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Old 08-10-2013, 08:40 PM   #79831
zdiver1
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Warp 9

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Old 08-10-2013, 10:03 PM   #79832
ER70S-2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tlmaffucci View Post
It's more like this: If somebody is telling me I can get an extra 5-10 mpg, that makes a pretty big difference. You're right, it isn't broken. However, it can be better. Right?
I'm just another guy on the internet, but I can damn near guarantee that if you screw with your carb, your mileage will go DOWN, not up. Suzuki has the DR jetted to pass EPA regulations and the EPA doesn't give a crap how your bike runs. They do this by jetting LEAN. If you decide to make the bike run better, you'll be putting in larger jets = lower mileage.

I live and ride at 6,000 feet + altitude. I get to run the very lean jetting Suzuki provides as stock. If somebody is telling you that you can get an extra 5-10 mpg at an altitude lower than mine, they're 'stretching the truth'.

With the stock tank, I didn't hit reserve until 160 miles (+or- 5 miles), almost every tankful. 60 mpg on a regular basis, Scouts Honor. I also ride like

If mileage is important to you, check your mileage for several tanks before changing anything. Then check your mileage after you make changes.
Just another guy on the internet.
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Old 08-10-2013, 11:36 PM   #79833
motolab
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ER70S-2 View Post
I'm just another guy on the internet, but I can damn near guarantee that if you screw with your carb, your mileage will go DOWN, not up. Suzuki has the DR jetted to pass EPA regulations and the EPA doesn't give a crap how your bike runs. They do this by jetting LEAN. If you decide to make the bike run better, you'll be putting in larger jets = lower mileage.
If the engine runs poorly at the opening the EPA tests at, the operator is likely to open the throttle in order to get out of that zone. If the carb is jetted correctly, the same motive force can be achieved at a smaller opening, which serves to improve efficiency.
Quote:
I live and ride at 6,000 feet + altitude. I get to run the very lean jetting Suzuki provides as stock. If somebody is telling you that you can get an extra 5-10 mpg at an altitude lower than mine, they're 'stretching the truth'.
You will need to open the throttle further for a given road speed than the guy at lower altitude who has carb jetted correctly for his altitude.

Regards,

Derek
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Old 08-11-2013, 02:54 AM   #79834
Ever Onward
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ER70S-2 View Post
I'm just another guy on the internet, but I can damn near guarantee that if you screw with your carb, your mileage will go DOWN, not up. Suzuki has the DR jetted to pass EPA regulations and the EPA doesn't give a crap how your bike runs. They do this by jetting LEAN. If you decide to make the bike run better, you'll be putting in larger jets = lower mileage.

I live and ride at 6,000 feet + altitude. I get to run the very lean jetting Suzuki provides as stock. If somebody is telling you that you can get an extra 5-10 mpg at an altitude lower than mine, they're 'stretching the truth'.

With the stock tank, I didn't hit reserve until 160 miles (+or- 5 miles), almost every tankful. 60 mpg on a regular basis, Scouts Honor. I also ride like

If mileage is important to you, check your mileage for several tanks before changing anything. Then check your mileage after you make changes.
Just another guy on the internet.

Partially true.

At 6000 feet vs sea level, ALL fixed jet carburetors will make ANY engine run richer without changing anything. Ever note how back in the old carb days, cars and trucks chugging along at the top of Rocky Mountain national park were puffing raw black smoke out the tailpipe ? Usually the ones with license plates from down at sea level ?

The DR is jetted super lean from the factory to pass emmisions at sea level. If you take it up to say 6000 feet like that, it just like jetting richer by simply going up where the air is less dense.

For those with the factory jetting setting down at sea level, its so lean it "surges" at partial throttle openings. This in turn makes the engine ineffecient to a degree by not produceing steady power, I also suspect it makes the CV part of the carb overcompensate as it cycles through the surges.

When jetted richer, (just to the point of getting rid of the lean surge, not much if any richer) I think it may get it into the clean running power delivery area that makes the maximum fuel effeciency.

