ADVrider

Go Back   ADVrider > Riding > Racing
User Name
Password
Register Inmates Photos Site Rules Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 03-18-2014, 06:30 PM   #1516
azkiwi
message in a bottle
 
azkiwi's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2004
Location: Upstate AZ
Oddometer: 9,145
All in all, it seems like a good compromise. Ducati had plainly lost their way, and under the previous rule had little to no prospects of catching up (no testing). This provides them with an on-ramp to competitive Factory status while helping the truly Open teams to keep their sponsors on-board by making it explicit that they are less technologically advanced than Ducati. Remember, some of the objections to Ducati as Open were coming from Open teams, not just Honda.

Everyone has 2 years to get their stuff in a bundle, and prepare for the spec ECU. And no whining. I hope it encourages Suzuki and Aprilia to get stuck in. Personally, I still pine for Team Green, but you can't have it all!
__________________

azkiwi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-2014, 06:37 PM   #1517
mike54
You don't get me
 
mike54's Avatar
 
Joined: Mar 2004
Oddometer: 13,055
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Yanagita View Post
I dunno. I think Ducati had a last-minute sex change operation to compete in a category they wouldn't otherwise have been able to. That didn't suddenly make them better athletes (or engineers). Dorna reserves the right to keep the series from devolving into a complete farce (which is worse than a partial farce).


I tend to agree. I think it comes down to cultures. In something like Circle track, anything you can get away with is legal. MotoGP not so much.
__________________
A genius is the one most like himself. - T. Monk via S. Lacy

Do stand up guys lie?
mike54 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-2014, 06:42 PM   #1518
Closed Casket
Suicidal, but a nice guy.
 
Closed Casket's Avatar
 
Joined: Nov 2004
Location: Pac NorthWet
Oddometer: 811
"Open" class?

I've been a race fan for 40+ years. I may be waxing nostalgic but what ever happened to the old days where anything/everything goes, full factory bikes, any engine spec, ECU, tires, fuel, balls out anything goes racing? If you don't have it, you lose and fix it. All these restrictions, penalties, and panty knots by Honda are just castrating what was great about this sport. Like Pecha, I wish I hadn't already paid my 95 euros (or whatever it was) for this year's MotoGP subscription.

Are there any restrictions for the number or timing of Dorna rule changes that can occur?
__________________
Still plays with motorcycles....

2000 Cagiva Gran Canyon -- FOR SALE! SEE AD ON FLEA MARKET
1980 BMW R100/7 Sidehack
A Million bikes before
Closed Casket is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-2014, 06:52 PM   #1519
wbedient
MoTard
 
wbedient's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2010
Location: North Central Washington
Oddometer: 1,213
I think the rule changes will help Ducati catch up and yet keep them from dominating. I just hope it makes for good racing and I'm looking forward to the season.
__________________

2008 KTM 690 Enduro
My Videos: http://www.youtube.com/user/wbedient#g/u
wbedient is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-2014, 07:12 PM   #1520
azkiwi
message in a bottle
 
azkiwi's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2004
Location: Upstate AZ
Oddometer: 9,145
Quote:
Originally Posted by Closed Casket View Post
I've been a race fan for 40+ years. I may be waxing nostalgic but what ever happened to the old days where anything/everything goes...?
Do you enjoy seeing one team dominate, race after race, year after year? Because that's what you are talking about. I'd bet you would stop paying for that too. If you haven't noticed, absent "rules", the guy with the most money always wins. Under the pressure of Honda budgets, manufacturers and teams have steadily dropped out of the premier class. What rock were you under for the last half of all those years?
__________________

azkiwi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-2014, 07:44 PM   #1521
ErikY.
Insulhater
 
ErikY.'s Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2009
Location: North of you, probably
Oddometer: 2,138
Quote:
Originally Posted by azkiwi View Post
Do you enjoy seeing one team dominate, race after race, year after year? Because that's what you are talking about. I'd bet you would stop paying for that too. If you haven't noticed, absent "rules", the guy with the most money always wins. Under the pressure of Honda budgets, manufacturers and teams have steadily dropped out of the premier class. What rock were you under for the last half of all those years?
Exactly!
(With an analogy to political systems)
A pure capitalist-style of organization means the biggest dick/richest/meanest wins all the tine.
A little bit of socialism or at least a benevolent dictator helps keep it interesting.
Rules seem like a pain in the ass and it's certainly not perfect, but IMO Dorna is trying to move towards a fair system with a level playing field, while balancing the realities of needing to appease builders, teams and sponsors. No easy job I'm sure. Easy to complain about it but I sure as hell wouldn't want the job.

Change sucks and people don't like it, but it's the only constant. It's in all racing and isn't going away. Watch F1 and compare! Especially this year; the whining is epic

Go Cal!
__________________
"Live your own life, for you will die your own death" Roman proverb.
"Know yourself as nothing; feel yourself as everything."-Rupert Spira
"Touratech have nice mounting kits but they want a testicle and half a square yard of scrotum skin for them. They can f*** right off." Frey Bentos
ErikY. is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-2014, 10:23 PM   #1522
Moronic
Beastly Adventurer
 
Moronic's Avatar
 
Joined: May 2006
Location: Perth, Australia
Oddometer: 1,498
Quote:
Originally Posted by Closed Casket View Post
I've been a race fan for 40+ years. I may be waxing nostalgic but what ever happened to the old days where anything/everything goes, full factory bikes, any engine spec, ECU, tires, fuel, balls out anything goes racing?

Dead since '58, when they banned full fairings.



