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Old 05-09-2012, 07:09 PM   #64036
zdiver1
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Steel Braided brake lines

http://www.kientech.com/GalferWaveRotor.html
Quote:
Originally Posted by ER70S-2 View Post
Question for Procycle:

Since this might interest others, like Notarat, I decided to post instead of PM.
I'm interested in the Supermoto 320mm Brake Rotor Kit.

Do you or your supplier have a matching wave rotor for the rear? I understand it wouldn't have the gold hub, but a matching edge wave and drill pattern would be sweet.

If your brakes lines are stock rubber, I would try the (PC) Steel Braided brake lines front and rear the braking power is so much better, I do not want the larger front rotor but when the time comes I will get the gaffler front and rear wave rotors.

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Old 05-09-2012, 07:38 PM   #64037
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cemory View Post
Maybe you should just put the original light back on and then take it to the dealer. This is America and you are innocent until proven guilty.

Chris in Topeka
Kidding right?
If not, I would never buy anything you are selling.
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Old 05-09-2012, 08:47 PM   #64038
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ER70S-2 View Post
Question for Procycle:

Since this might interest others, like Notarat, I decided to post instead of PM.
I'm interested in the Supermoto 320mm Brake Rotor Kit.

Do you or your supplier have a matching wave rotor for the rear? I understand it wouldn't have the gold hub, but a matching edge wave and drill pattern would be sweet.

Im not sure what it is but I have this.




http://advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=789569
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Old 05-09-2012, 08:48 PM   #64039
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This is the worst of the damage. Not too bad actually. The bare wires are the license plate light wires since the housing on those is what burned up. The wiring harness is fine. I put a new 30a fuse in and turned the battery on and the fuse blew so hopefully that means the battery is fine and the wires are shorting the fuse out. The headlight fuses are fine and the it looks like just the mid section from the 30a fuse box to the green connector under the gas tank is fried. Everything else looks good.






Would a short like this get into the battery?
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Old 05-09-2012, 08:56 PM   #64040
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The battery is probably fine...get that fixed ASAP and don't try turning the bike on anymore until it's fixed.
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Old 05-09-2012, 09:52 PM   #64041
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TRAVELGUY View Post
You have to disassemble the forks. It you go online and download the service mamual it gives very good instructions for the lowering operation. That's what I did. Just moving the spacer to under the springs will not change the ride hieght.
Yep. My reply was a statement, not a question.

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Old 05-09-2012, 09:57 PM   #64042
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2 Years with the DR time for some upgrades.

So I've had my 05 DR for 2 years now. Up until now the only things i've done are minor, barkbusters, PWD rear rack, Kolpin 1.5gal on rack, Wolfman e10 bags, battery tender, skidplate.

I'm thinking its time to drop some coin this summer to get it squared away.
TIres due for a new set PO put a brand new set of trailwings on before selling it. I'm thinking Shinko 244's cheap and decent 50/50

I've tweaked the carb pulled snorkel, extended fuel/air screw, shimmed needle, drilled slide, getting 50mpg. Prior to this was only getting 42mpg because PO put a 2 size larger pilot jet in. Throwing some new iridium plugs in.

Suspension thinking of putting a set of Ricor intiminators up front and possibly a stiffer rear spring. (intiminators seem reasonable $170ish and dont require a more in depth install 'emulators") thoughts?

Gas tank: I like the lines of the new acerbis may pick that up to ditch the kolpin on the back it works but its extra weight high and to the rear.

Seat: stocker is well uninspiring, Thinking seat concepts with gripper/carbon or all carbon

Windshield, would like a removable option to reduce wind blast and body fatigue while on the highways. Thinking either Maier cyclone or laminar lip b-king shield. Both run around $90 opinions?

Fender I think i'll throw a black acerbis KTM fender on the front only $20 a bit stiffer to support a fender bag with a tube and irons and supposedly reduces the wind sail effect of the stocker.

It appears like it will be a spendy summer. I figure it was time to make the DR best of both worlds. I kind of pine for 2 bikes a WR250R for the tight stuff and an DL650 for the fire-roads/highway but i think I can make my trusty DR more than work.

