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Old 07-17-2014, 03:32 AM   #61
Navy Chief
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Thanantos View Post
No worries, it's probably me.

I was just bouncing off your comment to also debunk the myth of the "revenue collector". Sorry I wasn't more clear.

I guess the only reason I mentioned that I was surprised that you mentioned it is because this topic has never once been mentioned in my LEO circles. It only ever comes up with non-cops.

Sorry for the confusion.

EDIT: Just to clarify I see that we had the same goal. I just wasn't clear about that I was backing up what you were saying.
Sorry it is not a myth, I am glad to hear that is not an issue on your dept; but read the linked article and look at the numbers...

http://www.wsmv.com/story/25149278/t...wn-speed-traps

This is just one example, there are small towns everywhere with the same budget scale from ticket revenue...
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Old 07-17-2014, 04:35 AM   #62
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Originally Posted by 390beretta View Post
Thanantos, thanks for your responses. I didn't mean for this thread to become a dissertation re: personality disorders or anything even close to that. I'd just like some feedback from some actual LEO's who work in the real world. God Damn it!
Before this one spirals into the typical cop threads....Your buddy has the right formula. Older rider, pulls right over, respectful, has his paperwork together and doesn't try to play the stupid card, "no i have no idea why you stopped me". Although I don't do many traffic stops anymore, when I do the attitude of the person will set the tone. Hope this helps.
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Old 07-17-2014, 04:51 AM   #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Thanantos View Post
I just want to bounce off of your comment to clarify something.

If some guy is a jerk to me on a stop he is more likely to get a ticket, but it's not because I don't like him or because he is disrespecting me. Believe me, I've probably been called worse names by better people.

The reason he is more likely to get a ticket goes back to my theory on changing people's behavior. If he is being a dick to me over a simple traffic stop then the odds of just the stop itself altering his behavior is pretty low.
I have no problem with that. It makes sense to me.
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Old 07-17-2014, 05:45 AM   #64
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Revenue from tickets isn't black and white. In Texas, it depends entirely on the jurisdiction you are in when you get the ticket and who gives it to you--state, county or local city. For instance, when you get a ticket from the DPS (a state trooper in Texas), you go to the local justice of the peace to settle up, not the state. If you end up paying a fine, it gets divided up and parceled out to several different agencies. The fine portion is divided up differently than the court costs which have risen dramatically the last 10 years. You really can't state categorically that it is or isn't about revenue. The Texas legislature has taken steps to stop municipalities from funding local government via ticket revenue by limiting the percentage of a budget that can come from that revenue.

Here's a breakdown for Texas municipalities. Without knowing exactly what "Other" is, the only category that can really be manipulated easily and quickly is court fines. I'm thinking other is program funding from either federal or state resources that are short term and change year to year.

Fees 2%
Cable Franchise Fees 1%
Sales Tax 27%
Other Sources 9%
Property Tax 37%
Transfers from Other Funds 7%
Interest Earnings .16%
Court Fines 3%
Permit/Fees 5%
Other Franchise Fees 2%
Electric (KWH) Franchise Fees 7%

Ernest T screwed with this post 07-17-2014 at 05:51 AM
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Old 07-17-2014, 06:13 AM   #65
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I wouldn't think that "revenue" is a consideration for any LEO who actually patrols the street. They have WAY more important things to worry about. That sort of consideration is usually dealt with higher up, if at all, but of course shit rolls downhill.

I would think that mostly the "revenue" consideration is taken up by politicians and legislators, not patrol officers.

Just my opinion. I'm not a LEO. And you're welcome, I'm not a politician, either.
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Old 07-17-2014, 06:31 AM   #66
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Originally Posted by catweasel67 View Post
Question to the LEOs..

Did you ever think, or do you, that your inconsistent approach to ticketing contributes to the negative impressions that a lot of folks have about your vocation?0.

No. The contrary. Nothing annoys the public more than must enforce no warnings policy. I've had more tickets fought and more complaints made because I've refused to argue tickets
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Old 07-17-2014, 07:23 AM   #67
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When my son was 17 he got pulled over for speeding, I think it was for 45 or 50 in a 35. Before the LEO got out of his car my son called me and told me he had just been pulled over. I told him to be polite, answer any questions, say yes sir, no sir and to bring the ticket home with him.

A few minutes later I get another phone call, it was the LEO telling me that he had just pulled my son over for speeding. I explained that I already knew that because my son had just called me. He was surprised and said that was the first time that had happened. He explained that he usually calls the parents of kids his age because he knows we are the ones paying the insurance and this give us a chance to correct his behavior. He told me where my son was pulled over and the concerns of going too fast in that area. I told him that I appreciated that he took time to make the call and thanked him for calling.

