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Old 01-11-2013, 06:26 PM   #51496
ONandOFF
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Location: Shenandoah Valley riding wonderland
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Originally Posted by ONandOFF
I've never got tired of the stock seat... But then I don't ride it like a street bike all day, either.
Quote:
Originally Posted by bwalsh View Post
George, we can only dream of being as good as you. They call them "dual" sports for a reason...
Sorry if that seemed arrogant to you, Bob; it wasn't meant to be.
It's simply a matter of "different strokes for different folks". My point was that if I don't stay on the seat all day, it doesn't get to my butt the way riding a bike on the street does.

But... if you are seriously dreaming about getting better at dirt riding (I know I always do!), come on down and we'll do some forest riding. I've learned a lot getting pointers from others and have also taught many pointers to others.

Quote:
Originally Posted by AZ TOM View Post
Now thats downright
With this powerful endorsement, maybe you should start with open mic comedy nights, Bob!
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Let's ride!!! - No offense, but there've been a lot of people over time who were just as sure, yet got it wrong. - Una necedad, aunque la repitan millones de bocas, no deja de ser una necedad. - "you know that I could have me a million more friends and all I'd have to lose is my point of view" (Prine)

ONandOFF screwed with this post 01-11-2013 at 06:33 PM Reason: tom's comment
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Old 01-11-2013, 06:48 PM   #51497
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brown Falcon View Post
...Current jets are 55/158. ... I'm thinking I need to go back down to a 52 pilot. ...
I believe that's unlikely, BF. Have you checked the float level?
Are you able to tell if it runs rich at idle and slight throttle, or rich at heavy throttle?
Based on my experience, if you had to lean it some, it would be in the main. Un-shimming the needle might just do the trick... that worked for me.
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Let's ride!!! - No offense, but there've been a lot of people over time who were just as sure, yet got it wrong. - Una necedad, aunque la repitan millones de bocas, no deja de ser una necedad. - "you know that I could have me a million more friends and all I'd have to lose is my point of view" (Prine)
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Old 01-11-2013, 07:46 PM   #51498
Sierra Thumper
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brown Falcon View Post
Still trying to get my air/fuel/jetting figured out. Dave's Mod, de-smogged, de-snorkeled, K&N (which will hopefully be gone soon), and XR600 muffler.Current jets are 55/158. The exhaust smells TERRIBLY rich, and my plug is dark. I started at 2.5 turns out when I put the jets in and went down as far as 2 turns out and the plug was still dark.

Today I tried what Spud suggested for setting the mixture screw. Engine at operating temp, turned the screw in slowly until the idle dropped, then back out until the idle smoothed out. Doing that the idle didn't drop until about 1/2 a turn out and smoothed back out at 1 turn out.

As much I don't want to take the carb back apart, I'm thinking I need to go back down to a 52 pilot.



I'm at about 300ft, but surrounded by mountains, and I've got a 55 pilot and it seems to be very rich. Dave's Mod, de-smogged, de-snorkeled, K&N (which will hopefully be gone soon), and XR600 muffler.
One thing I've learned over the years is that its a guys nature to always want to jet rich.....to us richer means more power, and we want ALL the power we can get, so we often get that urge to go bigger so we won't feel like we're leaving anything on the table, and we can sleep well at night.
I'm guilty of that myself over the years with many of my own bikes.....my latest was my hayabusa, When I added the BMC filter, yoshi full exhaust, and the fuel injection programmer, I had the injection too rich because, being a guy, I sure as heck wasn't going to give up any power Once I tried the recommended settings from the programmer manufacturer (which of course I figured were too lean for MY bike ) I suddenly gained a BIG jump in power, my mpg went WAY up, and my bike no longer smelled like fuel and turned the pipe black. It now runs unbelieveably good
What I'm trying to say is if your bike is telling you its too rich, jet it down some. There's no need to try and have as big or bigger jets than the next guy, when it comes to jetting bigger really isn't always better. If you want a crisp, snappy throttle with good pull all the way up, you want it close to the optimum jetting. A tiny bit rich for an air-cooled motor doesn't hurt, but too rich will take a crisp, snappy bike and turn it into a sluggish, lazy feeling performer, not to mention kill your mileage.

And remember, the pilot only controls the lower part of the throttle and off idle performance, the needle controls the midrange, and the main jet is upper midrange to wot. And unless you do a wide open throttle chop plug reading, for typical riding the upper part of the plug porcelain that you can see will be showing you your part throttle/pilot jet reading. Take a flashlight and look down into the plug, use a magnifying glass if need be....a good ways down on the porcelain where the color changes will be your main jet reading.

