking about AFRs) were affected from this?
Could You give details about, pls?
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Old 12-05-2013, 07:25 PM   #604
roger 04 rt
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gaspare View Post
Question for roger: from head porting thread... in case of disconnection of
λ sensor:



During the test, we removed the BMSK/λ to place the bench sensor... then, we disconnected the BMSK/λ to not heat up uselessly.
This means the dyno readings (talking about AFRs) were affected from this?
Could You give details about, pls?
My browser won't open the JPEG files in your thread so I'm having trouble interpreting them.

When you disconnect the Lambda sensor, the measurements I've seen from BMSKs show that it goes into limp home mode for fueling. This means during normal riding it attempts to vary the mixture higher and lower than its adapted, closed loop fueling target of 14.7:1, in the cruising range to keep the catalytic converter happy.

I haven't measured what the BMSK does at WOT or large throttle angles with the O2 sensor disconnected. But if you rode your motorcycle long enough for some level of adaptation to occur using your stock sensor or an LC-1, I think there's a good possibility that your fuel trims would be operational during the testing.

If you can post a larger chart, I'd be interested in the reported AFR. Somewhere earlier in the thread I showed AFRs from an LC-1 during a WOT acceleration.
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Old 12-11-2013, 01:07 AM   #605
gianni1951
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Quote:
Originally Posted by roger 04 rt View Post
If you can post a larger chart, I'd be interested in the reported AFR. Somewhere earlier in the thread I showed AFRs from an LC-1 during a WOT acceleration.








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Old 12-15-2013, 09:21 AM   #606
Jays-f800gs
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So I've been thinking about headers (arrow) I already have a booster plug, Leo Vince can and BMC air filter.

I've read I need a power commander and I've also read its not needed.

Would I need something to re-tune?
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Old 12-15-2013, 09:26 AM   #607
roger 04 rt
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jays-f800gs View Post
So I've been thinking about headers (arrow) I already have a booster plug, Leo Vince can and BMC air filter.

I've read I need a power commander and I've also read its not needed.

Would I need something to re-tune?
Mike F. At the Beemer boneyard, added headers and more open exhausts to one of his bike a BMSK-based r1200. Ran with a PC for a couple years but took it off and went with AF-XIED for BMW. Give him a call, but I can tell you he's pleased with the results.
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Old 12-15-2013, 10:32 AM   #608
Jays-f800gs
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Quote:
Originally Posted by roger 04 rt View Post
Mike F. At the Beemer boneyard, added headers and more open exhausts to one of his bike a BMSK-based r1200. Ran with a PC for a couple years but took it off and went with AF-XIED for BMW. Give him a call, but I can tell you he's pleased with the results.
Thanks, I read the vendor thread for some more info. Sounds like the easy way to go, know I just need to convince myself I "need" headers. Lol
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Old 12-15-2013, 11:08 AM   #609
roger 04 rt
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Originally Posted by Jays-f800gs View Post
Thanks, I read the vendor thread for some more info. Sounds like the easy way to go, know I just need to convince myself I "need" headers. Lol
Understood! A suggestion ... get the AF-XIED, you'll notice the benefit right away.
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Old 03-11-2014, 02:28 AM   #610
cesracing
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F650 Tune & custom headers, exhaust

My f650 had awful flat spots in the torque curve. I desinged and fabricated a stepped header with a merged collector and a custom muffler for my bike. Our local tuner fitted the power comander and we tuned it. Great results, also tried air box mods no results. Fuel econmy is still great 25/26 km per litre. MY POWER AND TORQUE RESULTS, HP 72.54 @ 7500. MAX TORQUE 57.66 FROM 4700 TO 5300. With std gearing my bike will show 205 km/h.It is great to ride
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Old 12-12-2014, 03:33 AM   #611
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Pics please!!! I've the same problem...
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