Any thoughts?
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Old 05-09-2012, 09:58 PM   #64043
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Quote:
Originally Posted by goodcat8 View Post
Not sure exactly what it is GoodCat, but you consistently have the coolest, most bad-ass looking bikes around these parts.
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Old 05-09-2012, 10:25 PM   #64044
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Agreed J. Can't believe you're getting rid of it. There is an art to the bikes you put together. No matter what I did to my DR, it will always look like a stick figure with unequal legs.

I checked the ad. More than fair price and if I had it in the budget.....I'd grab it. Everyone needs an extra DR....


Tech23 = great points. I read a lengthy article on airbox design a while back and never knew it involved so much. Didn't think of it affecting the extra vent like that...makes perfect sense.
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Old 05-09-2012, 10:40 PM   #64045
BadDogMax
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Re: Chain vibration video

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tech23 View Post
The reason I asked if you still have the stock BST 40 CV carb on your bike, and if you cut/modified the top of the air box is because of the routing of the slide chamber atmosphere vent hose/filter. There have been reports this vent hose filter that sits right over a "desnorkled" or cut air box opening can cause surging as it picks up the constant changing of positive and negative pressure waves within the air box. This can add to the slide oscillation that makes the CV carb the POS it is. On the plus side drilling the slide makes for better throttle response because it allows the slide to react faster...on the down side this faster reacting slide can make the oscillation of the slide (surging) even worse. This is why many elect to bypass this step in the Dyno Jet instructions.

I think you may be learning first hand why many pitch the CV carb in favor of a flat slide carb that features a direct connection to the slide as opposed to a pulsing vacuum connection.

Tech23
Again thanks for everyone's help.

I have not drilled the slide, but I do have the snorkel removed and a washer under the needle. (All other carb settings are stock and it runs very smoothly, perfectly I'd say, and gets 46-51MPG consistently which from this thread would tell me it's jetted correctly.)

I was in charge of R&D in another life and I know how to set up an experiment, so I guess it's time to get methodical about this.

I'll check runout of sprockets, check bearings, check for any unusual axle wear, check position of carb slide chamber vent, check/replace cush rubbers, and check for any signs of a misfire at part throttle.

I'll avoid treefort engineering.

And tell myself that this is all in my head. If that works that's an easy solution and I'm fine with it!
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Old 05-09-2012, 10:43 PM   #64046
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Ok, this is a good as it's going to get, hopefully somewhat more readable.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BergDonk View Post
This any good style wise?
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Rear-Moto...item460177a4ea



I've got about 30,000 kms on mine now and works well. Seems to be wearing heaps better than the stock one which was trashed at about 15,000 kms

Steve
Style wise, absolutely, thanks; that's where I'm going.

Edit: Just a quick note: most of you have seen my posts. The following information isn't meant to piss anyone off. There's a lot of info and I have to copy and paste to a word.doc. Smilies don't work doing that nor do I have the time to edit a long post and add them. I prefer using smilies to replace the eye contact and voice inflection missing in the printed word.

So if something below pisses ya off, remember that I didn't mean it that way. G'nite

This is about the vibration BDM and I are experiencing, it's long. I've been working on this post since 8pm, now it's 12:15.
I'm tired, sorry for the errors, I'll touch them up tomorrow. And ADVrider just took a hit, everywhere you see a #. There's just too much to fix tonight, come back if ya care.

Quote:
Originally Posted by NordieBoy View Post
Still does it with my FCR pumper carb...

