ADVrider

Go Back   ADVrider > Gear > The Garage
User Name
Password
Register Inmates Photos Site Rules Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 05-26-2013, 03:02 PM   #3451
Schlug
JockeyfullofBourbon
 
Schlug's Avatar
 
Joined: Jan 2006
Location: put something on and stay in that position.
Oddometer: 7,342
To the guy trying to weld with 7018, It looks to me like you're running a bit cold. Also, try to put a wiggle in your grip as you drag the rod. It will flatten out and widen your puddle just a little bit. I'm not suggesting you weave it, just slightly move the rod back and forth as you're dragging.


7018 should be kept dry, but 225 is hot enough to keep it dry if it comes out of a sealed can. I don't think you're going to buy a rod oven, so just buy as little 7018 as you can and keep it as dry as possible. A Reheat oven-- once the rod has been compromised with moisture it can be reheated dry, but only once-- a reheat oven is 500 degrees. Not your household oven. That rod offgasses. But in the home/hobbyist case, opening a sealed can of rod and keeping it in a sealed rod caddy is good enough for a few days. You might get some porosity, but not the sort you're getting now (which is horrendous).

5P can handle moisture. In fact, it has a certain moisture content in the covering to allow the arc the driving force it needs. We have, in the past, soaked it in water when we were running it really hot. This also works very well when using it to arc gouge when you can't be arsed to set up a cutting rig. It is messy.

This isn't a code weld, no one will be looking at your rod oven log or mill certs.

Do try this: fire up, let the puddle get started, then give it a little wiggle as you drag it. And maybe turn it up 5 amps. Your travel speed is fine, I think, but your puddle will smooth out if you're a little hotter and moving more consistently. You won't have those big 'V's frozen in it.

I assume your dragging it and not pushing it, but I didn't ask.
__________________
"So what makes this protest different is that you're set to die, Bobby?"
--May well come to that.
"You start a hunger strike to protest for what you believe in. You don't start already determined to die or am I missing somethin' here?"
-- It's in their hands. Our message is clear. They're seeing our determination.
Schlug is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-26-2013, 03:14 PM   #3452
Schlug
JockeyfullofBourbon
 
Schlug's Avatar
 
Joined: Jan 2006
Location: put something on and stay in that position.
Oddometer: 7,342
Keep in mind 7018 is an all position rod but you can only uphill it when welding vertically. If you downhill it you'll get shit for penetration and you won't deposit enough metal. 5P is easier to downhill, perhaps the single easiest weld you'll make, and with a couple passes you'll have enough metal to hold anything. Just make sure you turn it up and move.
__________________
"So what makes this protest different is that you're set to die, Bobby?"
--May well come to that.
"You start a hunger strike to protest for what you believe in. You don't start already determined to die or am I missing somethin' here?"
-- It's in their hands. Our message is clear. They're seeing our determination.

Schlug screwed with this post 05-26-2013 at 09:24 PM
Schlug is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-27-2013, 10:48 AM   #3453
Tropic-Of-Canada
Thread Derailleur
 
Tropic-Of-Canada's Avatar
 
Joined: Mar 2011
Location: Location Location!
Oddometer: 845
I recently discovered this crack on my DRZ subframe bracket....I'm going to have someone at work TIG it for me. I'm wondering if it is best to break it off completely, or if I can get away with grinding away most of the material, and doing it from the outside, rather than having to remove the swing arm to do it from both sides.... The crack is not all the way through. I think the tab is 3/16".

IMG_0399
Tropic-Of-Canada is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-27-2013, 11:24 AM   #3454
David R
I been called a Nut Job..
 
David R's Avatar
 
Joined: Oct 2009
Location: In Da Swamps of WNY
Oddometer: 2,420
I would tack the piece in place, grind off old weld and tig.

Not on the bike, there s no access on the inside. Both sides need to be done.

The outside could be cleaned up and tigged vertical up.

david
__________________
2012 R1200R ! 2000 R1100RT (retired), 1976 R75/6, 11 Versys
There is a seat for everyone.
David R is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-27-2013, 11:31 AM   #3455
ER70S-2
Beastly Adventurer
 
ER70S-2's Avatar
 
Joined: Sep 2009
Location: SE Denver-ish
Oddometer: 5,926
I'd groove the crack and weld it. But be sure to wrap a wet rag between the frame and swing arm to sink the heat away from the swing arm seal. Remember; the seal is in the crack between the frame and SA, the rag has to be pulled in snug or you'll melt the seal anyway. I'd use the rag soaking wet, not rung out. The TIG will have plenty of amps to melt the puddle. YMMV, yada yada................