You want the off idle and part throttle response to be quick and crisp, and ramp up into the midrange cleanly and with no hesitations. Don't fall into the overjetting mindset

Quote:
Originally Posted by ONandOFF View Post
Not really. These guys are all very much alike. There's some explanation for it; it's really not black magic nor sloppy tolerances.

One thing to consider is the possibility that what you see written isn't what's in the carb.

Another thing is that there are at least two different manufacturers of jets for these that I know of, Keihn and Mikuni, plus perhaps some aftermarket manufacturers, and the jet # can mean different orifices for each. When I say a "55" from a stock "50", I'm referring to the Honda OEM; I think that's the Keihin on this bike. Check this out for an example of how they can differ.

What if there's an air leak somewhere, like where the carb mounts or the vacuum line? That extra air could offset the extra gas of a rich jet.

Finally, if these bikes were as full of surprises as women, how could they be so popular???
So true

As far as the jets in my carb, he wrote the part numbers down on the sheet he printed out for Dave's mods......I ran the numbers and they are the honda oem Keihn jets and sizes just as he said. I went over the bike pretty thoroughly when I got it, I couldn't find any external carb/vacuum leaks etc anywhere. I haven't checked the mixture screw settings, or had the carb apart to verify jets tho, so you're right, there is still room for variables.

As you prolly read above, I'm pretty picky with my machines running tho, don't like overly rich carburetion, but it sure runs good with the supposed big pilot, even tho the plug says its a little rich......I wonder how much better it would run with a smaller pilot? Naw, I'm going to stick the header on and prolly cut the airbox and call it good There comes a point when laziness overcomes the urge for absolute perfection
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Old 01-11-2013, 08:51 PM   #51499
ONandOFF
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sierra Thumper View Post
.... There's no need to try and have as big or bigger jets than the next guy, ....
Speak for yourself, bro
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sierra Thumper View Post
...There comes a point when laziness overcomes the urge for absolute perfection
Perfection is the enemy of good enough!
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Let's ride!!! - No offense, but there've been a lot of people over time who were just as sure, yet got it wrong. - Una necedad, aunque la repitan millones de bocas, no deja de ser una necedad. - "you know that I could have me a million more friends and all I'd have to lose is my point of view" (Prine)
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Old 01-11-2013, 09:09 PM   #51500
AZ TOM
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With this powerful endorsement, maybe you should start with open mic comedy nights, Bob! [/QUOTE]

Thinkin about it
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Old 01-11-2013, 09:22 PM   #51501
Mossy-Back
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Location: Corvallis, OR
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spud Rider View Post
The pilot mixture screw (PMS) doesn't lie. However, you should wait until after you switch to the different air filter before you finalize your carburetor jets.

Spud
I'd be going from a K&N to a paper filter, which would probably make it run richer if anything I'd think.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ONandOFF View Post
I believe that's unlikely, BF. Have you checked the float level?
Are you able to tell if it runs rich at idle and slight throttle, or rich at heavy throttle?
Based on my experience, if you had to lean it some, it would be in the main. Un-shimming the needle might just do the trick... that worked for me.
I was under the impression that the float wasn't adjustable on these carbs. It's definitely rich at idle and slight throttle. Also, while holding a constant speed while cruising I sometimes get a small hiccup or stutter from the engine.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sierra Thumper View Post
One thing I've learned over the years is that its a guys nature to always want to jet rich.....to us richer means more power, and we want ALL the power we can get, so we often get that urge to go bigger so we won't feel like we're leaving anything on the table, and we can sleep well at night.
I'm guilty of that myself over the years with many of my own bikes.....my latest was my hayabusa, When I added the BMC filter, yoshi full exhaust, and the fuel injection programmer, I had the injection too rich because, being a guy, I sure as heck wasn't going to give up any power Once I tried the recommended settings from the programmer manufacturer (which of course I figured were too lean for MY bike ) I suddenly gained a BIG jump in power, my mpg went WAY up, and my bike no longer smelled like fuel and turned the pipe black. It now runs unbelieveably good
What I'm trying to say is if your bike is telling you its too rich, jet it down some. There's no need to try and have as big or bigger jets than the next guy, when it comes to jetting bigger really isn't always better. If you want a crisp, snappy throttle with good pull all the way up, you want it close to the optimum jetting. A tiny bit rich for an air-cooled motor doesn't hurt, but too rich will take a crisp, snappy bike and turn it into a sluggish, lazy feeling performer, not to mention kill your mileage.