My son got off with a warning and we got to talk about his driving habits. I believe that this LEO’s action went a lot farther in getting my son to respect speed limits than just handing him a ticket.

I don’t know if this helps answer your question about how your buddy gets out of tickets but I think this shows it depends a lot on the LEO that pulls him over.
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Old 07-17-2014, 08:00 AM   #68
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While we are on the subject parents should reconsider having hard and fast curfews with their teenagers.

Over the years I have pulled over more kids traveling outrageous speeds 5 min before or after their curfews.

I always gave my kids a flexible curfew hoping they would drive responsibly.
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Old 07-17-2014, 08:37 AM   #69
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Originally Posted by Thanantos View Post

That being said here is my (and most police officers I know) philosophy on every traffic stop, "What is the minimum level of enforcement necessary to affect this drivers behavior?"
That's very refreshing

Along those lines I got pulled over on I69 somewhere east of Lansing. Maybe it was you?

It was 1am and I was headed towards Toronto for work. I had been in Wisconsin visiting a friend and my boss had called me asking if I could get to Toronto a day earlier than expected.

I was running around 85 in a 70. Nobody else on the road...well except for the officer. He noticed my out of state license and asked if I was headed home, which gave me an opportunity to tell him about my boss asking me to get to Toronto a day earlier and explaining why I was running I69 at 1am.

He gave me a warning and told me that there were lots of deer out at night and advised I keep my speed down. I was very happy to not have a ticket and happily took the advice and kept it down the rest of the way.

Come to think of it, my last 4 stops have been warnings. I must be getting old!
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Old 07-17-2014, 08:55 AM   #70
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Revenue:

In my lovely Commonwealth, 50% of the ticket revenue goes to the State, the other 50% to the town's general fund.

An individual officer or department will never see any "benefit" from citation money.

(Unless the Chief uses increased crime/violations to argue for a larger budget... but he or she could just as easily argue the opposite, that increased budget is needed for more enforcement.)


I love traffic stops because it's a way to find the "real" criminals. Everyone complains about "chicken shit" stops, but how else do you think we manage to find the lbs of drugs, the back seat of stolen goods, or the individuals with warrants? Hell, Timothy McVeigh was caught because of a simple motor vehicle stop (and a sharp Trooper).

A much older and much wiser Officer once pointed out to me that the one weak link in all criminal operations is that they still have to get from one place to another. Every crime boss, every gang banger, every rapist... they all end up in a car at some point. Those illegal turns, those failures to signal, those 8mph over the speed limit.... that's an opportunity to start a conversation and do the "real" police work... sometimes the only opportunity.



But then there are traffic cops... those guys are just jerks.


;)
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Old 07-17-2014, 11:51 AM   #71
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That's Ashland for ya. Not exactly a tiny town, but not a huge one either.


RIP Smoky Pig! (a restaurant, not a cop joke )
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Old 07-17-2014, 02:29 PM   #72
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Surgeons aren't doctors?
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Old 07-17-2014, 02:32 PM   #73
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All surgeons are doctors, but not all doctors are surgeons I guess. They must be classifying doctors as general practitioners.
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Old 07-17-2014, 02:41 PM   #74
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All surgeons are doctors, but not all doctors are surgeons I guess. They must be classifying doctors as general practitioners.

My experience has been that artists, beauticians and nurses are the craziest people who have ever walked the face of the earth, but I'm steering this thread into the batshit crazy thread.

I won't mention the LEO aspect in order to avoid banned camp.
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Old 07-17-2014, 03:05 PM   #75
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I have met the lunatic cop and lately the reasonable one(s).

Having no points for a long time helps. Being polite helps. Admitting fault helps. Having everything in order helps.

That being said, when I ran into the lunatic cop(Brett Seekatz, do a search), he tried to accuse me of running away from him on a 49cc scooter as I pulled into a parking lot to let the parade behind me get up a hill where I was slowing traffic.

They have cameras on the patrol vehicles and he parked very far behind me. Asked quietly why was I trying to evade him. I laughed in this loser's face and asked if he was insane.

One would hope he is off of the force already or filing paperwork in a dungeon. I had a very sour taste for law enforcement after that. When you get taken to jail because an officer decides to manipulate or coerce you into a false confession, fuck that.

Regarding revenue, there was a recent state that had to stop using citation quotas. I am too lazy to search for it. They do exist.
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