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View Results: Which is more reliable for Airheads ... electronic ignition or points?
BMW Airhead electronic ignitions are super reliable. Leave it alone 19 32.76%
BMW Airhead electronic ignitions are junk, replace with aftermarket electronic ignition 3 5.17%
BMW Airhead electronic ignitions are junk, replace with beancan w/points 5 8.62%
BMW points & Condensers are reliable. leave it alone 27 46.55%
BMW points & Condensers are junk. replace with aftermarket electronic ignition 4 6.90%
Voters: 58. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 09-25-2013, 07:23 PM   #91
_cy_ OP
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Plaka View Post
No offence but...stick to points.

"deep into a beancan" isn't. I can go in, change out the advance weights and be out in 15 minutes. Another 5 has it installed and the timing set. Replacing costly parts that work fine is pointless (so to speak).
no offense taken ... got my choice of beancan with halls or points. can't tell much if any difference in performance. points for me .. halls for you .. choice is good.

down to advance weights and back together in 15 minutes is pretty good

for folks like me who would rather not go back in again. one is much better off changing out a 30 year old halls module vs putting it back in .. here's one for $23 in ebay.

according to Honeywell engineers, original halls module are good for millions of cycles .. 30 years later it's not the number of trigger cycles causing failures. but more likely the number of heat cycles that's causing failures.

also called a universal cam angle sensor
here's a few part number crosses:

Honeywell 2AV54
Siemens HKZ101
Bosch 1237011052.
BB Automacao CYHME56
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Old 09-25-2013, 07:23 PM   #92
_cy_ OP
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here's how you tear into your Beancan from the top without driving out bottom pin, which is usually really tight.

remove top plate and bearing support. then remove large clip underneath.


remove side cap and disconnect advance springs.


remove two circlips, then remove three side screws. when everything is free. remove entire rotor/halls module as one assembly.


remove plastic plug that fastens wiring


if you don't disconnect springs first. springs will let go but might get stretched.


don't even think about removing thin rotor without a puller. the el cheapo battery terminal puller works perfect. take extra care not to loose tiny locator pin.


this is what you see after rotor is removed


early style has two screws, later has two rivets. someone has been here before me
drill out rivets and attach new Halls module taking care to splice/solder/shrink wrap wires to same length.


reassembly is NOT the same as removal. remove last circlip, separate center shaft from halls plate. service advance weight sparingly with a light high quality oil. then insert center shaft, then attach both springs while you have easy access to springs. otherwise it's almost impossible to reattach springs from tiny side cover hole.


next insert hall module plate, carefully aligning up with three screw holes. this pic is shown with old sensor.


replace rotor and carefully drive locator pin with a pin punch.


replace both circlips


install top large circlip and outer cap ... use a tiny dab of grease when installing top bearing plate.


Fin ..
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Old 09-25-2013, 07:44 PM   #93
Plaka
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Quote:
Originally Posted by _cy_ View Post
here's how you tear into your Beancan from the top without driving out bottom pin, which is usually really tight.

remove top plate and bearing support. then remove large clip underneath.


remove side cap and disconnect advance springs.


remove two circlips, then remove three side screws. when everything is free. remove entire rotor/halls module as one assembly.


remove plastic plug that fastens wiring


if you don't disconnect springs first. springs will let go but might get stretched.


don't even think about removing thin rotor without a puller. the el cheapo battery terminal puller works perfect. take extra care not to loose tiny locator pin.


this is what you see after rotor is removed


early style has two screws, later has two rivets. someone has been here before me
drill out rivets and attach new Halls module taking care to splice/solder/shrink wrap wires to same length.


reassembly is NOT the same as removal. remove last circlip, separate center shaft from halls plate. service advance weight sparingly with a light high quality oil. then insert center shaft, then attach both springs while you have easy access to springs. otherwise it's almost impossible to reattach springs from tiny side cover hole.


next insert hall module plate, carefully aligning up with three screw holes. this pic is shown with old sensor.


replace rotor and carefully drive locator pin with a pin punch.


replace both circlips


install top large circlip and outer cap ... use a tiny dab of grease when installing top bearing plate.


Fin ..

We gotta pic. of all the tools in action except the pullers. They are just laying on the bench. I don't see how those can fit in there???.


Personally I just pop the pin out of the drive dog. The guts slide out as a stack and you can have your way with it--including servicing the bottom bearing.
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Old 09-25-2013, 07:53 PM   #94
_cy_ OP
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Plaka View Post
We gotta pic. of all the tools in action except the pullers. They are just laying on the bench. I don't see how those can fit in there???.


Personally I just pop the pin out of the drive dog. The guts slide out as a stack and you can have your way with it--including servicing the bottom bearing.
puller will not fit inside can .. entire halls module plate has to come out as an assembly. rotor's thin metal risk of distorting goes down using a puller. a bent rotor will quickly destroy new halls sensor.

flat forgot to take pic of puller in action. but most anyone should figure that one out pretty quick.

driving out bottom pin is another option. mine was stuck so hard, punch bounced off. could have set up a press to get out. but it was easier to go in from top.

good point about bottom bearing but it's exposed to engine oil. a very light spray lube for advance weights was enough.
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Old 09-28-2013, 05:11 PM   #95
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Quote:
Originally Posted by _cy_ View Post
here's how you tear into your Beancan from the top without driving out bottom pin, which is usually really tight.
Cy, any chance of posting a clear bright pic of the bottom end showing the drive and pin.