I think it's a combination of power pulses and tight/loose links.
My new chain didn't do it for a few thousand km's.
Thank doG there are more than two of us.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Adv Grifter View Post
Couple ideas:
Are you sure your non OEM rear wheel and hub bearings are fully seated, 100%? Do they fit properly? I only mention this because of the unusual wear on your axle. What would cause that?
You're right, how did that ding get on my axle? I think the bearings are seated correctly. The bearings are OEM from RonAyers.com. Perhaps I may not have had the axle tight enough, allowing the axle to litterally flex. I use a 14" box end wrench to tighten the nut and just before I put the 16t on, checked the 'torque', it was very tight. The ding is just about where one would expect flex. The right side flex is controlled by its short length (bearing to swingarm). If there is going to be flex, it will have to travel across the spacer to the left side wheel bearing. Earlier someone had the rear axle in from the right instead of in from the left. I'll put my axle in from the right side and if I can get the chain adjusted, I'll ride it that way (ding on the right side instead of left).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Adv Grifter View Post
I see you've gone creative on chain alignment ... maybe go back to just matching up the snail adjuster numbers. My front sprocket has always shown a bit of wear on the outside
Good point. The bike did just fine with the imagined offset but I'll got back to the snail markings
Quote:
Originally Posted by Adv Grifter View Post
I DO change my front sprocket every 7 to 10K miles ... no matter what. Really helps with smooth running and saves chain.
I also replace my CSS around those mileages.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Adv Grifter View Post
OEM sprockets please.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Adv Grifter View Post
I believe you mentioned you had your clutch off to do NSU. I would double check your work there, and while in there look for dig marks in basket slots from clutch plates. Look at Lukas' pics to see a PERFECT basket. A worn one would have little dents where the clutch plate tangs sit in basket slots
I've been under the clutch cover twice looking for this. I also have Lukas' pics on my puter. If this problem was inside the cases, the motor would never had made the 10k since this started. Maybe.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Adv Grifter View Post
Something is worn or out of alignment. I doubt it's your clutch basket, but if it's installed incorrectly or not torqued? Then who knows? I hope you torqued down the BIG nut to full spec? Can't recall number, but it's a BIG ONE.
I hope it's not that BIG ball bearing under the clutch!
The big nut is torqued. After MAD posted the pics of the blown input shaft bearing self destructed, I went back in and made sure the bearing was tight.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rumlover View Post
But I had to be really concentrating to feel it and had never noticed it before. But seriously if this is what some of you are noticing you are far more picky then me. I would have never noticed it if I wasn't really REALLY trying to pick something up.
There is nothing subtle about this. But, switching to a 16t yesterday made a huge improvement. So much so that I won't be putting a 15t back on until I get a new oem. I'm not picky, I'm mechanical; actually brought to my attention after taking an aptitude test when I was about 10. Too bad my job was deskwork. The difference between BDM and myself: his DR is 4000k miles 'old'. Mine didn't start until I replaced the worn stock chain with an EK at 22k miles. And since I couldn't figure anything else, I put a new DID on at 27,210.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rumlover View Post
If I was going uphill, or just accelerating hard in general, I sure as heck would be downshifting.
Accelerating hard isn't happening, even maintaining throttle/speed will set it off.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rumlover View Post
But overall it is not a happy place for the motor, in 5th gear with a load.
It isn't just 5th gear, for me it's 3, 4, 5. I'm only asking the throttle to maintain my speed on an incline.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ram1000 View Post
My first guess for vibes is always motor mount bolts, especially in the head...


Quote:
Originally Posted by Rumlover View Post
IIt sounds like something has "always" been wrong the way you describe it.
On BDM's bike, yes. On mine, no.
Quote:
I would focus on chain alignment. You have possibly had a rear sprocket that was not machined properly from the start, as in the bolt hole center is slightly off, causing rotation to move ever so slightly in and out of a perfect circle. Also check overall alignment by running a straight edge alongside of the rear sprocket and parallel with the chain.
I've done this and it is why I run my snails two clicks shorter on the right side. Grifter mentions later this may be the problem itself and I'll return the snails to 'even' when my new 15t CSS gets here from RonAyers. This will be my 4th CSS, two JT's, an oem and now another oem.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rumlover View Post
I have experienced the common lugging vibrations and was able to improve that quite a bit (but not eliminate) with carb tuning. It will never go away with the CV carb.
Good luck!
In my case it took 22k miles to show up. My carb slide and quide show little wear, but at 32k no telling. NO, I am NOT buying a TM-40 hoping it will solve the problem

Quote:
Originally Posted by BadDogMax View Post

In fact, if I intentionally lug the engine while accelerating, the bucking bronco will go away as the RPM increases, then suddenly the jackhammering will start at maybe 50-55MPH, then suddenly stop again at 60MPH.

There is no jackhammer at steady state or at medium to full acceleration. Only with gentle acceleration or slight uphill.

Low RPM lugging would be be basically the same mechanism, except without the added resonance of the chain# So the jackhammering is like a second onset of lugging, once you're past the "normal" lugging you'd get on a BST-equipped DR.