Remember, Im not changeing jet sizes....just a needle with a better taper and positioning. That and the proper adjustment of the low speed circut mixture screw.
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Old 08-11-2013, 04:46 AM   #79835
Foot dragger
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Low Budget View Post
Partially true.

At 6000 feet vs sea level, ALL fixed jet carburetors will make ANY engine run richer without changing anything. Ever note how back in the old carb days, cars and trucks chugging along at the top of Rocky Mountain national park were puffing raw black smoke out the tailpipe ? Usually the ones with license plates from down at sea level ?

The DR is jetted super lean from the factory to pass emmisions at sea level. If you take it up to say 6000 feet like that, it just like jetting richer by simply going up where the air is less dense.

For those with the factory jetting setting down at sea level, its so lean it "surges" at partial throttle openings. This in turn makes the engine ineffecient to a degree by not produceing steady power, I also suspect it makes the CV part of the carb overcompensate as it cycles through the surges.

When jetted richer, (just to the point of getting rid of the lean surge, not much if any richer) I think it may get it into the clean running power delivery area that makes the maximum fuel effeciency.

Remember, Im not changeing jet sizes....just a needle with a better taper and positioning. That and the proper adjustment of the low speed circut mixture screw.
Suspecting and guessing are how people learn about carbs,I think lots of people throw bigger jets in their DR carb based on what they read right here on this thread.
Bigger is better,more power just like supercharging almost.........

And lots of them spend many hours changing jets to get the bike jetted perfect for the sea level they live at,then a nice ride in the mountains means black smoke blowing out the pipe and a slow bike.

Yet others put 50,000 miles on a DR with out changing anything in the carb and it runs just fine.

Some folks like to mess with stuff till its fixed,even if it aint broken.

My stock DR starts easily in cold or hot weather,runs fine,warms up quick and gets great mileage,the 60+ mpg some get is hard to believe but I guess they have better gas then the swill they sell here in CA.
In the long run I can find way more fun things to do then jack around with the carb on a DR650.
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Old 08-11-2013, 05:56 AM   #79836
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For you guys running HID lights, do you have the issue of when you are cranking the bike the light sometimes will shut off? To turn it back on I just need to turn the ignition switch back off/on quickly (engine won't die, but does turn the light on).

I've even tried letting the HID light "warm" up where it is full brightness with the key set on accessory, but when I crank the engine over it sometimes will turn off/flicker. I'm using the stock H4 connector.
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Old 08-11-2013, 06:19 AM   #79837
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Nope. I have PC's HID kit and never had a problem. I don't know enough about electrical to even suggest where to start.
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Old 08-11-2013, 06:20 AM   #79838
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range & performance

Quote:
Originally Posted by Foot dragger View Post
My stock DR starts easily in cold or hot weather,runs fine,warms up quick and gets great mileage,the 60+ mpg some get is hard to believe but I guess they have better gas then the swill they sell here in CA.
In the long run I can find way more fun things to do then jack around with the carb on a DR650.
I ride between 4,200' & 10,000 plus with stock carb, snorkel removed, with nary a problem. Initially I was disappointed it doesn't pull smoothly at a lower rpm but that seems to have improved. Maybe because I'm generally at 7 - 9k' when torquing up some hill too steep and rough for my gearing. Actually I get surprised that it keeps pulling and has never stalled when I half expect to while throttling down and threading rock gardens on a climb.

Mileage mostly comes in at 48 - 51 though I've seen as low as 44. Early in the game I picked up a used FCR but I'm not about to fiddle with that stuff the way it's running now. Eventually I'll install the mixture screw and an adjustable needle in the BST. If the FCR would give smoother pull at 500 rpm less that could warrant the effort but right now I'd rather use the time to ride than tinker.

If 55 to 60 mpg is attainable that would appeal for extended range though I've only hit reserve on one ride. For future desert rides the margin would be a plus but I don't need it on local rides.
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Old 08-11-2013, 06:25 AM   #79839
Mambo Dave
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I actually do live at 11 feet above sea level.

