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Old 10-03-2009, 09:53 PM   #31
gunnerbuck
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Probably if you put the assembled bearing/shaft/seal combo and threw it in the freezer overnight and then warmed the pump body it would slide in with little force....
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Old 10-04-2009, 07:37 AM   #32
yosso
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gunnerbuck
Probably if you put the assembled bearing/shaft/seal combo and threw it in the freezer overnight and then warmed the pump body it would slide in with little force....
That's what I'm going to try (once I get the new seals). Use a heat gun to warm up the housing and perhaps get a bit of dry ice to chill the shaft/bearing/seal assembly.

I was using a rubber mallet and a 17mm 1/2" drive Craftsman socket to motivate the shaft assembly into the housing. I've been wanting to get a small press, perhaps I'll stop by HF after church and see what they've got in stock.

I would install the shaft, and then finding it too hard to rotate, thus I would pop it back out and reinstall the shaft. I finally noticed that the circle spring from one side of the seal sitting meekly on the floor. That was the second seal, the last I had in my possession, so I gave up for the night and went to whine on the internet.
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Old 10-04-2009, 12:38 PM   #33
gunnerbuck
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Like dhally said, the shaft is very hard to turn when the pump is assembled... The 2 lip seals create quite a bit of drag....
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Old 10-04-2009, 04:17 PM   #34
yosso
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gunnerbuck
Like dhally said, the shaft is very hard to turn when the pump is assembled... The 2 lip seals create quite a bit of drag....
The original pump didn't feel all that difficult to spin, but it was seeping slightly, so I suppose the seal was shot.

I did pickup the small arbor press at HF this afternoon, and will try installing the seal and shaft as an assembly. I shall report back once it's back together (hopefully this week sometime).

M.
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Old 10-31-2009, 12:11 AM   #35
666
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Today I discovered this leak, well very small leak.


Coolant looks clean, oil looks fine. I guess just one side leaks? I had it on my bmw F 650, except that it leaked a lot. Anyhow, it took almost 10 years and 22 kmiles to get it leaking.
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Old 10-31-2009, 01:11 AM   #36
gunnerbuck
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 666
Today I discovered this leak, well very small leak.


Coolant looks clean, oil looks fine. I guess just one side leaks? I had it on my bmw F 650, except that it leaked a lot. Anyhow, it took almost 10 years and 22 kmiles to get it leaking.
It's your lucky day as the leak in your picture looks to be coming from the thermostat seal which only requires removal of the 2 Allen screws in the picture and a replacement O-ring to fix...
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Old 10-31-2009, 10:46 AM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gunnerbuck
It's your lucky day as the leak in your picture looks to be coming from the thermostat seal which only requires removal of the 2 Allen screws in the picture and a replacement O-ring to fix...
Cool. I spend about an hour trying to understand how water pump seal failure can cause this leak.
On other bikes it's designed to show that the water pump seal is busted.
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Old 10-31-2009, 11:48 PM   #38
gunnerbuck
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Yeah, that leak is a long ways from the water pump.... If you look on the opposite side of the cylinder head you will see where the plumbing connects into the pump/impeller housing....
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Old 11-01-2009, 01:04 AM   #39
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666,
Still you better do the pump this winter. You are at the time and mileage where it can't be trusted. Neither can the cam followers. Rebuild time for you. IMHO. Gunner knows more. I just did mine for the third time at 37K miles. One seal was leaking, the bearings were solid. I pop the bearing seals and add extra grease when I rebuild. I never loctited a shaft seal, in fact I grease them to get them to go in and grease the lips. Greasy lips on the shaft....
bill
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bmwktmbill screwed with this post 11-01-2009 at 01:11 AM
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Old 11-01-2009, 07:38 AM   #40
666
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What winter? We don't have it here.

I have parts on hand and would do rebuild sometimes in the near future.
My former bmw blew 5 sets of seals in 20 k miles. All done under warranty, really annoying.
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Old 11-01-2009, 10:58 PM   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 666
What winter? We don't have it here.

I have parts on hand and would do rebuild sometimes in the near future.
My former bmw blew 5 sets of seals in 20 k miles. All done under warranty, really annoying.
Sorry about no winter, 20 degrees here tonight under a full moon.
They thing I hate about the KTM WP rebuild is that the shaft
usually has to be replaced. I have two myself. I am looking for a replater. Seems to me they could be rehabed for half of new...know any place that could handle it?
bill
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Old 01-03-2010, 08:05 AM   #42
elvo
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LC4 Pilot
Here’s a less than clear piece of instruction quoted from the English version of the KTM Factory Engine Manual:

“Properly lubricate new grooved bearings, and press in to stop with the open sides facing each to them.”

I have a few “issues” with that line of instruction. First of all, the bearings specified are sealed bearings, with identical sides. There are no “open” sides at all. So there’s no lubricating to be done, and no particular orientation to adhere to during installation. Perhaps the original bearings have been superseded at some point as Creeper has suggested might be the case.
That line of instruction actually makes sense when you translate it back into German, word for word. And if the bearings are only sealed on one side.

The translation of the shop manual is a bit harsh... but hey, at least it's better than 'Japlish'!
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Old 01-10-2010, 09:46 PM   #43
warewolf
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Thanks for the write-up, LC4 Pilot.

I installed the seal in the pump housing first, as it appeared there is a gap between the seal and the bearings, so pressing them all in together may not seat the seal fully, and leave it too close to the bearings. Can anyone confirm or deny this?

Before installing the bearings on the shaft, I put it in the freezer section of the kitchen fridge for 24 hours. Then I froze the shaft with the bearings mounted for 24 hours. I gave the pump housing a gentle warming and pressed in the lubricated shaft assembly (oooh, err! ) until it was past the first seal lip (more ). The hot/cold differential makes it easier. Using a jeweller’s screwdriver, I made sure the seal lip wasn’t folded over by carefully sliding the screwdriver between it and the shaft. I’m sure one section had indeed caught and folded, but was pushed back in to place ok.
My engineering supplies friend commented that the water pump shaft is probably grooved from the seal, so replacing the seal may not stop it leaking. As noted by a few ppl already . Mine looks good enough for now.
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Old 01-18-2010, 02:39 PM   #44
Geekventure
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Question Same leak on mine...

I have a 2001 LC4 with the same coolant leaking out of that hole too!
Can somebody explain this thermostat O-ring seal with pictures?

Quote:
Originally Posted by gunnerbuck
It's your lucky day as the leak in your picture looks to be coming from the thermostat seal which only requires removal of the 2 Allen screws in the picture and a replacement O-ring to fix...
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Old 01-18-2010, 07:02 PM   #45
gunnerbuck
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Is it actually coming from that hole or the thermostat fitting above?

That hole is a drain for the spark plug well and shouldn't have coolant leaking out of it unless you have a cracked head in the plug area.... The purpose of the hole is to allow fluid to drain out after deep water crossing so it doesn't foul the electronics...
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