Insulate any wiring that's hiding behind the frame rail too.
__________________
2004 DR650: 62,400 miles
2013 WR250R

SUZUKI DR650SE INFORMATION INDEX
Quote:
Originally Posted by Threewheelbonnie View Post
"BTW, I don't do style. It's a dirt bike, not some girlie dress-up thing." -
ER70S-2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-27-2013, 12:21 PM   #3456
Schlug
JockeyfullofBourbon
 
Schlug's Avatar
 
Joined: Jan 2006
Location: put something on and stay in that position.
Oddometer: 7,342
Don't you think he should weld the other side?

And I'd lay quite a bit of weld in there, it seems that piece might be strong enough for its intended purpose since the weld held and base metal cracked. How about some sort of gusset?
__________________
"So what makes this protest different is that you're set to die, Bobby?"
--May well come to that.
"You start a hunger strike to protest for what you believe in. You don't start already determined to die or am I missing somethin' here?"
-- It's in their hands. Our message is clear. They're seeing our determination.
Schlug is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-27-2013, 06:28 PM   #3457
fxstbiluigi
crash test dummy
 
fxstbiluigi's Avatar
 
Joined: Sep 2009
Location: The Dry side of Oregon
Oddometer: 11,965
The base metal will always crack before the weld does.
grind a bevel and do a full pen. weld.

Or replace that part of the frame, as far above and below the point of failure as practical, and reattach the swingarm mounts. use an insert in the replacement tube at both ends and plug weld. no circumferential weld.

TIG would be the prefered method.

ps. do not neglect the ends of the crack, if full pen weld is chosen. To do so would allow the crack to continue on around the back side, if it hasen't already done so
__________________
The basic question of politics is "Who does what to Whom?". -Vlademir Lenin.

"Politicians are always interested in people.
Not that this is always a virtue.
Fleas are interested in dogs." -P.J.O'Rourke

fxstbiluigi screwed with this post 05-27-2013 at 06:38 PM
fxstbiluigi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-27-2013, 07:30 PM   #3458
ER70S-2
Beastly Adventurer
 
ER70S-2's Avatar
 
Joined: Sep 2009
Location: SE Denver-ish
Oddometer: 5,926
Quote:
Originally Posted by BobbySands View Post
Don't you think he should weld the other side?
That would require removing the swingarm. If I was racing it might matter, but it's only the subframe bracket.
__________________
2004 DR650: 62,400 miles
2013 WR250R

SUZUKI DR650SE INFORMATION INDEX
Quote:
Originally Posted by Threewheelbonnie View Post
"BTW, I don't do style. It's a dirt bike, not some girlie dress-up thing." -
ER70S-2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-27-2013, 10:35 PM   #3459
slackmeyer
Don't mean sheeit. .
 
slackmeyer's Avatar
 
Joined: Jul 2007
Location: Berzerkeley, CA
Oddometer: 3,024
Quote:
Originally Posted by BobbySands View Post
To the guy trying to weld with 7018, It looks to me like you're running a bit cold. Also, try to put a wiggle in your grip as you drag the rod. It will flatten out and widen your puddle just a little bit. I'm not suggesting you weave it, just slightly move the rod back and forth as you're dragging.

You might get some porosity, but not the sort you're getting now (which is horrendous).


Do try this: fire up, let the puddle get started, then give it a little wiggle as you drag it. And maybe turn it up 5 amps. Your travel speed is fine, I think, but your puddle will smooth out if you're a little hotter and moving more consistently. You won't have those big 'V's frozen in it.

I assume your dragging it and not pushing it, but I didn't ask.
Thanks, some good advice in there. Most of the porosity was due to prep, I did a couple welds this afternoon with better cleaning of the metal and got very little porosity. But it is old 7018, and this is just practice.
I'm using an old AC buzzbox welder, so I can only adjust the amperage in 15 amp intervals, but it does seem like it needs just a little more- I feel like I'm putting down plenty of metal, but the bead is a bit too tall and has those Vs. That's 1/8" rod at 145 amps, I'll have to try higher next time. I had ok success with fillet welds this evening, just need practice to keep a more consistent motion and speed.
__________________
Zak

ktm
old bmw
others
slackmeyer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-28-2013, 04:27 AM   #3460
David R
I been called a Nut Job..
 
David R's Avatar
 
Joined: Oct 2009
Location: In Da Swamps of WNY
Oddometer: 2,420
Zak, try just going a little slower. 145 amps is correct if its really 145 amps.

Slower will get rid of the Vs and add more heat.
You have it. Testing different amps to see what it does using your own mind is the way to go.

AC can run a little higher than DC. Good clean ground? Good clean metal?

Spring for some 7014 or 6013, Tractor supply or farm supply has it. Both are AC or DC rod.