I've never had my can out yet.
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Old 09-28-2013, 05:21 PM   #96
_cy_ OP
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Global Rider View Post
Cy, any chance of posting a clear bright pic of the bottom end showing the drive and pin. I've never had my can out yet.
here's a pic of pin, still covered by wire keeper. mine was really in tight. pin punch bounced off. could have set up a press, but it was easier to go in from top.
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Old 09-28-2013, 05:42 PM   #97
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Quote:
Originally Posted by _cy_ View Post
here's a pic of pin, still covered by wire keeper.
I wonder why they use a wire keeper if it is in so tight, unless it gets that way over time.

So it is not a bucked tapered pin that I was expecting as used on other distributors that I have worked on that use one to hold the drive gear on.
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Old 09-28-2013, 05:53 PM   #98
Plaka
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Global Rider View Post
I wonder why they use a wire keeper if it is in so tight, unless it gets that way over time.

So it is not a bucked tapered pin that I was expecting as used on other distributors that I have worked on that use one to hold the drive gear on.
No, a strait pin and an interference fit. The drive dog on the can floats back and forth on the pin (pin pressed into dog, but free through the shaft bore). So the shaft is always working the pin against the tight holes on both ends. The clip on the outside is CYA.
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Old 12-21-2013, 10:11 AM   #99
frasermanx
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Points !

I am still using electronics on my R80st. My 75-5 was a pain to adjust points so when BOYER came out with the electronic system I jumped at it and never regretted it -- ran it for 10 years like that.

Recently I used a points amplifier system on R100-7 that I built from parts for $25 --- works very well VELLMAN. Engine runs smoother with electronic system.

I will probably convert my electronic beancan on the R80st to points beancan if I can find one forsale used. And then I will use the amplifier with the potentiometer that someone mentioned that can change your advance curve. The german system is pricey so I will not go that route.

Now if we could just get a DIY fuel injection system that didnt cost the earth.....

cheers

frasermanx screwed with this post 03-29-2014 at 08:50 PM
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Old 06-12-2014, 09:01 AM   #100
patrkbukly
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Is the following conversion relatively simple???

To remove from my 93 GSPD all the electronic ignition stuff and replace with bean can points system?

Relatively straight forward I would think?

What has to come with the points bean can? (plugs, coils, VR)?
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Old 06-12-2014, 09:45 AM   #101
_cy_ OP
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Quote:
Originally Posted by patrkbukly View Post
To remove from my 93 GSPD all the electronic ignition stuff and replace with bean can points system?

Relatively straight forward I would think?

What has to come with the points bean can? (plugs, coils, VR)?
conversion is fairly simple .. if existing points/condenser are good inside beancan. only other part needed is a different coil with ohm rating for points. it would be good to order an extra points/condenser to carry.

biggest drawback, beancan with points came two years only. with everyone chasing one .. they are getting harder to find.

yes .. more maintenance in keeping up with adjusting points. but it's not that hard to do. advantage is beancan w/point is field serviceable. one will not be stuck on the side of the road.

electronic ignitions are maintenance free until if/when it dies. which may never happen or it could be your lucky day ... since airheads are getting to be 20+ years old .. that's pretty darn good service. heck it could go another 20 years ..
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Old 06-12-2014, 10:02 AM   #102
patrkbukly
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Real world comparison

Thanks CY,
yes my reasoning and approach is this:

I have two bikes,

78 RT and 93 GSPD.

They both have been across country a few times and I can tell you that my

RT with points has;
always starts,
weak battery strong battery starts immediately,
21 degrees out or 88 degrees out starts immediately,
always immedeatly when you hit the button,
rarely been adjusted.

My PD has, often had ignition issues,
often not started,
often cold start issues,
if near freezing forget it,
if bike and battery sits 2 months forget it,

I could go on and on.

So I do not mean to open the debate here but rather, I have experimented with 2 bikes side by side for quite a while and I just want points.
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Old 06-12-2014, 10:08 AM   #103
SOLO LOBO
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Quote:
Originally Posted by _cy_ View Post
conversion is fairly simple .. if existing points/condenser are good inside beancan. only other part needed is a different coil with ohm rating for points. it would be good to order an extra points/condenser to carry.
I believe you also need to change the spark plug caps from 5 ohm to 1 ohm.

NKG makes 'em for less than $3, but they require the screw-on tops for the sparkplugs that our BMW plugs no longer come with.
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your bike is suitably dirty. Well done.
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Old 06-12-2014, 10:09 AM   #104
_cy_ OP
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looks like your mind is made up .. now onward to the search for one of these critters.. the green coil has correct ohm value for points.

look on ebay for folks putting up airhead parts without model fit .. that's how I scored a beancan with points for about $30 .. all the bmw salvage yards were wanting $300+ .. tell tale sign is condenser attached on side of beancan mean 100% positive ID. don't worry about condition .. they are all fixable, unless it's missing innards ..

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Old 06-12-2014, 10:39 AM   #105
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Word of advice; hang one to all your EI parts. I went your route on my G/S, drank the fanboy koolaid and all that about how great points were. In the end I went back to EI and I'm thrilled about it. Point and condensers are getting to be poorly made unlike the OE stuff, if you do have a problem points are one more variable that you must work through.

Also....for all the reasons you mentioned for wanting points...my bike did it worse with points. If my can goes crap up, I'll get the motorrad electric upgraded stuff and be happy.

Quote:
Originally Posted by patrkbukly View Post
Thanks CY,
yes my reasoning and approach is this:

I have two bikes,

78 RT and 93 GSPD.

They both have been across country a few times and I can tell you that my

RT with points has;
always starts,
weak battery strong battery starts immediately,
21 degrees out or 88 degrees out starts immediately,
always immedeatly when you hit the button,
rarely been adjusted.

My PD has, often had ignition issues,
often not started,
often cold start issues,
if near freezing forget it,
if bike and battery sits 2 months forget it,

I could go on and on.

So I do not mean to open the debate here but rather, I have experimented with 2 bikes side by side for quite a while and I just want points.
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