I have not drilled mine, my carb is stock except for a washer under the needle and a ProCycle mixture screw.

I have the same vibes with the 15t sprocket btw.
This may also be a repeat, I clipped the CV carb stuff (although I think it's valid). My slide is undrilled, just installed a .96mm shim under the needle 'no change'.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BadDogMax View Post
I'll add that the video was taken while accelerating from 50-60MPH in 5th gear, with a 14t front sprocket. Not lugging it IMO.

I appreciate all the help and theories. maybe we can solve this thing!
So do I, keep 'em comming.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BadDogMax View Post
The bike has 4000 miles, has always been garaged, and the chain /cleaned lubed after every other ride. I checked for stiff links and didn't find any.

I'm voting for a resonance/oscillation like the Tacoma Narrows bridge disaster we were shown in physics class
4,000 miles; this completely sucks. At least mine waited until the original chain wore out at 22k miles. Resonance and oscillation are an excellent direction to pursue. That bridge is a scary sight.

Tech23:
I think this gets covered again, but just in case it doesn't. There are two rpms involved. The first is from short shifting, easy fix, downshift. On today's ride I confirmed this (posted by BDM): there is trying to ride with the rpm too low. But a skilled short shifter (me) can nurse the engine through this with gentle throttle application and patiently waiting for both the rpm and speed to allow more throttle. This happens at rpm lower than 3400. I rode up Guanella Pass today, starts at 8500 feet and rises to 11.6k I was able to comfortably maintain my speed at 2400-3400rpm in 2nd and 3rd gear. The transition to 3500 rpm (and light load), introduces the 'trigger' that sets off this m-effer (oops).

BDM:
I like that spring loaded chain roller. They were common in the mid 70's when the suspension travel was increasing. The longer the travel, the more necessary chain slack.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Adv Grifter View Post
Are you sure you've not mixing 520 sizes with 525 sizes?
Yes, positive.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Adv Grifter View Post
Your "vibration" sort of sounds like a clutch basket issue. Kind of a low, rumble, not metalic. At your mileage you may need to replace clutch basket.
It's possible.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Adv Grifter View Post
Clutch basket rumble is always eliminated or lessened by keeping RPM's UP. But a bad sprocket or chain acts very much the same. Hard to diagnose.

Chain Guide
Regards the DR650 chain guide and "chain whipping". ALL chains whip up and down at certain loads or RPM's. Ride next to your buddy and keep an eye on his chain. If chain is TOO TIGHT ... then you may not see any "whipping". But at correct adjustment movement is Normal.

Adding the rubber strip quiets things down a lot.
When MADurstewitz blew the bearing behind the clutch, I went back in and checked mine. Since I was chasing the vibration, I torqued the primary nut and clutch nut after removing the clutch to look at the bearing.

About the rubber strip quieting things down: this isn't noisy, it's trying to break my DR in half (only half kidding).

Before you had all the info, you mentioned the clutch basket. I'm thinking if this was in the engine, it never would have lasted the last 10k miles. I also found the 'divot' on the rear axle.

I agree that all chains whip, I've seen videos and feel it's normal. Not too tight, I make sure of that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by NordieBoy View Post
In that vein, look at the top of your chain by the front sprocket when the vibes are happening.
I ride solo and have the plastic CS cover removed. I've been able to look straight down to the chain rounding the CS, but I can't see behind that.

Saying again: This is NOT a buzzing, tolerable vibration. The frequency is as if I had the wrong pitch sprockets and the chain is slipping across the tips under certain load conditions (maintaining a speed going uphill). But is isn't a hard metal on metal, it's more like the sprockets are a very hard rubber. Something like an air hammer with a rubber tip. I feel it most in the pegs, which are still rubber mounted. I don't think the rubber in the pegs is causing the softer impact, if it was metallic, I'd hear and feel it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Adv Grifter View Post
The "Slapping" sound is most likely your lower chain guide. The chain will Whap up and down, making a horrible racket. the white plastic thing below swing arm at rear sprocket.
Mine did this for the first few thousand miles until it 'broke in'. One day I was riding along thinking "Hey, where did all that noise go?" But there was no vibration.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BadDogMax View Post
I agree that the chain and rear bearings are next on the list to replace. My old XL600 had 25k miles on bearings, but maybe they don't make 'em like they used to?
At 4k miles, your DR is a puppy, at least the bearings are a fairly inexpensive check.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BadDogMax View Post
I went on a 150 mile ride yesterday, up into the mountains. It wasn't fun trying to find a gear and throttle that avoided the vibes on ascent, rather than just gas and go. And fun is why I'm on the DR...
Exactly. Dancing around an rpm vibration, trying to keep damage to a minimum, sucks.