(Although they're allowed on electric racers, apparently. Image linked through from this RideApart article.)
__________________
Sorting out the S4Rs Ohlins shock: click here.
Moronic is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2014, 01:28 AM   #1523
MTN
Gnarly Adventurer
 
Joined: Oct 2006
Oddometer: 103
Quote:
Originally Posted by azkiwi View Post
Do you enjoy seeing one team dominate, race after race, year after year? Because that's what you are talking about. I'd bet you would stop paying for that too. If you haven't noticed, absent "rules", the guy with the most money always wins. Under the pressure of Honda budgets, manufacturers and teams have steadily dropped out of the premier class. What rock were you under for the last half of all those years?
I prefer it to a stale managed system where competition is stiffeled. I have suffered many a year of Yamaha dominance, and each year I have watched in anticipation of what Honda could muster. Now it will soon be little to ponder, because bikes will be either be much the same or the factories will not be able to develop the bike much through a season or several seasons.

I'll just watch some wrestling instead, they are clearer about being a show and not competition.
MTN is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2014, 01:29 AM   #1524
MTN
Gnarly Adventurer
 
Joined: Oct 2006
Oddometer: 103
Quote:
Originally Posted by ErikY. View Post
Exactly!
(With an analogy to political systems)
A pure capitalist-style of organization means the biggest dick/richest/meanest wins all the tine.
A little bit of socialism or at least a benevolent dictator helps keep it interesting.
Rules seem like a pain in the ass and it's certainly not perfect, but IMO Dorna is trying to move towards a fair system with a level playing field, while balancing the realities of needing to appease builders, teams and sponsors. No easy job I'm sure. Easy to complain about it but I sure as hell wouldn't want the job.

Change sucks and people don't like it, but it's the only constant. It's in all racing and isn't going away. Watch F1 and compare! Especially this year; the whining is epic

Go Cal!
Stopped watching F1 many years ago, no competition means no interest.
MTN is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2014, 03:58 AM   #1525
auguzt
4ever n00b
 
auguzt's Avatar
 
Joined: Apr 2010
Location: NW Italy, lots o' wines n' hills
Oddometer: 359
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Yanagita View Post
I dunno. I think Ducati had a last-minute sex change operation to compete in a category they wouldn't otherwise have been able to. That didn't suddenly make them better athletes (or engineers). Dorna reserves the right to keep the series from devolving into a complete farce (which is worse than a partial farce).

Although that sex change hasn't been really last-minute. It was in the air since the "Open" regulations came out...

Anyway, my personal opinion is that Dorna is carrying on this thing only for the show. They know that the more uncertain is the championship, the more money they get. We all remember when was the last time that an underdog won the title, and it was after a massive change of the rulebook. Also I think that when everyone will go Open Dorna will review the rules again, otherwise everything will go back to the "one-team-rules" era. And that is not good business for them...
__________________
My head is my only house unless it rains.
auguzt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2014, 04:13 AM   #1526
BOOTLACE
Bikie Scum.
 
BOOTLACE's Avatar
 
Joined: Dec 2005
Location: Methane Central..(Sth Gippsland)
Oddometer: 3,635
Quote:
Originally Posted by ErikY. View Post
Exactly!
(With an analogy to political systems)
A pure capitalist-style of organization means the biggest dick/richest/meanest wins all the tine.
A little bit of socialism or at least a benevolent dictator helps keep it interesting.
Rules seem like a pain in the ass and it's certainly not perfect, but IMO Dorna is trying to move towards a fair system with a level playing field, while balancing the realities of needing to appease builders, teams and sponsors. No easy job I'm sure. Easy to complain about it but I sure as hell wouldn't want the job.

Change sucks and people don't like it, but it's the only constant. It's in all racing and isn't going away. Watch F1 and compare! Especially this year; the whining is epic

Go Cal!
Go Cal indeed!

Changing rules is a given in this sport. Like we could now be watching a field of basically identical V4 2Stroke 500s. Or V5 Honda Clones. The engineers will eventually build what is a winning formula within the rules.
However, I'm not too sure the present rule makers really know what it is they want, or have any idea what the sport needs...And to be totally honest, I'm not too sure which direction I'd be steering the ship if I were in their position!
But the last few months/weeks have been embarrassing for everyone.....

Just bought the video pass and watched Mugello 2005. Worth every cent!
And to think it was only 2 years ago we were amazed at Dornas inability to present a useful website...
__________________
bootlace
BOOTLACE is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2014, 05:45 AM   #1527
y2blade
Beastly Adventurer
 
y2blade's Avatar
 
Joined: May 2005
Location: UK
Oddometer: 1,328
Not long now.....
y2blade is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2014, 06:05 AM   #1528
sprocketjock
Studly Adventurer
 
sprocketjock's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2011
Oddometer: 775
I'm getting that Christmas Eve anticipation! Can't wait to see the livery for the Yamahas.
sprocketjock is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2014, 06:41 AM   #1529
y2blade
Beastly Adventurer
 
y2blade's Avatar
 
Joined: May 2005
Location: UK
Oddometer: 1,328
Me too.......here literally just been uncovered

y2blade is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2014, 07:38 AM   #1530
farrington300
No wait....What?
 
farrington300's Avatar
 
Joined: Sep 2009
Location: vista CA
Oddometer: 499
Just a thought. If VR does better this year, maybe two wins or a win and more podiums, will you experts out there contribute that success to VR firing JB?
__________________
KLR685
TE610
TLR200
farrington300 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Share

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

.
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump


Times are GMT -7.   It's 08:18 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.5
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ADVrider 2011-2014