SCAM ALERT: I'll never do business with docwyte again!

EDIT: I had an "unusual" transaction go bad with another inmate here and I posted about it. Since then Doc and I have communicated via email and Doc has been both apologetic and helpful. I think I've found another jacket and with Doc's help I'm going to just buy that one.
It's a little bit older and more worn than the one he was going to sell me, but it will give me that instant street-cred look that only money can buy.

I was going to go in here and edit or reword some of my posts, but stuff has been quoted and re-quoted enough that it's pointless. It is what it is. We got sideways, but now we've got it squared away.

I just had a very unpleasant business transaction with Rockies inmate docwyte that I should warn people about.

Doc had an item for sale on the FleaMarket about a week and a half ago. I wanted it and sent him a PM right away. Then I went to the FleaMarket thread and posted "PM sent".

He and I began a PM negotiation that lasted a couple of days. Last Wednesday we agreed on a price and who would pay for shipping and everything. We had a deal in writing, no if and or buts about it. He even tells me he's glad to see the item go to a local inmate. I sent him full payment via Paypal but didn't get any email back from him. So the next day I sent him an email confirming payment and repeating my shipping address, etc. Standard stuff. .

Then I notice that I have a Paypal refund from him for the full amount with no explanation. Several days pass. No email from him, no package arrives at my door.

Tonight I get an email from him saying basically "I got your money, but then the day after I got your money another inmate made me a better offer and I'm selling it to him instead. I hope you understand, it was an honest mistake".

Dude, you're being very un-dude

F- it, let's go bowling.

I've apologized profusely to Ben. I got paid by Ben and another inmate basically at the same time. I refunded Ben's money the same day I got it.

I've asked Ben how I can help get him another coat and I'm waiting to hear his reply.

Bad business. I followed this thread for several days, going so far as to go a BMW dealer and trying a suit on in the same size. Glad now it did not fit. But something about this thread made me curious, so I read back thru all of the OP posts and came to a post where it is said that he got such a good deal on the suit ( bought used here ) he paid only a little more for it than he did a pair of new boots he got on sale for $ 450 from a local bike shop. Well, what goes around usually comes around...........no matter what the difference in final price was, you don't want to loose your cred here, and certainly you don't want to loose cred in your own home state.

Docwyte's an honest guy; I think you're blowing it out of proportion Ben.

No, I listed the jacket/pants for less than I paid for it and took less than I paid for it. So I paid that forward.

I've apologized and offered to help Ben. It's up to him whether he accepts either.


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What does "basically the same time" mean? Did you accept the first payment or the second? A deal is a deal and I can see how some would consider it bad form to accept one offer and give the guy payment info, then accept a second offer and give another person payment info knowing that you already had a done deal... I also understand wanting to get as much for an item as you can get, but I'd have to say again, a deal is a deal...

It kind of reminds me of a craigslist deal I got the shaft on one time. The seller and I had agreed on a price for a truck and a time for me to come get it at his house. I showed up at his house, 3 hours away from my house, and he had sold the truck out from under me while I was driving there.

I find it decidedly dishonest to negotiate with a man, accept his offer, take his money (all the while negotiating with a different man for a different price), then after the money from the first guy arrives, to change your mind and go with the second guy after all.

Doc told me in his "apology" email that my money did indeed arrive first. I sent it to him the second he and I agreed to a price and to me picking up the cost of shipping. That means (according to his own words) that after we agreed and after my money arrived, he was still negotiating with another guy and took that guy's money as well, then went with the highest bidder. Maybe that seems honest to you. To me it is the very definition of dishonest. The honest thing to do would to have been to tell the 2nd guy "I'm sorry, there was another guy in line ahead of you that I struck a deal with and we agreed on a price and he already sent me the money. I'd like to do business with you, but I'm a man of my word and I've already made my deal and I'm refunding your paypal account." But no, instead, he lets it be known that his integrity is for sale to the highest bidder, his word means nothing and instead of refunding the other guy's money, he does business with him and refunds my money even though we had a deal and I got in first. It's a shitty way to do business. If you want to deal with him, be my guest.

Also, his "apology" letter consisted of him saying "I hope you understand, it was an honest mistake". That is not an apology, that is a twisted rationalization.

The he gives me a vague "what can I do to make it right?" email.

Well, for starters you can get me a BMW Rallye 3 jacket in my size for the price we agreed to and in the condition we agreed to.

You're right, he's a tool... simple as that. You've said your piece, time to move on. NOTHING YOU can do to change anything and it's doubtful HE is going to make anything right except his pocketbook.

I sold my 2002 GS last year for a good price. First guy got the bike. I had at least 3 offers for more money. A deal is a deal and I can sleep at night.

A man is only as good as his word. Obviously yours isn't worth a shit...

Gerg

Also, Dude, scammer is not the preferred nomenclature. Reneger, please.

Good man.

Then you got that whole cowboy thing going on,a few laughs,a couple beers and some burgers from the In and Out. After the ah, What Have You, of course.

Dude,do you have to use so many cuss words?

I hated to see Donnie go like that.

Just as long as you dont treat objects like women,or have a beverage involved.

These aren't the guys who built the railroads, VX0Knots....

Some of you guys seem to understand - that jacket would have really tied the room together.

You want a toe? I can get you a toe, believe me. There are ways, Dude. You don't wanna know about it, believe me.

Ok, let's just get them all out there at once...

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Effing carpet pisser.

It's pretty simple
break a deal - face the wheel

Had the same thing happen to me with inmate Tbob--search JM for the train wreck.

Good for you calling him out. A man's word is good or it isn't.

If he agreed to the deal, you had a deal. Anything after the fact is just proving he fucked up.

A deal is a deal. That much I think we can all agree on.

But that's an egregiously fucking simplistic way to view transactions on ADV or any other site like it. The trouble is that identifying the exact point in time when a deal has been reached is far more difficult that it sounds. Every buyer who thinks they reached a "deal" has a different perspective, a perspective that is necessarily colored by a completely one-sided view of the transaction.

Meanwhile a seller is juggling competing discussions and offers and lowballs and trade proposals from multiple potential buyers, and until one of those buyers coughs up the clams, the seller has no way to know which potential buyer might actually complete the transaction, and which ones are just blowing smoke. Sadly, potential buyers who aren't serious are a dime a dozen, and sellers have no way to sort the wheat from the chaff until someone delivers the money.

It has become such a recurring problem that I've lost patience, and I simply won't offer items for sale on ADV or any other forum like it. I'd rather throw shit away or sell it to strangers, because threads like this have become far too common. Until you're juggling the seller's thread responses, his email inbox, his phone messages and PMs, you just don't know what the fuck you're talking about.

But go ahead and pile on some more, because a deal is a deal. .


Meanwhile, twenty other people reading this thread, who might have offered up a deal on ADV will start throwing shit away like I do.