Quote:
Rumlover:
The BST carb doesn't like low RPM and can be tricky to get to work properly at low RPM. It can be fine tuned for better low RPM performance -- but it takes a "lot" of patience IMO. Playing with the needle, pilot screw, and pilot jets can help quite a bit, OR DRIVE YOU NUTS.
fwiw: I've been riding for 25 years and I've always been a short shifter, including my 3 YZ Yamahas. The DR threw me a curve and I had to install a tach to show me 'stuff'. Now I understand what I can and can not do with the big single. This took place before 10k miles, 22k miles ago. I know how to short shift and what I can get away with. This isn't it.

Quote:
msanna
If we have the same issue, it hits around 40% throttle under maintenance throttle only, nothing on acceleration and nothing on decel. If you blip the throttle it goes away. I thought maybe cam chain or valves but there is no loss of power, no surge, just a vibration like it's out of balance or something.
it is also not related to speed at all for me.
ER said: Checked my valve clearance, good.

Quote:
Rumlover:

Has it always done it?
When you swapped the sprockets did the speed at which the vibration occurs change?
Is it only when accelerating or when cruising also?

Carb adjustment is what comes to mind, if it doesn't like certain RPMs.
How about spark plugs\wires? Check connections and condition.

Good luck
No, it started when I replaced the chain at 22k with an EK, rivet masterlink (carefully pressed with many digital caliper checks).
Which is much different than BDM's 2007 with 4k miles.

The rpm is less of an issue than load. And it isn't a full boogie, whack the throttle open. It's only when gently rolling on the throttle maintaining speed on an incline, above 3500 rpm. As speed increases, so does the trigger rpm.

I'd hoped my Iridiums (?) would last the rest of the DR's life, but I will replace them. Found this in my notes: 5-4-10 New NGK Platinum plugs at 15,493 There are two high quality plugs, I'd be surprised if both were unable to fire under compression.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Threewheelbonnie View Post
"BTW, I don't do style. It's a dirt bike, not some girlie dress-up thing." -

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Old 05-09-2012, 11:06 PM   #64047
BadDogMax
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ER70S-2 View Post


This is about the vibration BDM and I are experiencing, it's long. I've been working on this post since 8pm, now it's 11:30. .....etc......etc........etc............etc.. ........
ER70S-2, that is the mother of all posts!
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Old 05-09-2012, 11:18 PM   #64048
ER70S-2
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I'll make it readable tomorrow.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Threewheelbonnie View Post
"BTW, I don't do style. It's a dirt bike, not some girlie dress-up thing." -
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Old 05-09-2012, 11:39 PM   #64049
Escaped
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ER70S-2, You are using the stock bolt down and not the jesus clip on the front sprocket right?

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Old 05-10-2012, 07:41 AM   #64050
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More on vibes

Hi ER70S-2,
I appreciate your input and replies to everyone. You and BadDog have put a lot of effort into resolving this and I am sure it will payoff. Sometimes some of us (me?) when giving ideas and thoughts don't realize we might be coming off a little too flippant. Sorry if that happened. I realize this is a real issue for some and it needs to get resolved.

One of the points I was trying to make (from my little test ride) is that "I think" there is already a little extra, but very subtle, natural/normal vibration that occurs at somewhere around 3500rpm. I don't know if it is caused by engine harmonics, piston speed, the balancer, or whatever. For most of us it is not really noticed because it is so subtle and we really don't spend a lot of time there anyway because of riding styles.

I am speculating that it (the normally subtle vibration) becomes much more obvious/annoying when another load dynamic is added like a bad bearing, chain alignment, etc,etc.
Nothing really enlightening on my part (you still have to find the culprit), Just kind of my thoughts on why it happens at a certain speed/rpm.

GOOD LUCK!!!

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