And remember, the pilot only controls the lower part of the throttle and off idle performance, the needle controls the midrange, and the main jet is upper midrange to wot. And unless you do a wide open throttle chop plug reading, for typical riding the upper part of the plug porcelain that you can see will be showing you your part throttle/pilot jet reading. Take a flashlight and look down into the plug, use a magnifying glass if need be....a good ways down on the porcelain where the color changes will be your main jet reading.

You want the off idle and part throttle response to be quick and crisp, and ramp up into the midrange cleanly and with no hesitations. Don't fall into the overjetting mindset
I'll take a closer look at my plug. It's definitely rich at idle, but the top end feels pretty strong when I get on it. Of course, it might just feel strong to me because the previous owner had a 162 main in it.
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figures...my stud was rusty I played with my nuts a little and it cranked right over
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Old 01-11-2013, 10:04 PM   #51502
mendoteach
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Location: Mendocino, NorCal
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spud Rider View Post


I'm sure you will enjoy your tire changing stand, Teach. Here's another nice video on tire changing by Jay Clarke.


The tire changing stand allows you get up off your knees, and stand on your hind legs, like a man. That stand might be the best $85 you will ever spend.

Spud
Thanks for all those tire changing videos. I hope this tire stand is money well spent. I think it will be.
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Old 01-11-2013, 10:07 PM   #51503
mendoteach
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mcma111 View Post
Yesterday I Google'd Honda XR650l seat and guess what showed up??

My Renazco Racing seat. Woo hoooo


Well, I guess that makes your ass more more well known than mine I bought mine about five years ago and I thought I had died and gone to heaven when I first sat on it. I would love to hear some reports on the Seat Concepts seat.
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Old 01-11-2013, 10:07 PM   #51504
bwalsh
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ONandOFF View Post

But... if you are seriously dreaming about getting better at dirt riding (I know I always do!), come on down and we'll do some forest riding.
Dreaming? Better? I didn't get the memo I wasn't good enough.

I don't go out to ride balls to the wall or race. Like you said, different strokes...
I can get down 95%(or more) of the trails in the forest at a nice spirited pace(for me) just fine.
The ones I can't ride, I'll take my Mtn. bike.


Quote:
Originally Posted by AZ TOM View Post
With this powerful endorsement, maybe you should start with open mic comedy nights, Bob!
Quote:
Originally Posted by AZ TOM
Thinkin about it
You're my best fan!


You're my only fan...
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Old 01-11-2013, 10:17 PM   #51505
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mendoteach View Post
I would love to hear some reports on the Seat Concepts seat.
The few times I've been out since I installed it I never once thought about the seat...That's the best endorsement I can think of. It must be comfy if I didn't think about it!
But seriously it's very comfortable and the cheapest option I am aware of besides doing it yourself. I'll give you all an update after a long ride.

Ullyses has one on his bike. I've been meaning to ask him how it's been treating him thru CA & SA. Maybe he'll tell us.
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Old 01-11-2013, 10:21 PM   #51506
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Talking

loooooo-seeeeeeeee, i gossum 'stalling to dooooooooo.



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Old 01-11-2013, 10:34 PM   #51507
Spud Rider
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 3girlsdad View Post
loooooo-seeeeeeeee, i gossum 'stalling to dooooooooo. ...
I see some Tusk goodies in that pile.

Spud
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Old 01-11-2013, 11:49 PM   #51508
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mendoteach View Post
Thanks for all those tire changing videos. I hope this tire stand is money well spent. I think it will be.
You're welcome. I love my tire changing stand. Except for emergencies, I will never again change tires without it.



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Old 01-12-2013, 12:46 AM   #51509
KyoXR
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 3girlsdad View Post
loooooo-seeeeeeeee, i gossum 'stalling to dooooooooo.



I must have missed the story on the new disk? and how many tooth rear sprocket is that?
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Old 01-12-2013, 02:35 AM   #51510
Barron
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Heated gear

So, I really like the simplicity and cost of my grip heaters but seeing as how I am going to have to add them back into the wiring harness, I was thinking about getting heated gear instead. I know we have talked about this stuff A LOT but if you guys wouldn't mind recommending some brands or why I shouldn't switch to a 12V outlet for heated gear that I could use for a lot of other things too VS. heated grips I'm all ears.

-Barron
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