I bought the ProCycle jet kit, put the needle and the largest jet in, and have been happy up until the point at which I start considering fuel economy.

Now Don't get me wrong - none of what I did was the kit's fault. I chose the largest jet because I really am at sea level, and because I don't think I understood that I may not have needed it. I was just worried about being too lean while trying to push 90 MPH and droning on and on for highway commuting.

The bike runs great, and the original surging is gone, but now I'm wondering if I could go a main jet size smaller and pick up any better fuel economy (without any loss in power, nor with re-introducing surges).

Or do I have it wrong, and I could keep the larger jet (DG pipe, open airbox) and instead should go for one of the adjustable European spec DR needles?
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Old 08-11-2013, 06:33 AM   #79840
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Old 08-11-2013, 06:44 AM   #79841
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Originally Posted by epix1718 View Post
For you guys running HID lights, do you have the issue of when you are cranking the bike the light sometimes will shut off? To turn it back on I just need to turn the ignition switch back off/on quickly (engine won't die, but does turn the light on).

I've even tried letting the HID light "warm" up where it is full brightness with the key set on accessory, but when I crank the engine over it sometimes will turn off/flicker. I'm using the stock H4 connector.
I'm using the HID kit from ProCycle, but using the Shorai battery and no issues so far. How is your battery??
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Old 08-11-2013, 06:55 AM   #79842
barko1
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Quote:
Originally Posted by epix1718 View Post
For you guys running HID lights, do you have the issue of when you are cranking the bike the light sometimes will shut off? To turn it back on I just need to turn the ignition switch back off/on quickly (engine won't die, but does turn the light on).

I've even tried letting the HID light "warm" up where it is full brightness with the key set on accessory, but when I crank the engine over it sometimes will turn off/flicker. I'm using the stock H4 connector.
I have a cheap HID and it does the same. I just switch it from low to hi and that puts it on.
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Old 08-11-2013, 08:11 AM   #79843
vicster
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Quote:
Originally Posted by epix1718 View Post
For you guys running HID lights, do you have the issue of when you are cranking the bike the light sometimes will shut off? To turn it back on I just need to turn the ignition switch back off/on quickly (engine won't die, but does turn the light on).

I've even tried letting the HID light "warm" up where it is full brightness with the key set on accessory, but when I crank the engine over it sometimes will turn off/flicker. I'm using the stock H4 connector.
Yep. HID low beam in a BC Lynx. It's a PITA. What I've taken to doing is not making the first start of the day until the ballast has quit buzzing. I'll have to try the idea of just switching to the non HID high beam and back to low. Checking to make sure the light came on is now just part of the ritual.
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Old 08-11-2013, 08:34 AM   #79844
rpet
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Quote:
Originally Posted by epix1718 View Post
For you guys running HID lights, do you have the issue of when you are cranking the bike the light sometimes will shut off? To turn it back on I just need to turn the ignition switch back off/on quickly (engine won't die, but does turn the light on).

I've even tried letting the HID light "warm" up where it is full brightness with the key set on accessory, but when I crank the engine over it sometimes will turn off/flicker. I'm using the stock H4 connector.
Yes, I have this issue with the DDM Tuning single beam H4 kit. Often (maybe almost always) the headlight will die when I hit the starter.
Since it's the single beam HID, my Hi/Lo switch is an On/Off switch. I just flick that after starting the bike, and the headlight re-ignites with zero problems. The HID bulb has never flickered or died in 6000 miles while the bike is running.

No clue if I have a weak battery or not, but it always starts my bike. I've worked the on/off switch flick into my starting routine so this little issue doesn't bother me considering how bright the headlight is for my thirty dollars.
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Old 08-11-2013, 09:16 AM   #79845
motolab
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Foot dragger View Post
In the long run I can find way more fun things to do then jack around with the carb on a DR650.
That's fine to say if you don't have any lean surging, hesitations or other misbehavior to contend with.

Regards,

Derek
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