More pics please

David
__________________
2012 R1200R ! 2000 R1100RT (retired), 1976 R75/6, 11 Versys
There is a seat for everyone.
David R is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-28-2013, 08:19 PM   #3461
Schlug
JockeyfullofBourbon
 
Schlug's Avatar
 
Joined: Jan 2006
Location: put something on and stay in that position.
Oddometer: 7,342
Yeah, we don't use 7018 here unless it's good, clean metal. In nukes it's all you'll use. Today I had to weld a pipe support from angle that was left outside for who knows long to metal that has been around since 1942.I used 6010, red rod, because that rod really blasts through the crud.

You are getting it, though. Many people who have spent 5 days in a booth can't do as well as you.


I haven't struck an arc in 2 months. Had to borrow a hood. No welding gloves, no welding jacket. I had a pair of sleeves in my bag from days gone by. And I had to do it in an ignorant position. You can work is very slow here. Not just because of what they're asking us to do, but because we're doing them.
__________________
"So what makes this protest different is that you're set to die, Bobby?"
--May well come to that.
"You start a hunger strike to protest for what you believe in. You don't start already determined to die or am I missing somethin' here?"
-- It's in their hands. Our message is clear. They're seeing our determination.
Schlug is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-28-2013, 08:53 PM   #3462
slackmeyer
Don't mean sheeit. .
 
slackmeyer's Avatar
 
Joined: Jul 2007
Location: Berzerkeley, CA
Oddometer: 3,024
Ok, here's a camera phone pic of something I did last night, 3/32" 7018 at 100 amps. There's some undercutting on the vertical plate. Ignore the crappy vertical weld, that's from a few days ago, I keep cutting pieces up and welding them back together.

I got a bit of 6011 and 6013 that I'll try when I get a chance.

__________________
Zak

ktm
old bmw
others
slackmeyer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-29-2013, 12:36 AM   #3463
Schlug
JockeyfullofBourbon
 
Schlug's Avatar
 
Joined: Jan 2006
Location: put something on and stay in that position.
Oddometer: 7,342
Undercut: the most common reason is your rod angle is incorrect and/or you're long arcing. If your rod angle is wrong you will melt the base metal but fail to deposit any metal in that area. You should try and vary your rod angle and pause for a bit, let the metal pile up behind the rod. remember, what's happening behind your rod, in the puddle, is most important. You need to look ahead so you keep your rod in the groove, but those are just glances. You really need to pay attention to what your puddle looks like.


nice work!
__________________
"So what makes this protest different is that you're set to die, Bobby?"
--May well come to that.
"You start a hunger strike to protest for what you believe in. You don't start already determined to die or am I missing somethin' here?"
-- It's in their hands. Our message is clear. They're seeing our determination.
Schlug is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-29-2013, 04:00 AM   #3464
marc-s
photographer
 
marc-s's Avatar
 
Joined: Mar 2012
Location: Zurich, Switzerland
Oddometer: 110
It's not a direct welding question, but as it will be my first welding project - that will come with lots of questions during the process - I migh just as well ask the question here: I'm planing to build a storage rack under the ceiling in my workshop. The workshop itself is very small and tight. The rack should accomodate standard size boxes with 200x300mm. Weight per box will be approx. 20kg (45lbs), the rack will have a length of 2.3m (7.5ft) and depth of 30cm (12inch / depth of one box). See the picture below (the angle bracket will be pointed upwards so I don't bang my head on it; ).



My question: what type of steel (size, profile) do I need for a load of ~300kg/660lbs, and how many angle brackets are neccessary? One very two boxes? I generally like being on the safe side; call me a "prepper" when it comes to building my workshop. but as space is very limited I like using the smallest possible profile. And it also savfes me some cash (don't have a cheap supplier for such stuff near where I live).
marc-s is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-29-2013, 05:54 AM   #3465
David R
I been called a Nut Job..
 
David R's Avatar
 
Joined: Oct 2009
Location: In Da Swamps of WNY
Oddometer: 2,420
Quote:
Originally Posted by slackmeyer View Post
Ok, here's a camera phone pic of something I did last night, 3/32" 7018 at 100 amps. There's some undercutting on the vertical plate. Ignore the crappy vertical weld, that's from a few days ago, I keep cutting pieces up and welding them back together.

I got a bit of 6011 and 6013 that I'll try when I get a chance.

I run 3/32 7018 at 85 amps DC + almost all the time in all positions. Higher amps and the rod stub is a red noodle when I stop welding.
__________________
2012 R1200R ! 2000 R1100RT (retired), 1976 R75/6, 11 Versys
There is a seat for everyone.
David R is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Share

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

.
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump


Times are GMT -7.   It's 06:15 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.5
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ADVrider 2011-2014